Diablo® III

Anyone running 50% CC, 19 APoC and 2.74 aps?

I am wondering how well your freeze works and if there is a noticeable difference between say 51% and 57% CC?

I currently have:
804 AR
4800 Armor
36k hp
1100 LOH
2.82 APS
57% CC unbuffed
242k dps unbuffed

I am looking at dropping the nat ring and boots for my old rare ring and a pair of ice climbers. With the boots I am looking at I will have:

828 AR
4700 Armor
40k HP
2.75 APS
1000 LOH
51% CC unbuffed
254k DPS unbuffed

The armor loss is .5% mitiigation and the AR gain is .5% so they cancel each other out. A loss of 100 LOH should be acceptable. A gain of 12k dps is fantastic and a gain of 4k is also a bonus. My big concern is losing 6% CC. For multiple targets, it should not make a difference but I don't want to see my ability to lock down a single target, such as an uber, be reduced. I also don't want to start running out of arcane power on single targets. Are any of you guys running 50% CC and 2.74 APS with 19 APoC having issues? BTW, I use cold snap on ubers.

My other question is how is RD working on the PTR? With my current stats and 20k less unbuffed dps, RD + another affix was tough even with safe passage. Is the entire pack RD when the shield is active or just a single monster? I don't want to kill myself faster with all the dps I am trying to stack but I do want to be able to try to be somewhat efficient farming mp 10.

My goal is to stack enough dps to farm mp 10 and be somewhat efficient since monsters have a 100% chance to drop a bonus item + max mf + max % to drop demonic essence in 1.0.7.
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I'm pretty sure you can handle mp10 with your actual stats. Why get rid of the 6cc?
Edited by Henri#1490 on 1/25/2013 7:31 AM PST
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01/25/2013 07:31 AMPosted by Henri
I'm pretty sure you can handle mp10 with your actual stats. Why get rid of the 6cc?


It is actually only 6CC since my rare ring has 5.5% and my nat ring has 4.5%. I can handle mp 10 but I want to make it as fast as possible without killing myself on RD and without running out of arcane power. MS ice climbers with armor are not cheap so I was hoping to get a few opinions on how well 50% CC works rather than spend a few hundred million only to find out 50%CC just isn't enough.
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I think 55 is where it really starts to "feel good." I ran with only 52 for quite a while and the 56 I have now is smoother IMO. I strongly suggest you try it first but it might not matter a ton with your elite, killer DPS. Just grab a crappy lacuni w/o crit or put on a rare boot and see if you like it.
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'Only 6cc'? Your setup is beast. I'd only replace your gloves for a T&T or Sage's for better EHP.
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01/25/2013 12:19 PMPosted by ChangBooster
I think 55 is where it really starts to "feel good." I ran with only 52 for quite a while and the 56 I have now is smoother IMO. I strongly suggest you try it first but it might not matter a ton with your elite, killer DPS. Just grab a crappy lacuni w/o crit or put on a rare boot and see if you like it.


That is a great suggestion....some crappy lacunis. The price for ice climbers with MS, armor and 240+ Int is a bit high to simply do testing with. I think it may just come down to what feels better which will only come from testing, I suppose.
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'Only 6cc'? Your setup is beast. I'd only replace your gloves for a T&T or Sage's for better EHP.


T&T will be great for EHP but bad for dps. I feel comfortable with my current stats in mp 10. I spam safe passage like its going out of style! I certainly don't want my EHP any lower than what I have and I must say dropping to 1000LOH is not that appealing either. However, my goal is the highest paper dps I can get without losing any EHP since I am already near the bottom of what is comfortable. Hopefully the RD change in 1.0.7 is going to make life easier because that is the only current problem I have in mp 10. I am also hoping to roll a godly amulet with higher LOH than what I have now in 1.0.7. I plan on focusing all of my efforts on crafting amulets and then gloves.
Edited by KillerElite#1853 on 1/25/2013 1:23 PM PST
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Killer,

The crit is probably more important to you then the extra DPS.

Vita can be had without sacrificing that much crit.

Your wizards name is "critalicious" keep her that way :)
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i run 50cc when farming but i have a andys visage that i use for ubers
50cc is fine for farming since i use deep freeze, plus there are almost always multiple targets
but 50cc imo does not cut it for ubers since that is predominantly single targer
i hope that helps

oh those are almost exactly my stats but my aps is 2.75
Edited by SteelPhantom#1820 on 1/25/2013 1:49 PM PST
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Killer,

The crit is probably more important to you then the extra DPS.

Vita can be had without sacrificing that much crit.

Your wizards name is "critalicious" keep her that way :)


I Did 4 mp 10 ghom runs minus 6 CC from lacunis and it was terrible. 6% CC was the difference between him staying in one place and moving around me. Definitely not worth 12k dps. Perhaps farming would be a bit different but there will always be that situation where you are facing that last yellow elite and I am not interested in getting killed several times trying to keep him frozen. Same goes for keywardens and the odd time that I do ubers with bonechill instead of cold snap.

Thanks for the great advice.
Edited by KillerElite#1853 on 1/25/2013 2:07 PM PST
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Hehe i'm perfect to ask this question. It just so happens that in my 3piece zuni I am 2.73+ breakpoint and 50.5% in game CC (53.5% if solo via scoundrel, but i only care about party stats since i dont play solo).

In my inventory among many swap items I keep handy, the two I swap-in the most is my old Nat's ring + boot combo. Swapping in these badboys dips me from ~187K sheet to ~163K sheet while keeping roughly the same AR+armor+other stats, but I scoot up to 56% CC -- pretty good match for your question because all that's really drastically changing across the setups is my CC vs. my sheet DPS.

In my case, going from 187K to 163K, I deal significantly less real DPS, even though I gain CC. If the margin of sheet DPS loss or gain is smaller, then it's less significant, because at a lower sheet DPS using higher CC all other things equal, your multiplier should bump up a little more than it is with lower CC, thereby rescuing some of the lost "sheet dps" with extra real DPS. But when this margin is small, it doesn't seem worthwhile to lose the CC for only a small gain in sheet DPS, and this is exacerbated for you vs. me because overall your sheet is higher, meaning it would probably take much more of a sheet dps increase in the potential new setup for it to be worth the loss in freeze

The reason I use my Nat's combo at the expense of ~25K sheet DPS is that the freeze is better. For farming, it does not matter. For SK/magda however, the difference is very clear. Magda tries very hard to move away from you, so you really need any freeze edge you can get.

tl;dr I don't think your scenario is worth it to gain ~12K sheet dps at the expense of ~6CC. Your real DPS likely won't change much at all, and all you'll be doing is making your guy freeze much worse
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This is pretty much the perfect question for d3cmww.com

http://d3cmww.com/cmww?configid=54735 is your current profile with Cold Snap and no follower, it gives about 79.5% freeze uptime. Lower crit chance to 51% and APS to 2.75 and you'll have 77% freeze uptime.

That's an increase in the amount of time a single target will be unfrozen of...
(1-0.77)/(1-0.795) = 0.122 so about 12%

So a fairly significant loss of freeze effectiveness. You can put in the stats for the gear changes you're considering and see the effect it will have on your actual damage output, I suspect the loss of 6% crit chance will hurt your true DPS more than your character sheet DPS.

Your APoC is fine with 51% crit chance though, increasing it from 19 to 24 barely helps at all, you're already pretty much spending AP as fast as you can.
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I guess I got lucky since I rolled this wiz after I had nearly 18k elite kills on my barb. I only briefly had 50% CC then I quickly sold my barb gear and blew my savings all on my wiz. I skipped all the growing pains of playing with lower end gear so I really had nothing to compare. My next upgrades will certainly include more CC. The decrease in freeze effectiveness was very noticeable. The first ghom fight I could see how long it was taking the cool down to reset.
Edited by KillerElite#1853 on 1/25/2013 3:45 PM PST
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Killer,

You might be able to pull 50cc in a low mp farming situation for absolute demolishing since there are more packs and less single targets. One off yellow champs will probably me half dead and youl still have 10 seconds left on DF to finish them off.

That can see working with your dps boost.

But ya like I said overall I think your giving up too much
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01/25/2013 07:46 AMPosted by KillerElite
I was hoping to get a few opinions on how well 50% CC works


been running 51.5cc 18apoc 2.74 like forever. however I am pro deep freeze so I always skip packs of 5 or less and kite them together.

MP8 for me.

just keep going for 66.5% buffed =)
Edited by Comrade#6924 on 1/25/2013 4:18 PM PST
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save up to craft a 900 loh trifecta ammy then get inna pants.
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I've also been rolling these exact stats and SMS build... 50cc, 2.74aps. Freezing is not my problem. My AR is like 500avg so I die a lot above mp7 :(
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imho i tink the first setup is better, previously before i replace my hell fire i was running at 2.73 breakpoint with 50 cc and the freeze was nt as good after jus a 4.5 cc gain. What impt is nt jus the freeze is better with cc but the mupliter oso amplfied.

i run a few test earlier and i tink althought paper dps seem good in most case with apoc , cc and all been higher the mupltier can have a different of up to 1.XX.

Conclusion i tink the first setup is more solid with better surivability and mupliter
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I know it is subjective, but >50% always feels better than <=50% and every bit over 50% you can get feels all the more better.
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RD is same in PTR for us. Takes seconds to burn yourself down if in wrong affix and you have too much dps and/or not enough sustain & mitigation. Way it works is on for like 5 seconds off for like 2. Not that you can see indicator anyway with all the tornadoes and blasts. Time on is plenty to burn yourself down if standing in like center of RD electrics/firechains or something. Doesnt happen to me but i have low dps but when i use more DPS gear it does like my OS wand. Meh whatever just play less wreckless when you run into them standing far enough away for EB isnt hitting them all. far enough away so you're not absorbing so much electrified. etc - there are ways around it but i dislike that playstyle. In the end you're prolly better off "kiting" cos you burn through everything else so much faster meaning total time is faster. I just don't like that style of play.

As far as crit. With deepfreeze active u wont notice whatsoever but 50% is precarious on singles. sometimes they will break another thing i cant stand. winding up all over. 50 or 57 makes no difference on spells they cast both will get spells out but whatever they cant hurt me thats why we buy all that mitgation might as well get to use it....tough call try it out.
Edited by Aimless#1700 on 1/26/2013 3:40 AM PST
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