Diablo® III

DC death - I'm actually against fixing it

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WhiteOwl, you haven't even beaten Inferno, so your I'm not so sure how much weight to give your opinions here.

mintCookie, I'm not sure that fixing DC deaths is necessarily bad for the game. I do think that there needs to be a bit more of an item sink / gold sink in the game. I mean, if I logged in one Tuesday and Blizzard said "Sorry, we accidentally deleted your character during the maintenance. But you know how HC is", I'd be kinda annoyed. DC deaths are sort of the same thing.

But I agree that the game does need more of an item sink. I think they missed the boat with PvP. Perfect opportunity to help the economy out and do it in a way that's highly acceptable to the HC community. Another way might be to up the rewards for playing on higher MP and/or reduce the rewards for lower MP, to encourage riskier play (SC could benefit from less rewards on lower MP, too). There's probably other ways. But randomly killing characters seems a little too capricious if it's only to purpose is to maintain an economy. (Especially since it's an economy that some people don't even choose to participate in).
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I'm ok to die to a DC but whether playing on HC or SC these server issues are ridiculous.
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How about people who are against DC deaths get instantly booted in the event of one, while the people who are for DC deaths have to face the 30+ second death timer. Everyone wins. That seems fair enough to me.
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But I agree that the game does need more of an item sink. I think they missed the boat with PvP. Perfect opportunity to help the economy out and do it in a way that's highly acceptable to the HC community. Another way might be to up the rewards for playing on higher MP and/or reduce the rewards for lower MP, to encourage riskier play (SC could benefit from less rewards on lower MP, too). There's probably other ways. But randomly killing characters seems a little too capricious if it's only to purpose is to maintain an economy. (Especially since it's an economy that some people don't even choose to participate in).


They are beefing up the XP in higher MP's in addison to the higher mf/gf. I currently do mp 3 runs with my friends occasionally and it is fun, and will probably do them more regularly when the xp is actually worth it.

As far as the PVP = perma death... I think that would be suitable as well. Instead of something that is out of your control (D/C) you at least have the chance to kill or be killed, and since you have to be in a special area to pvp you wouldn't have to worry about a hostile pk exploit.

I want to conclude with saying... "What the heck is happening to the HC community?"

Maybe too many SC's are coming over with there constant flaming and down grading, but it has gotten worse lately. People on the HC forums have always been helpful and considerated, and even when people didnt see eye to eye they agreed to disagree, but lately it has gotten worse... Not sure why, but it is a bad trend. Use Bottle's previous well written post... Although he does not agree with the OP he didn't rip and and call him a tard or belittle him, he made a well stated counter point and ended it pretty much saying, "I don't agree with you." which is fine, we aren't always going to agree, but no point and telling someone they are "dumb", because they have a different opinion...
Edited by Swisha#1734 on 2/4/2013 2:29 PM PST
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02/04/2013 05:27 AMPosted by mintCookie
If nobody dies (especially more experienced HC players), hardcore will just become a glorified version of softcore to me.

The reason nobody dies is EXACTLY why those people made it so far in hardcore. And hardcore is just that, a glorified version of softcore.

Now, I don't believe you lost your chars to DC. I think you made an honest mistake on your own behalf which got you killed, and are trying to kill others with this silly DC problem that can be fixed. This brings me to my next point; hardcore is not for you. This is a glorified version of softcore. I think you be better off sticking to regular softcore. After all, the economy can't be that bad given you endured 17k elite kills of mindless grinding, but still don't have the talent to compete on our playing field.
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02/04/2013 12:07 PMPosted by Demiwraith
WhiteOwl, you haven't even beaten Inferno, so your I'm not so sure how much weight to give your opinions here.


WhiteOwl has been playing HC a long, long time. Look at the substance of what he is saying, and agree/disagree based on that substance.

When people have no playtime, and talk, and are wrong, they are not wrong because they have no play time. When people haven't beaten inferno, and are wrong, they are not wrong because they haven't beaten inferno.

In the sense that it is possible to *be correct* with little play time, and/or having never beaten inferno - if someone is arguing something and coming to an incorrect conclusion because they haven't experienced certain situations, the person with more experience should be able to articulate *why* that person is wrong, and not just say 'you don't have xxx elite kills/ you haven't beaten this difficulty / etc'. (Not saying you are doing this - I just see that a lot, and it always tends to indicate to me that the person doing so doesn't really have an argument anymore and is trying to "win" by bringing in irrelevant factors)
Edited by Anomie#1322 on 2/4/2013 1:18 PM PST
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Nah DC deaths shud b fixed you want gold sink stick around for next patch.
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Ok what exactly do you think healthy economy should look like? Because with more deaths you get less items (meaning their prices rise) and you don't get less gold, as you don't loose it upon death, so prices rise again.
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02/04/2013 01:12 PMPosted by Edison
Ok what exactly do you think healthy economy should look like? Because with more deaths you get less items (meaning their prices rise) and you don't get less gold, as you don't loose it upon death, so prices rise again.

OP's suggestion to not fix this simple DC issue is just insane.
Here are some ideas for a healthy economy:
Lader reset
Harder content
PvP

None of this 'death by lag' nonsense.
Edited by TheFunGun21#1392 on 2/4/2013 1:43 PM PST
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. . .WhiteOwl, you haven't even beaten Inferno, so your I'm not so sure how much weight to give your opinions here. . .


My point exactly. Anomie- thank you.

Just because someone has 5000 elite kills and beat inferno. . .that does not (in and of itself) give them the right to dismiss anyone's opinion provided that the opinion in question is indeed correct. Nor does this uniquely qualify them as experts. I see ALOT of total butt-whistles who've "beaten Inferno". Not hard to do when you are carried I'm told.
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WhiteOwl has been playing HC a long, long time. Look at the substance of what he is saying, and agree/disagree based on that substance.

When people have no playtime, and talk, and are wrong, they are not wrong because they have no play time. When people haven't beaten inferno, and are wrong, they are not wrong because they haven't beaten inferno.


<Sigh>
I guess that joke that fell flat... in my defense I think it would have been funnier if it appeared right beneath WhiteOwl's post, which is where it was supposed to be when I started writing the post. (The written medium is no place for deadpan humor, I guess... My bad.)
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No worries. Hell, I've thrown humor out there and had it be missed, too :)
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Let's make it so that the people who get hacked can't roll back their accounts either. That'll be a huge gear and time sink and would dwindle the supply chain to the AH also. Same principle, right? Player dies due to circumstances out of their control.

Brilliant idea OP.
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To me, the most important thing that makes hardcore fun is the fact that the drops i find are REWARDING. Unlike softcore, where I will be hard pressed to find anything that can sell with it's totally messed up economy.


Sad thing is that the longer the game goes, your "rewards" will continue to lose their value.

imo playing this game for its economy is bunk. Eventually MP blindfold faceroll equipment will be available at entry level "I just turned 60 and got outta Hell what should I do" prices. You could just wait this game out until everything you need costs ingame pennies.

Which also makes absolutely no sense that this game's content as far as punishment is concerned, continues to be nerfed to the ground. And all the benefits of either having ingame proficiency or time to grind both get neutralized at the same time. I figure there needs to be two avenues of approach to a game like this, being able to skill your way through content and progression, or outgearing through grind and time. Blizzard has yet to strike the balance, as they've removed true well designed challenging aspects such as Elite/Champ health restoration, while at the same time bumping monster health up to retarded levels, removing the risk of putting on MF gear and dropping defense with paragon levels that will now be easier to achieve and everything.

And as each patch adds some cool new stuff(like PvP, and Uber battles), while at the same time removing vegetables and just giving everyone ice cream WITH cherries on top, over and over. Players will eventually get bored out of their minds and look at DC deaths as an equalizer. Amirite?

Meanwhile the game continues to unknowingly cater to bots.

I hope for the expansion the game goes back to being extremely difficult but in a better designed way(as in no Invulnerable Minions and whatnot). This way, we won't have threads with people actually against fixing DC/lag deaths, and botter accounts wanting carries.
Edited by ActionKungfu#1184 on 2/4/2013 9:06 PM PST
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02/04/2013 11:00 AMPosted by WhiteOwl
I stopped caring here - but I read all of your post


Why? I'm curious. I heard similar comments when I first started playing.
People would say things like. . ."You don't have any HC characters." So I made some.
"You don't have any Lv 60's" So I made some.
"You don't have any Lv60 DH's" So I made one.
"You can't use Chain Lightning in Inferno" So I did.

Every single time I was told I didn't have an opinion (or the right to express it) because of some lack of achievement (or perception of it) I went and did it. And do you know what's changed about my game? Nothing. Not one damn thing has changed about the way I play. I've changed how I select armor, and what pieces I equip- but my game hasn't changed a lick. So when someone has an opinion, the wise man listens and thinks. And the General Discussion goobers post attack posts about how people don't have the right to speak unless they are P50's.


I didn't expect someone to get so worked up over my comment. I simply stopped caring because there's nothing novel in the OP's statements.

Experience strengthens an argument. Lack of experience either weakens or is non-influential in an argument. The OP has lack of experience, thus I couldn't care less about their argument. Logic 101.
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It seems a little strange to me that I had over 700 hrs in SC and never once had a DC. Come to HC with less than 100 hrs and I have had 2 already, I survived both. I know I am new to HC, but I would rather die fighting toe to toe, eye to eye or bellybutton as the case may be, against some Devil's Spawn, then some random DC.

Happy hunting,
Windigo
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I agree... there need to be more deaths in Hardcore. PVP is the solution.
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@ Speranza-

Sorry for the rant. I misunderstood your post.

But even still. . .I agree that experience can strengthen an argument. . .but not always in a positive way.

Example: Someone loses a home to foreclosure. Do you take financial advice from them?

Some would say no- based on his preceived 'poor' performance. (this would be looking at his experience on the surface)
Others might say yes- because he knows very well the failed path and knows what 'not' to do next time. (This would be you learning from his experience)

Good information is where you find it and experience does not necessarily equal good information.

To disregard someone because they do not have what is deemed 'enough' experience is silly.

That's like saying, You never burned your hand with a stove burner. . .so who are you to tell me it's hot?
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OP I think I know hwat your trying to say. In Diablo 2 LoD after a few year they implemented a new update. In this update Diablo would randomly spawn at any point to the hero's party and just murder them all before they get stronge enough to take him on. It got real hard and LOTS of people died.
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