Diablo® III

dropping OWE

I honestly don't know how they could change it so that it is no longer a "mandatory" passive and yet doesn't invalidate anyone's gear. I don't think it's possible.

And if they had any brains at all, they'd have looked at how many people are still using StI after it was nerfed and realized the real problem is not OwE, it's the other passives.


not only would it screw up a lot of peoples gear it would screw up the auction house. AR gear would SKY rocket and other single resist gear would be worthless.

and i agree there isn't anything better for us to choose, using more defensive passives allows us to get more offensive gear.
Edited by H00K#1411 on 2/1/2013 12:49 PM PST
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Combo Combo Combo STRIKE!!!
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02/01/2013 11:37 AMPosted by Shade
OWE takes away AH choices for the choice of sub-par monk passives.

Seems a little bit far fetched. If you're stuck using STI AND OWE then you've limited your options for the remaining passive. If you choose combination strike, you're potentially gimping your group by not taking guiding light. If you take guiding light you're gimping your own dps.

If you don't think Beacon is worth it, you're probably only using 1 or 2 cooldown skills. If you're using 3+ its hard to argue against it's usefulness. If anything, in 1.0.7, it will be even more valuable because of the indirect nerf coming to FitL. Beacon will help mitigate the nerf.

Those three choices don't even take into account that quite a few people are already taking Fleet Footed over them, as their third passive besides STI and OWE.

I'm also confused how you can argue that OWE gives you MORE gear choices. Just because the alternative (AR) is more expensive, doesn't mean its not a less restrictive choice either. You have to remember, while you're double stacking resists, someone else who has ditched OWE is getting an additional stat to fill some other purpose.
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ok, so after i buy an appropriate IK chest piece - i went with IK gloves and will get AR with the 2-piece bonus, i calculate i will end up at about 700 - 750 AR( as compared to my current 1064). i will have higher armour. i will have about the same approximate EHP. and i will finally crack 100k dps - as compared to about 95k now.

oh, i should mention i'm still keeping LPS. however, more of my ehp will now come from a bit higher vit now and a bit less mitigation, meaning my effective healing will go down a bit. i will gain LOH on b'thorn's pants though.

oooof, i really hope this works out...
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ok... bought a b'thorne's chest... oh lord, what am i doing?!?! i feel a bit insane....
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The two best chest aesthetically speaking, unfortunately dye will eliminate the relevance at least slightly...
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02/01/2013 04:06 PMPosted by MrMojoRisin
i feel a bit insane....

Insane in the membrane! Insane in the brain!

As of now Beacon of Ytar is fancy. But come 1.07 Exalted Soul will be the bee's knees for Bell/Skorpion Sting spammin'.
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i would say going for AR gears gives you alternative choices of our passive:

atleast for me i will choose between

- OWE
- Combo Strike
- Fleet Flooted
- Becon of Ytar
- Pacifism
- Guiding Light (in party)

although i must say the journey to drop OWE is not cheap and our other passives are not very great..

currently 562 AR w/o OWE (744 w OWE), i am still using OWE most of the time farming..
for reference (impulse and impatient AH user), my recent purchases (a week time)
- AR Inna's Pants - 130m
- 75AR Braces - 150m (you may consider to self craft after 1.0.7)
- 69 AR Inna' helm - 100m

no regret yet, and i am farming my @ss off to upgrade to 60-70AR WH belt.. target for 600 - 650 AR w/o OWE..

-
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I'm also confused how you can argue that OWE gives you MORE gear choices. Just because the alternative (AR) is more expensive, doesn't mean its not a less restrictive choice either. You have to remember, while you're double stacking resists, someone else who has ditched OWE is getting an additional stat to fill some other purpose.

How can you argue it doesn't?

If you're not using OwE, you have to use gear with AR. If you are using OwE, you can use gear with AR, with [Your Resist], or with AR and [Your Resist].

I looked into getting better Nats boots and a Vile Ward that have an additional stat to fill another purpose. You're looking at ~200 million for each (and that's on the low side, for some of them). So you're paying $90 extra for two items for the luxury of having fewer resist overall.
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Some sharing about my gearing history:
I started with phy res, with about 400+ phy & 200+ AR total about 770+ @ 1.0.3
When I approach 80k DPS I started the process of getting rid of OwE
I know I will have a hard time to push the AR back to the 700+ levels, so I took another approach - pump up armor. Target to 6k armor+600AR
By looking at what an endgame gear will looks like:
Head - mempo with cc roll had 70+ AR, inna with AR + 1 RNG
Shoulder - vileward that roll VIT & VIT+DEX had 70+ AR
Boot - Nat had 70+ AR, 170+ dex, +1 RNG to roll vit
Glove - dex/vit/cc/CD/IAS/ar
Bracer - dex/vit/cc/ar/armor/pickup
Pant - inna with 70+ AR
Ring - Nat & a unity/litany/rare quadfacta
Amulet - cc/CD/IAS/ar/dex/vit or trifacta Mara
Chest - now this is tricky. Tal/BT gives native AR roll, inna to roll AR in its +1 RNG?

With these info in mind I might end up with at least 7x80=560AR without taking rings into consideration so a 6k armor should be good enough. At the same time I had to get balance from edps & ehp. I think Even with such requirements a OwE free (or you might want to consider STI free too) 150-200k DPS is not a dream to achieve.

Its a hard road but I will do it piece by piece
Edited by yuhhaur#1278 on 2/1/2013 10:55 PM PST
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oh maaaan.... put on all my pieces and dps barely goes up. 688 all resist, 858 cold resist still. still not complete but what a drop in resists! and for what exactly????? damn, i hope i didn't just waste a heap of time and gold... plus there's a nats ring on the AH now that i would love, i could have afforded before, but now i can't after i spent on all this.... waaaaah i want a do-over!
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It is normal that DPS didn't raise due to the fact that we are solely working on the ehp side.

For DPS to move need to add dex/cc/CD/IAS/avg DMG
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I agree with Piffle that to gear out of OWE costs ~1b - and that's if you chose the right gear to get AR and your choices are limited to get all of the AR you need for a reasonable price.

That said, I see droping OWE gives you the option to get around 15% dps bump from passives like comb strike or guiding light. So for me the right time to gear out of OWE is when it will cost you over a billion to get around 15% dps. For me I find this happens when you start to approach the 150k+ dps mark. At this point almost any real upgrade is starting to costing like 500m+ anyways so it may be time to start gearing out.
Edited by Artemiss#1640 on 2/2/2013 12:48 AM PST
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I agree with Piffle that to gear out of OWE costs ~1b - and that's if you chose the right gear to get AR and your choices are limited to get all of the AR you need for a reasonable price.

That said, I see droping OWE gives you the option to get around 15% dps bump from passives like comb strike or guiding light. So for me the right time to gear out of OWE is when it will cost you over a billion to get around 15% dps. For me I find this happens when you start to approach the 150k+ dps mark. At this point almost any real upgrade is starting to costing like 500m+ anyways so it may be time to start gearing out.


If your intention is to gear out OwE might as well do it sooner and set a solid foundation instead of "find upgrade for 100k DPS, find upgrade for 125k DPS, find upgrade for 150k DPS, find upgrade for OwE"
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02/01/2013 02:01 PMPosted by gotaplanstan
OWE takes away AH choices for the choice of sub-par monk passives.

Seems a little bit far fetched. If you're stuck using STI AND OWE then you've limited your options for the remaining passive. If you choose combination strike, you're potentially gimping your group by not taking guiding light. If you take guiding light you're gimping your own dps.

If you don't think Beacon is worth it, you're probably only using 1 or 2 cooldown skills. If you're using 3+ its hard to argue against it's usefulness. If anything, in 1.0.7, it will be even more valuable because of the indirect nerf coming to FitL. Beacon will help mitigate the nerf.

Those three choices don't even take into account that quite a few people are already taking Fleet Footed over them, as their third passive besides STI and OWE.

I'm also confused how you can argue that OWE gives you MORE gear choices. Just because the alternative (AR) is more expensive, doesn't mean its not a less restrictive choice either. You have to remember, while you're double stacking resists, someone else who has ditched OWE is getting an additional stat to fill some other purpose.


Ok, let me teach you the ways of the mysterious AH.

1. First keep in mind you have a fixed budget, unless you are dual-wielding credit cards then gold is not an issue, but otherwise you have a BUDGET that you need to adhere too. By budget, I dont necessarily meant 500,000 gold, i meant a FINITE amount of gold. Even if you have 1B to gear all slots, it is a budget. A 1B budget.

2. Take an example, Nats Boots. 180 dex, 55 phy resist 75 AR goes for about 15M. This is probably the most value for money. If you drop OWE, what are you going to get?

180 dex, 70 vit, 75 AR boots go for 40-50M, see the difference? If you drop OWE for that extra roll, you might not be able to afford it, that is why people dont drop OWE when you are trying to gear on a budget. Not everyone can afford dropping OWE for that additional stat. So basically you are paying 25M to swap 55 resist into 75 vit. And this is the cheapest place to gear (along with VW) for OWE.

Gloves, amulet, rings etc are all worst, you have got to search for AR which drives prices up MASSIVELY. Given a same amount of money, i could buy physical resist gloves with much better DPS modifiers that can give me more then CS could ever give me. This is what I meant by more OPTIONS IN THE AH.

150 dex, 70 vit, 50 phy resist, 8 IAS, 8 CC, 35 CD - goes for maybe 100M. Now if you swap the phy resist for AR, it becomes 300M. But because you only have limited funds, ie 100M, you are forced to settle for less, you either drop the vit, dex, or crit dmg, your pick.

Dropping OWE is only really for monks who can afford top tier gear, and can actually pay for that extra roll that comes in place of the sec resist.

I think you are overrating the usefulness of having "options", you want options? Go roll a barb, they can WW/HOTA/WT, 3 entirely different builds with multiple variations inside them, all viable for all situations, unlike monks who are either cookie-cutter or TR for MP0-1. Monks dont have much options due to our sub-par passives.

Your so called "options" gives you illusion that you can choose CS and GL together, guess what, If you gave me a budget, I could put together a set with similiar EHP and far higher DPS then what your CS/GL can give you. You feel like you have options because you only look IN-GAME, while for me, building a character begins in the AH. Trying to argue your "options" looks to me more and more like an empty argument with no substance. Here I can provide solid examples with budgets to show you how dropping OWE gimps your DPS/EHP/budget, can you do so? Can you justify that loss against "options"?

And if you really are in a group, others also can take GL, Get that person who doesnt use CS to take it, I wouldnt mind taking it so you can maintain your CS. Also, BoY usefulness will deteriorate once 1.07 comes out, because most will probably be dropping a CD skill, either FiTL or that healing skill for it. You dont have to be all self sacrificial to take exploding palm, cyclone strike w/e, each cookie cutter monk usually have 1 non-crucial skill, if everyone chips in, then it should be fine. And you are spreading the load, so if you go down, your group isnt instantly weaken massively.
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I agree with Piffle that to gear out of OWE costs ~1b - and that's if you chose the right gear to get AR and your choices are limited to get all of the AR you need for a reasonable price.

That said, I see droping OWE gives you the option to get around 15% dps bump from passives like comb strike or guiding light. So for me the right time to gear out of OWE is when it will cost you over a billion to get around 15% dps. For me I find this happens when you start to approach the 150k+ dps mark. At this point almost any real upgrade is starting to costing like 500m+ anyways so it may be time to start gearing out.


If your intention is to gear out OwE might as well do it sooner and set a solid foundation instead of "find upgrade for 100k DPS, find upgrade for 125k DPS, find upgrade for 150k DPS, find upgrade for OwE"


Not sure if your implying I'm advising to regear every 25k dps cuz i'm not. I'm saying its more economical to gear with OWE until u can afford the bil to gear out of it properly. If you can spend a bil and get like 25% dps using OWE then I think you should go that route. Once it starts to cost too much to gain dps then think about getting the AR pieces you need to do so.
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i'm already using combo strike along with dual generators. so maybe i'll swap in guardian's path for some dodge? maybe then drop over awe for backlash too... i always liked those 2 together
Edited by MrMojoRisin#6850 on 2/2/2013 1:05 AM PST
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I agree with Piffle that to gear out of OWE costs ~1b - and that's if you chose the right gear to get AR and your choices are limited to get all of the AR you need for a reasonable price.

That said, I see droping OWE gives you the option to get around 15% dps bump from passives like comb strike or guiding light. So for me the right time to gear out of OWE is when it will cost you over a billion to get around 15% dps. For me I find this happens when you start to approach the 150k+ dps mark. At this point almost any real upgrade is starting to costing like 500m+ anyways so it may be time to start gearing out.


If your intention is to gear out OwE might as well do it sooner and set a solid foundation instead of "find upgrade for 100k DPS, find upgrade for 125k DPS, find upgrade for 150k DPS, find upgrade for OwE"


He will probably lose EHP AND DPS and still have to pay a higher amount of gold to weaken his monk. YAY!

@MrMojoRisin

Also please keep in mind that if you do not use OWE, it will become insanely expensive to upgrade in the future from 125k to 150k etc etc. This is because AR with perfect DPS rolls are exponentially expensive as they approach BIS.

If you used OWE, you could upgrade from 125k to 150k for maybe 250M, but without OWE, it is going to cost you probably 750M.

Congratulations! you get to use Beacon of Ytar alongside Fleet Footed now!!! AMAZING BUFF TO THE MONK! Nothing can stop you now, because serenity cooldowns faster by THREE MASSIVE SECONDS!
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[quote][quote]
He will probably lose EHP AND DPS and still have to pay a higher amount of gold to weaken his monk. YAY!



Uh no, when I said it would cost around a bil to gear out of OWE i meant that's usually how much it will cost to have equivalent dps and ehp. Last i checked I have more ehp than you
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... unless you are dual-wielding credit cards ...


This makes me think of various wuxia movies where small objects are thrown with enough force to decapitate someone, or maybe Gambit from X-Men. Maybe the damage would scale with your credit limit. Imagine how much damage a fully charged Platinum Mastercard would do.
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