Diablo® III

[Guide] The Cookie Cutter. (1.0.7)

Greetings all!

Lord Rhaal- My new monk has not achieved max level yet, so please forgive this theorycraft! I am not trained in the snapshot since I did not use a Monk for quite some time(except my first char in vanilla)

Having said that In the 2nd build how instrumental is faith in the light by itself? Can the build not spam bells as well as ashes to ashes without exalted soul? If soul replaced resolve passive how would that work? Even more similar yes..though serenity would be counter productive in a dodge-focused build perhaps?

Cyclone strike, Wall of Wind is the best candidate I could assume, if there was one. Extra dodge as you need it most!(also perhaps reclump scattered bell targets?) Lack of resolve and serenity may be to much unless uber geared though?

Hell if you are cyclone striking maybe the explosive light would have greater effect... hmm to many thoughts!

*Runs to finish leveling up*

For this build what would you say is better between dual wield/2-hand? I've been leveling with a 2-hander and its a little slow(no ias anywhere though). I just feel Bells benefit more from 1 big weapon since its doing weapon damage? Correct me if I'm wrong please :)

How well might the Frying Dragon perform? A baller one with +8WoL cc..socket and crit dmg/ls?
Edited by CptNinjetty#1915 on 2/13/2013 11:21 AM PST
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which is the first born bastard son of the CC!


Whoa, I don't have any kids. I'm still the original 'CC' as farm as gaming/moba is concerned :3

I've been tinkering around with multiple builds.

Bell breaks my attack animation. I'll mess around with one of those specs on mp6 ghom run in a bit. Someone finally convinced me to use C-C-Combo + 2 generators instead of Blinding Flash.

I haven't used Blinding Flash since the patch. Tempted to use it then drop 3 bells.

In some specs Water/Fire/Air ally has been pretty beneficial. I've yet to see her die, but from a dps standpoint she isn't the greatest. I was finally able to solo siegebreaker on higher MP without him picking me up (Ally didn't die either. But Uber spec's are different).

I'm tempted to rewrite your entire build philosophy/lore using TTGL Themes.

I'm pretty sad that I'm unable to find room in any build for Cyclone Strike. Its buff was nice, but its kinda meh still.
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I have a few questions that will probably seem noobish, please let me apologize in advance for that and if they've already been answered, but I didn't scan through the post to find them ...

Right when the servers went back online yesterday, I reconfigured for the Ashes to Ashes CC build, in exact order as described.

I loaded up an MP2 Act 1 key run and was very pleased with the "ease" at which I was able to mow through elites and mobs. It took me a bit to get used to the build (I keep MoC up when it ends, but I don't "spam" it for fights, if that is what "spamming" is meant in this case), and I noticed I had to be cautious about bell usage and amount of spirit available (a couple of times I got caught by an elite mob & right after a large normal mob I had just "mowed down" and didn't have the spirit for the bells needed to take out the elites quickly enough), but I got into a "rhythm" and trucked along (no keys, if anyone's interested).

I decided to push my luck a bit and moved to MP3, Act 3, just to run the keeps areas for a little tougher groupings & mobs. Initially I was surviving O.K. (actually got back to back legendary drops), but I soon found out that I REALLY had to pay attention to the spirit I had available. I may not be geared enough to solo MP3 (please feel free to comment on that, I haven't changed anything from yesterday), but as efficiently as I was doing MP 2 Act 1 key runs, I didn't think MP3 Act 3 would be that much of a stretch...

Here's the question (sorry for the wordiness) - I really like the Ashes to Ashes build, but running OOS, seemed to be a huge problem for me (I was getting a decent amount of bells off, but sometimes the mob was big enough that I couldn't quite get enough off), I'm not geared for spirit regen. Do I need to regear for spirit regen or something else? Should I substitute something in on the build to help me maintain spirit regen? I know I need to work on my gear (that is a work in progress), should I use a different build until I have X-type gear and what should that gear be?

Thanks for the advice - Pops
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I dont think the cookie cutter build should be the cookie cutter build really. I dont run it because i can farm far faster with http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/monk#acgkVS!Ubc!aZYaac build. Now i may not be running on mp 7-8 as of right now but i can certainly solo mp5 fast and with no problem. with the increase to exp gain in higher mp you want to go fast. everyone keeps overlooking the fact that Tempest Rush got its dmg boosted as well. I believe that its a solid spirit spender now that does ample damage to mobs
Edited by mifinke#1364 on 2/13/2013 12:27 PM PST
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Not sure if it was said as i didnt read all of the posts, but i have tryed on ptr and it worked pretty much the same as the 1.06 snapshot. I took out serenity because only reason that was still on my skillbar was for the bugged RD packs. I replaced it with DR-foresight and combostrike as i dont use owe. The dps output on this was very similar to the dps from snapshot. Now i didnt gear swap with my snapshot and if i did we all know that i would not be doing similar dps. I think this may also be very viable as a build for ppl that do not use OWE. It is very nice to see your FoT doing over 700k crits and 150k+ crits with cyclones. I think with new items plus gems i will be able to do closer to the 1 mil mark on my crits. I dont run numbers on all of this and someone that does could prove or disprove this as being efficiant. I did play around with bells and i just dont think they are for me atm with 0 spirit regen but may be something i pursue a little further.
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I have returned.. to answer more questions! >:D

@Shady
02/12/2013 10:31 AMPosted by Shade
I am looking at the first build ashes to ashes, but I have a questions, in mid level MPs- (5-6), I 1 shot everything even with TC, is it important to have the Inna's 4 set?


is it important to smoke in the morning?
no, nothing is important, everything is necessary. ;D


In 1.06, I noticed that it was quite hard to spam MoC without the Inna's 4 set unless during prolonged BUT not dangerous battles where you could facetank and just hit. In dangerous battles (molten, bugged yellow reflect), where you had to re-position and wait for serenity frequently, it became impossible to use MoC repeatedly without Inna's 4 set as I run out of spirit.


- you don't neeed to spam MoC, you can spam bells instead.
or better yet, you can use them both strategically.
Monks make the mistake of believing they keep having to have Overawe buffed all the time, you in a hurry? you have somewhere to go?

if you are finding yourself being low on spirit,
then you need to A/ spam less. B/ get more regen. C/ get more attack speed. >:)

My question is: is it possible in 1.07 (even with exalted soul), to maintain THREE high spirit spenders? MoC, SW AND WOL? Or would we benefit more with the Inna's 4 set.


Inna's no longer has its old allure, because there is no more need to continuously keep the aura up. There is no more snapshot.

I have a WH belt that is 4.5k dps/66k ehp increase from Inna's belt, which is quite good itself. Just wondering whether saving that SW cost and spamming more MoC or Bells would result in more eDPS?


who cares about eDPS.
what's more for you is less for me, what's less for you, is more for others. Do what makes you happy. >:)

I am using S/B build now so that lowers my spirit generation speed, as my APS is around 2 (with WH), and that IAS is almost maxed out. Or does the ashes to ashes build work better with DW?

it's good for all modes, you just gotta change your tactics accordingly.
When ur using S/B, I assume that you have a strong black damage 1hander to deal high dps with bells, then you don't need to spam Overawe that much.

====================================================

I'm no Monk expert, but wouldn't casting Wave of Light do more damage than 3 secs of 24% damage for less spirit?

IE- you should cast Wave rather than extra Mantra


^


WOL for me has max crit dmg of around 3.36 mil with 24% conviction and DR buff

3 Secs of 48% extra dmg = around 13-14mil with DR buff (guesstimate. I forgot new dps numbers with SW nerf)

So, I need to hit roughly 4 monsters with one and have it crit for it to beat the 3 sec spam. It also costs 25 more spirit.

If you're using the "new cookie" mantra spam most of the time and drop bells on larger groups.


ok, by the number you're stating, I believe ur talking about single target.
and are you saying your whole bell crits at 3.36 TOTAL,
or is it that you have Seen a yellow number of 3.36?
I'll assume it's the latter, because you are quite geared.

So then take that number you said, and multiple it by three, because WoL hits 3 times. ;)
let's just say the number is 3mil, cuz you won't be hitting that 3.36 mil all the time,
so that's 3x3 = 9mil. Per target :>
Plus, a 96% reverb wave from it.
so if that 9mil is the total crit output of your 829% WoL,
then to find the 96% aftermath dmg, critting, (the reverb damage is approximately 11.58% of WoL damage)
is this,

829% x 0.1158 = 95.99%
therefore, 9mil x 1.1158 = 10.04mil

your bell's total high crit damage,
at your crit amount, per bell, is 10mil.

===================================

- With the SW nerf, ur not hitting the 13-14mil in your scenario anymore,
let's say that FiTL snapshot added 50% to your dps (the rough buff at 1.8 to 2.0 attack speed that it scales to. As most monks' attack speed are in that range.)
- Let's use a dummy's-calculation here, using just the numbers with cyclones alone and not counting the non-crit SW's numbers, for easy understanding,

so in 1.0.7, you lose that 50%, and gain 6% from cyclones.

now losing a 50% buff, to that original dps, which results in 13mil,
is 8.66666mil, without the buff.

so if you add the new cyclone dmg of 6% onto that,
it would be 8.666 x 1.06 = 9.185mil

AND that is during 3 seconds of overawe. (as you stated)
so 1 second of overawe, is about 3.06mil

1 bell takes about a second to cast, at average attack speed,
and if 1 bell can max crit up to 10mil (in your scenario)
then you should know which is better,
a 10mil bell, or a 3.06 mil extra second of cyclones in overawe. :)
---------------------

There's no way in hell can a group of 26% cyclone, slowly hitting random targets,
buffed under a 48% damage to themselves,
can match an instant slam of 829% + 96%, under a constant 24% damage buff.

Of course one cannot constantly cast bells, but with the small time it only takes, to get 40 spirit for a bell, dealing 829% + 24%, is a lot higher than using 50 spirit for 48% bonus damage, to that which deals 26%.

Keep in mind that people still thinking of the old snapshot cyclone dmg,
wake up, you don't have it anymore.

=============================

Note : math is not my forte, so if Vrkhyz could double check my numbers,
let me know if my form has is precise. >;)
Edited by CountFury#1192 on 2/14/2013 1:35 PM PST
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@Piffle,
Hey Raahl, if you were to remove Serenity from Ashes to Ashes, what would you put in its place?


- well in AtA, Serenity serves as invulnerability,
those who forego Serenity, can use seven sidious strike in its place. >:D
but that's a lil more advanced, not recommended here cuz SSS is kinda gimp without Beacon of Ytar, and using that as passive here, changes the shape of the standard spec, which would be worthy of another build entirely, and not the CC meant for the majority. >:]

Ok, well let me rephrase the question then -

If I were not concerned about having a skill for invulnerability (Serenity or SSS) or extra mobility (DS), what build would you choose?
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02/12/2013 10:52 AMPosted by Balance
Wait a minute, are you the guy that wrote the Jedi Monk Anothology? lol Great builds.


yessir, I am Him. >:o

@Haruki
looks good. really want to try the new WOL.

sorry if this is slightly off topis. I just read the patch note in the launcher and it only mentioned 2 runes (3 maybe? just a quick read) so is this intended? some runes will have their DMG stay the same as 1.06? I thought it was mentioned in ptr and all runes were to be buffed?

edit: self solved. sorry i see how it works now, the other runes just carry the basic DMG of 829% so no need to mention.....


turn on your advanced tooltips, mortal. >:o

@Camelstabber
:-(
You didn't address my post, JERK
;-)


>:(>

----------------------------

@CptNinjetty
02/13/2013 04:50 AMPosted by CptNinjetty
In the 2nd build how instrumental is faith in the light by itself? Can the build not spam bells as well as ashes to ashes without exalted soul? If soul replaced resolve passive how would that work? Even more similar yes..though serenity would be counter productive in a dodge-focused build perhaps?


- Faith in the Light takes care of that >:) because its buff scales with attack speed.
overawe yields +48% damage, FiTL yields at least 45% damage, if your attack speed is higher than 1.0 >:D
at 3.0 attack speed, my dps is doubled, so I achieve a 100% dmg buff with FiTL.

- You don't need Exalted Soul in the 2nd version, because you don't need to spam Mantra of Backlash >:) Using Exalted Soul in the 2nd version is redundant and counter-productive, (unless ur extremely starved on spirit all the time.) Resolve is used here because together with OWE and STI, it is the origin trio of the 3 monk passives. And Backlash Also procs resolve, which helps for the foregoing of serenity.

Cyclone strike, Wall of Wind is the best candidate I could assume, if there was one. Extra dodge as you need it most!(also perhaps reclump scattered bell targets?) Lack of resolve and serenity may be to much unless uber geared though?


No, dodge runes of attack skills are meant for dodge centric builds,
this is standard balanced cookie cutter.
- Backlash here will be the key to going without serenity, trust me. >;)

Hell if you are cyclone striking maybe the explosive light would have greater effect... hmm to many thoughts!

*Runs to finish leveling up*

For this build what would you say is better between dual wield/2-hand? I've been leveling with a 2-hander and its a little slow(no ias anywhere though). I just feel Bells benefit more from 1 big weapon since its doing weapon damage? Correct me if I'm wrong please :)

How well might the Frying Dragon perform? A baller one with +8WoL cc..socket and crit dmg/ls?


all modes have their pros and cons, with 2h, you hit harder with bells, but you're slow so you'll cast less bells.
and I don't know about that frying dragon, I've never eaten one fried. ;D
Just get one and try it out. ;)

@Piffle
If I were not concerned about having a skill for invulnerability (Serenity or SSS) or extra mobility (DS), what build would you choose?


Cyclone Strike - Eye of the Storm. >:D

Cheap, gets the job done, spammable, position crowd control,
and pulls nearby mobs in, so you can drop bells on em. ;)
and since you have high aspd, it's a good choice for you also.
Don't use Implosion btw, it's more expensive, and the extra range don't matter much when you have thunderclap to get near them already, Eye of the Storm is the masterful precision here. >:)
Edited by CountFury#1192 on 2/14/2013 2:03 PM PST
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glad to see exalted soul getting some love. i've been using it since 107 ptr hit. the extra spirit helps a great deal since a lot of times you're just raining down fot to finish off some champs.
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how well do these builds work with 2handers? Im trying to help my little brother gear up and he needs some life steal but I'm not sure whether to go with a LS scorn or get some 1 handers. He uses this build or a very close variation of it. Thanks monks!
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they work very well. ;)

Restored and updated!*
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they work very well. ;)

Restored and updated!*


Greeting from Boneyard >:D
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I just noticed that request for confirmation. I'll get to it during my lunch break.
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Note : math is not my forte, so if Vrkhyz could double check my numbers,let me know if my form has is precise. >;)

I'm still having a hard time figuring out how GAP is critting for 3M–4M on a hit. His rare mace in his profile has a maximum damage of 1,124, so:

1,124 AWD
+ 63 (max damage on Unity)
+ 54 (max damage on Nat's)
= 1,241 modified maximum damage

1,241
x 32.40 (3,140 DEX, wow)
= 40,208.4

40,208.4
x 6 (+500% CHD)
= 241,250.4

241,250.4
x 8.29 (829% WoL damage)
= 1,999,965.816 damage per bell

1,999,965.816 damage per main WoL strike
÷ 3 (bell damage is divided in three parts
= 666,655.272

666,655.272
x 1.45 (3% damage vs. elites, 24% Overawe, 18% Foresight)
= 966,650 damage

Maybe he was using different equipment. Maybe I'm missing something. Or maybe the profile is dated, like the post.

Anyway, for some monks, spamming Overawe will be better; for others, they should concentrate on bells. I'll post my monk's stats as an example later.
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Its also probably important to note (if it hasn't already been) that if someone is still using WKL chances are variants of the 1.0.6 cookie cutter will still outperform anything short of Teen Spirit thats bells related.

I've tested not only my #'s, but those of a few others who have between 22 and 25% on their WKL, and it holds true in every case. In other words, I'm not sure whether there is a breaking point when using a WKL for when/if its still better to use WoL over Overawe for spending spirit.
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Its also probably important to note (if it hasn't already been) that if someone is still using WKL chances are variants of the 1.0.6 cookie cutter will still outperform anything short of Teen Spirit thats bells related.

I've tested not only my #'s, but those of a few others who have between 22 and 25% on their WKL, and it holds true in every case. In other words, I'm not sure whether there is a breaking point when using a WKL for when/if its still better to use WoL over Overawe for spending spirit.


stan whats the next best spirit spender if ure in a group with monks and someone else already has overawe?
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03/13/2013 02:08 PMPosted by SteelPhantom
whats the next best spirit spender if ure in a group with monks and someone else already has overawe?

Cyclone Strike so others can drop bells on them? Scorpion Sting for the stunnage?
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03/13/2013 02:21 PMPosted by Vrkhyz
whats the next best spirit spender if ure in a group with monks and someone else already has overawe?

Cyclone Strike so others can drop bells on them? Scorpion Sting for the stunnage?


thank you Vrkhyz
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You're welcome. I've also run in a four-monk pack in which one of us had Overawe, one had Cyclone Strike and two of us were dropping bells. I don't know that there's such a thing as "too many bells" as long as someone is running Cyclone Strike.
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@Vrkhyz

Can you please look at my Bell build and let me know what is my damage per bell with the SOJ and Skull Grasp skill bonus. I used this build right now to farm MP6 and just drop bell from pack to pack and use TR to get there. Makes it really fast. My skills might not be the best so suggestions are welcome. Thanks.

Profile below

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/KADJO-1395/hero/29359539
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