Diablo® III

Retain NV Stacks After Changing Skills/Runes

I hope they change this rule and make it so that we don't lose our NV stacks after we changed skills/runes.

I sometimes need to change gear and/or skills when I come across certain monsters/elites like those pesky reflect damage monsters.

It would be awesome if we don't lose our NV stacks after doing so. Makes the game more dynamic and fun if we can tweak our toons in-game without losing efficiency.
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nv stacks are a reward for sticking with your build without changing skills.
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02/04/2013 01:41 AMPosted by chrisloup
nv stacks are a reward for sticking with your build without changing skills.


It's a reward for killing elites, opening resplendent chests and completing tasks (this last one I'm not sure of since I've not done it in a while. I just farm for gold, loot and experience). Changing skills should not negate all that hard work and time spent stacking NV.
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The very reason why Blizzard introduced the concept of Nephalem Valor was to incentivize players to stick to their build; before NV existed, people were running around constantly switching skills, because "everybody else was doing it," creating a feeling of "If I can't be bothered switching skills evey 30 seconds (or simply like to stick to one particular build), I'm at a disadvantage." It's the exact same deal as using your second weapon slot in Diablo 2 to cast Ice Armor / Clay Golem / what have you. Blizzard felt this was a stupid/wrong way to play the game, so they introduced Nephalem Valor to counteract that metagame shift and give us a reason to flesh out versatile character builds that can cope with different situations.

Many people have complained about the absence of skill points in D3 (-> "OMGZORZ EVERY1 HAS SAME SKILLZ!!!). If everyone were to switch skills freely on the fly, this statement would actually be correct in a sense. Nephalem Valor, on the other hand, encourages us to make our own, semi-permanent decisions on character builds.
Edited by BlueSpark#2375 on 2/4/2013 12:32 PM PST
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02/04/2013 01:41 AMPosted by chrisloup
nv stacks are a reward for sticking with your build without changing skills.
Why should they reward this?

NV should reward exploration, not punish it.
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the NV bonus was probably one of the worst inventions for D3 anyway. It really goes against the idea of quick farming games.

Not to mention sometimes its really usefull to change your runes, like if you fight usual enemies or if you need single target DPS.

The system is a punishment sadly.
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02/04/2013 12:35 PMPosted by CrniVuk
Not to mention sometimes its really usefull to change your runes, like if you fight usual enemies or if you need single target DPS.


THATS exactly why they intruduced NV .... people were changing spec on the fly depending on the mob type instead of ''working'' hard to defeat monsters that ''countered'' there build...

Might as well ask them to have 200 quick slot so that you can have all skills with all runes all the time ... man are gamers really dumbed down that much nowadays ?!?
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Lol wow... posts just get dumber and dumber. NV stacks are awesome and make the game so much better. You people are clueless.
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The point, I believe, of NV is to balance your build and not just go all out dps. Where's the challenge if all you have to do to roll over every monster is flip a switch.
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02/04/2013 01:46 PMPosted by Zaxxon23
Lol wow... posts just get dumber and dumber. NV stacks are awesome and make the game so much better. You people are clueless.


Maybe you're clueless about why this game is so tedious and boring after a while, and why NV is a huge part of that.


It takes all of 5 minutes to get a 5 stack of NV in act 1, 2, or 3. Also, its a minor buff to MF and GF. Ive gotten legendary items many times without having a 5 stack.
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The very reason why Blizzard introduced the concept of Nephalem Valor was to incentivize players to stick to their build; before NV existed, people were running around constantly switching skills, because "everybody else was doing it," creating a feeling of "If I can't be bothered switching skills evey 30 seconds (or simply like to stick to one particular build), I'm at a disadvantage." It's the exact same deal as using your second weapon slot in Diablo 2 to cast Ice Armor / Clay Golem / what have you. Blizzard felt this was a stupid/wrong way to play the game, so they introduced Nephalem Valor to counteract that metagame shift and give us a reason to flesh out versatile character builds that can cope with different situations.

Many people have complained about the absence of skill points in D3 (-> "OMGZORZ EVERY1 HAS SAME SKILLZ!!!). If everyone were to switch skills freely on the fly, this statement would actually be correct in a sense. Nephalem Valor, on the other hand, encourages us to make our own, semi-permanent decisions on character builds.
The fix to this "problem" is pretty retarded.

There is already a good incentive not to change your skills every 30 seconds, which is that changing your skills back and forth every 30 seconds is a pain in the !@#, especially if the skill has a long cd.

It's also not necessary to change your skills every 30 seconds. I haven't even played this game since the summer, cuz there's been no PvP, but back then, the only time I would ever want to switch my skills up, is when I was fighting a boss. Obviously, my AOE setup is not going to cut it when I get to a boss, especially when my items suck.

Changes are only needed the odd time, when you encounter something rare. The whole NV thing kills build diversity, and build exploration, while screwing over poor players who don't have items that are good enough so that an AOE setup can kill bosses, or a single target can take down large groups quickly, or that some "compromise" between aoe/single target is actually efficient for both large packs and single targets.
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02/04/2013 01:40 PMPosted by runit3
nv stacks are a reward for sticking with your build without changing skills.


False.

NV stacks were instituted to enforce an elite-farming-only policy and do away with boss runs from D2.

You're welcome,
-Jay Wilson


Nailed it.

Also, why on earth would you want to remove the very last thing in this game that even begins to punish you for switching skills/runes constantly? If they were to make this change there would be no penalty for doing anything in this game except for the repair bills. It truly would be a Baby's First ARPG title at that point.
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YES.

And give us 10 skill slots so we CAN have diversity and FUN!

If not remove the NV lose when changing skills. Please give us more skills at once.

All skills (besides the obvious) already have either a cooldown or a resource cost (why some have both has got me) so why limit us to 6 skills? That's fun?

Being able to remember what skills you have up and when/where to use them is waaaaayyyyyy more fun than this rip off of WoW.
Edited by Snoofo#1164 on 2/4/2013 2:11 PM PST
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Removing the ability to swap out skills when you have Neph stacks was, quite honestly, a gaping flaw in the game design.

It is very apparent when you are leveling alts that the entire game is balanced around quick skill swapping, and this was thought of when the skill bar (max 6 skills) was implemented. However, during Inferno testing, certain abilities proved too strong in tandem, and the Neph stack solution was introduced; it was going to take way too long to balance the abilities to the point of free swapping being possible.

I just hate that they didn't put the work in. There was and is no reason we should not have full swap access to every skill, at all times - it's only the way it is because the skills were not balanced around that design tenet. It just becomes so simple to do: skill points were the old school solution, and free respecs are the new school solution. Why was this not used?

Blizz wanted to keep things really simple, and they believe the Neph stack solution is also part of that. So if we keep that in mind, another incredibly simple solution would be to put a timer on skill swaps. That is effectively all Neph stacks are - a timer on how often you can skill swap, since you'll just need to get stacks again.

In the end, they decided they didn't want it any other way, and haven't spoke to us publicly about it.

With the departure of Jay Wilson I'm hoping some of the flawed game design gets a new tuning pass, and Neph stacks are definitely near the top of the list.
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So a bunch of whiners complain because everybody has all the skills and there is no permanence in builds. Blizzard appeases them by adding in a mechanism that creates build permanence for the duration of a game, and now people are whining they can't change skills on the fly without penalty. No wonder people think Blizzard doesn't listen to them. At any given moment, only 50% of the community will be happy with anything they do, so there's always 50% that will complain. There is no way for Blizzard to win.
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