Diablo® III

Diablo 2 builds I remember

02/17/2013 01:56 PMPosted by Joren


LMAO. No, it does not. A build needs to be viable in endgame to be count as an actual build. D3 has very very few.

In that case D2 only has one build: Hammerdin.

LOL you think only the hammerdin is viable! How cute. My charged boltress says hi :P
Reply Quote
02/17/2013 01:56 PMPosted by Joren


LMAO. No, it does not. A build needs to be viable in endgame to be count as an actual build. D3 has very very few.

In that case D2 only has one build: Hammerdin.

Wow! What a stupid remark.
The ignorance is incredible over here.
Reply Quote
The build diversity in D2 came from the gear not the skill tree. The 1.10+ abomination was an even bigger example of how gear dependent builds were in D2.

The foundation of every single D2 build was the following:

STR - Just enough to equip your end game gear.
DEX - Enough to max out block rate
Energy - depends on buid.
HP - Everything else.

So much for diversity.

Guess you didn't know how to play that game.
Sorry but yeah, D3 is better for you. Less number fiddling.

02/17/2013 01:43 PMPosted by TheApexPred
Yeah you have it right, I remember having to restart a few lvl 85+ because of lag causing me to add a few points to energy. Which nobody ever needed to do... Ever. Those were the days.

Nobody?
No imagination.
Reply Quote
LMAO. No, it does not. A build needs to be viable in endgame to be count as an actual build. D3 has very very few.


Go to the link site and click on the gem. It will randomize the skills and their runes. Start a game with Mp0 or Mp1 or Mp2 and rush from act 1 inferno to act 4 inferno. Tada, it was possible and in most cases, if your gear fits, it was rather easy. Inferno is endgame. Repeat the step 1000 times and see how you get a new build everytime -> Diablo 3 has more builds than Diablo 2.

And talking about viability. Try to start Diablo 2 with a zealot selffound and tell me he is as viable as the Blizzard sorc.

Believing such a silly statement is proof that you haven't played D2 and are in no position to argue on the matter. What I don't understand is how anyone can have to gall to make such a statement out of complete ignorance on the subject.


Saying such nonsense is proof that you haven't played D2 in a long time and that you are in no position to argue on the matter.

Precisely. I'd like to see anyone build a character using only long cooldown abilities or skipping the resource generators. There are so many restrictions on skill design/balance that many build options are eliminated right out of the gate. D2's flexibility enabled virtually any active skill to be viable given the proper investment.


I'd like to see you build a character using only passives in D2. You still don't seem to understand why cooldowns are in the game in the first place. Maybe you should calm down and think about why there are resources in the game.
Reply Quote
Here is the difference between D2 and D3 builds.

In D2, each build had a very specific and unique play style. Some builds were far better than others, of course, but you did not play inferior ones for efficiency, you played them for a different experience. While some of the inferior builds took longer to be viable, ALL of them were viable at some point in the leveling progression. Beyond skill point diversity, you also had some builds centered around gear, which allowed for even more options.

In D3, Everything is centered around gear, and even with all the rune buffs and monster nerfs, there are very few builds that are viable. And what makes this worse, is that it dont matter if you have spent 50 hours on your build, or 1000 hours on it, it cant get any better as you play it. (assuming you are using the auction house).

I see people talk about how MP10 is harder than hell player 8 in D2. I dont know if it is or not, but it is impossible to compare the two because the character progression to get to the hardest difficulties is so different in each game.

The comparison I would use for both games is how viable a build is at the hardest difficulty. In D2, if you could do beat baal in hell by yourself in a players 8 game, you had a viable build. In D3, if you can beat diablo on inferno MP10, you have a viable build. Now, why dont you guys start counting up how many REAL viable builds there are in D3...

As I said before, pretty much all builds in D2 were viable at some point in their progression. Some may have been at level 50, while others aren't until level 80. But they are all viable. In D3, there is virtually no difference between a lvl 60 and a lvl 60(100), and likewise, no matter how many thousands of hours you play, your character CANNOT get any better.
Edited by kweagle#1932 on 2/17/2013 2:14 PM PST
Reply Quote


In that case D2 only has one build: Hammerdin.


Really? So you are trying to tell me a hammerdin is the only build that could beat ball on hell? REALLY? Get back to reality. We are talking about VIABLE builds, not the BEST build.
Edited by kweagle#1932 on 2/17/2013 2:06 PM PST
Reply Quote
02/17/2013 02:02 PMPosted by Dwelve
LMAO. No, it does not. A build needs to be viable in endgame to be count as an actual build. D3 has very very few.


Go to the link site and click on the gem. It will randomize the skills and their runes. Start a game with Mp0 or Mp1 or Mp2 and rush from act 1 inferno to act 4 inferno. Tada, it was possible and in most cases, if your gear fits, it was rather easy. Inferno is endgame. Repeat the step 1000 times and see how you get a new build everytime -> Diablo 3 has more builds than Diablo 2.

And talking about viability. Try to start Diablo 2 with a zealot selffound and tell me he is as viable as the Blizzard sorc.

Again, good luck doing so without resource generators or only cooldown abilities :P

Believing such a silly statement is proof that you haven't played D2 and are in no position to argue on the matter. What I don't understand is how anyone can have to gall to make such a statement out of complete ignorance on the subject.


Saying such nonsense is proof that you haven't played D2 in a long time and that you are in no position to argue on the matter.

I played D2 more recently than D3. My vision is not clouded by anything. Even still, having not played D2 in a long time is still better than not having played ever as you having demonstrated in numerous posts so far.

Precisely. I'd like to see anyone build a character using only long cooldown abilities or skipping the resource generators. There are so many restrictions on skill design/balance that many build options are eliminated right out of the gate. D2's flexibility enabled virtually any active skill to be viable given the proper investment.


I'd like to see you build a character using only passives in D2. You still don't seem to understand why cooldowns are in the game in the first place. Maybe you should calm down and think about why there are resources in the game.
Passives only would work just fine. You could clear the game with only melee attacks and good gear just as well as you could clear the game with only skills and without gear. Not to say it would be as fun as using active skill builds.

I'd like to see you try to explain cooldowns as their only effective result is to limit build variety. There is no reason to use cooldowns when classes already have an effective resource system. Cooldowns as resources are entirely redundant.
Edited by steveman0#1968 on 2/17/2013 2:10 PM PST
Reply Quote
02/17/2013 02:02 PMPosted by Dwelve
I'd like to see you build a character using only passives in D2. You still don't seem to understand why cooldowns are in the game in the first place. Maybe you should calm down and think about why there are resources in the game.


You're trying to change the argument, passives are obviously different than actives, we're talking about active skills. Cooldowns are in due to skills like "earthquake" which would be overpowered if spammable, to limit teleport, and to make skills such as ignore pain "tactical". Fact is, lesser skills could be buffed in D2 enough to compete. Please don't ignore my post to pick on his.

Cooldowns, skills being purposely designed to outdo others, generators vs spenders. In D2, you could find +skills gear, use lower res wand on switch or other potential charges to increase a builds performance. In D3, you can't stack say magic missile to make it compete with Blizzard where in D2, you could stack Arctic Blast to compete with Hurricane.
Reply Quote
Here is the difference between D2 and D3 builds.

In D2, each build had a very specific and unique play style. Some builds were far better than others, of course, but you did not play inferior ones for efficiency, you played them for a different experience. While some of the inferior builds took longer to be viable, ALL of them were viable at some point in the leveling progression. Beyond skill point diversity, you also had some builds centered around gear, which allowed for even more options.

In D3, Everything is centered around gear, and even with all the rune buffs and monster nerfs, there are very few builds that are viable. And what makes this worse, is that it dont matter if you have spent 50 hours on your build, or 1000 hours on it, it cant get any better as you play it. (assuming you are using the auction house).

I see people talk about how MP10 is harder than hell player 8 in D2. I dont know if it is or not, but it is impossible to compare the two because the character progression to get to the hardest difficulties is so different in each game.

The comparison I would use for both games is how viable a build is at the hardest difficulty. In D2, if you could do beat baal in hell by yourself in a players 8 game, you had a viable build. In D3, if you can beat diablo on inferno MP10, you have a viable build. Now, why dont you guys start counting up how many REAL viable builds there are in D3...

AS I said about, pretty much all builds in D2 were viable at some point in their progression. Some may have been at level 50, while others aren't until level 80. But they are all viable. In D3, there is virtually no difference between a lvl 60 and a lvl 60(100), and likewise, no matter how many thousands of hours you play, your character CANNOT get any better.

Excellent summary of the matter!
Reply Quote
02/17/2013 02:02 PMPosted by Dwelve
I'd like to see you build a character using only passives in D2. You still don't seem to understand why cooldowns are in the game in the first place. Maybe you should calm down and think about why there are resources in the game.


I built a Zon around passives using ONLY wirts leg as a weapon. I got through most of nightmare before I got bored of playing it, as it became a very time consuming play through. The point being, passives were viable skill choices depending how you wanted to play the game.
Reply Quote
02/17/2013 02:11 PMPosted by kweagle
I'd like to see you build a character using only passives in D2. You still don't seem to understand why cooldowns are in the game in the first place. Maybe you should calm down and think about why there are resources in the game.


I built a Zon around passives using ONLY wirts leg as a weapon. I got through most of nightmare before I got bored of playing it, as it became a very time consuming play through. The point being, passives were viable skill choices depending how you wanted to play the game.

Haha, that's awesome!
Reply Quote
I used 3 builds which gave me endless hours of fun:

Whirlwind bard to farm mephisto.
-Summoner necro to farm EVRYTHING else.

My main char: a whirlwind druid who was SUPER FUN
Reply Quote
The build diversity in D2 came from the gear not the skill tree. The 1.10+ abomination was an even bigger example of how gear dependent builds were in D2.

The foundation of every single D2 build was the following:

STR - Just enough to equip your end game gear.
DEX - Enough to max out block rate
Energy - depends on buid.
HP - Everything else.

So much for diversity.


Yeah you have it right, I remember having to restart a few lvl 85+ because of lag causing me to add a few points to energy. Which nobody ever needed to do... Ever. Those were the days.


http://diablo2.diablowiki.net/Respecialization

Ya... too bad you couldn't, you know, respec your character an infinite amount of times?
Reply Quote
02/17/2013 02:02 PMPosted by Dwelve
LMAO. No, it does not. A build needs to be viable in endgame to be count as an actual build. D3 has very very few.


Go to the link site and click on the gem. It will randomize the skills and their runes. Start a game with Mp0 or Mp1 or Mp2 and rush from act 1 inferno to act 4 inferno. Tada, it was possible and in most cases, if your gear fits, it was rather easy. Inferno is endgame. Repeat the step 1000 times and see how you get a new build everytime -> Diablo 3 has more builds than Diablo 2.

And talking about viability. Try to start Diablo 2 with a zealot selffound and tell me he is as viable as the Blizzard sorc.

Believing such a silly statement is proof that you haven't played D2 and are in no position to argue on the matter. What I don't understand is how anyone can have to gall to make such a statement out of complete ignorance on the subject.


Saying such nonsense is proof that you haven't played D2 in a long time and that you are in no position to argue on the matter.

Precisely. I'd like to see anyone build a character using only long cooldown abilities or skipping the resource generators. There are so many restrictions on skill design/balance that many build options are eliminated right out of the gate. D2's flexibility enabled virtually any active skill to be viable given the proper investment.


I'd like to see you build a character using only passives in D2. You still don't seem to understand why cooldowns are in the game in the first place. Maybe you should calm down and think about why there are resources in the game.


Melee Zon nothing but passives was the only way I could kill uber Diablo with bad gear.
Reply Quote

I most frequently joined 8 player public games and solo'd which was actually difficult to farm efficiently. tomb vipers, stygian dolls and burning souls were powerful to deal with no matter how good your char was.


No, not really. Things just took 1-2 seconds longer to kill in an 8 player game.


GTFO Dolls could !@#$ing 2 shot chars, souls could !#*#@##! face, and vipers were ridiculous. Not to mention Iron Maiden in Chaos.

There was much more viable builds in D2 then D3 and they always worked. EX ) Melee sorc, mine got up to 84K Zeal, mostly elemental but if it hit it was mostly one shot in pvp.

And the Mercs, dungeons, Items, and quests were much better hands down.
Reply Quote
Okayyy. Go ahead and play a selffound zealot on /players 8 in hell!

Go play a selffound "passive only is still viable herpaderpa" on /players 8 in hell!

Go play the oh so viable assasin on /players 8 in hell.

Christ, arguing with nostalgia is like fighting the wind. You want to call the sorceress that uses 1! ability and one ability only a "lightning" sorc build? You want to call the other one a "blizzard" build? Fine, do so. But don't start pretending these are unique pretty flowers that were fun to play all the time. It's just so obvious to me you haven't played the game in a long time and it's even more obvious you used duped items all the time. Well gz. in D3 you can clear the entire inferno difficulty with just one ability and call it the "Fists of Thunder - Thunderclap" - build. Gz.

I don't know how you guys get off on this idea of being the unique flower using one ability and one ability only and having fun, but telling Blizzard to build the entire game around using just one single button is the most irrational criticism i have heard in a long time.

If you hate thinking on your own and prefer to search for a guide telling you what to do, then yeah Diablo 2 is your thing. Feel unique all you want playing that unviable character that needs dupes to be playable, but don't go in forums telling how this is the way a game is supposed to be designed. You want to take the "dumping down" of Diablo 3 to the next level, just so you can please your nostalgia... and i am glad Blizzard is not listening to the likes of you.

Btw, -5% lightning resist facets do NOT make the game complex. Stop fooling yourselves. Everybody understands the concepts of fhr, breaking resistances and maxblock after ONE GUIDE. So no, you are not outsmarting anybody, you are not superior to anybody for knowing about these mechanics.
Reply Quote
Okayyy. Go ahead and play a selffound zealot on /players 8 in hell!

Go play a selffound "passive only is still viable herpaderpa" on /players 8 in hell!

Go play the oh so viable assasin on /players 8 in hell.

Christ, arguing with nostalgia is like fighting the wind. You want to call the sorceress that uses 1! ability and one ability only a "lightning" sorc build? You want to call the other one a "blizzard" build? Fine, do so. But don't start pretending these are unique pretty flowers that were fun to play all the time. It's just so obvious to me you haven't played the game in a long time and it's even more obvious you used duped items all the time. Well gz. in D3 you can clear the entire inferno difficulty with just one ability and call it the "Fists of Thunder - Thunderclap" - build. Gz.

I don't know how you guys get off on this idea of being the unique flower using one ability and one ability only and having fun, but telling Blizzard to build the entire game around using just one single button is the most irrational criticism i have heard in a long time.

If you hate thinking on your own and prefer to search for a guide telling you what to do, then yeah Diablo 2 is your thing. Feel unique all you want playing that unviable character that needs dupes to be playable, but don't go in forums telling how this is the way a game is supposed to be designed. You want to take the "dumping down" of Diablo 3 to the next level, just so you can please your nostalgia... and i am glad Blizzard is not listening to the likes of you.

Btw, -5% lightning resist facets do NOT make the game complex. Stop fooling yourselves. Everybody understands the concepts of fhr, breaking resistances and maxblock after ONE GUIDE. So no, you are not outsmarting anybody, you are not superior to anybody for knowing about these mechanics.


Thats a whole lot of words for not really saying anything.

From What I gathered, you just confirmed that Fists of Thunder is the only viable build in D3.. Way to go build Diversity!!
Reply Quote
Its so sad how pathetic the wizard is now compared to how fun the sorc was in D2 such a let down.
Reply Quote
Okayyy. Go ahead and play a selffound zealot on /players 8 in hell!

Go play a selffound "passive only is still viable herpaderpa" on /players 8 in hell!

Go play the oh so viable assasin on /players 8 in hell.

Except the passive only which wasn't fun, you speak as though I haven't done these before. Do you really think the D2 vets haven't done this before? This is just another case of you showing your inexperience with D2. The zealot was a pretty common build for the pally. They could be quite powerful and were a base skill design for the auradin modified build. Auradins were among the most powerful build I've ever played in D2.


Christ, arguing with nostalgia is like fighting the wind. You want to call the sorceress that uses 1! ability and one ability only a "lightning" sorc build? You want to call the other one a "blizzard" build? Fine, do so. But don't start pretending these are unique pretty flowers that were fun to play all the time. It's just so obvious to me you haven't played the game in a long time and it's even more obvious you used duped items all the time. Well gz. in D3 you can clear the entire inferno difficulty with just one ability and call it the "Fists of Thunder - Thunderclap" - build. Gz.

You can stop pretending anyone played only one skill builds. Anyone who played with only one skill didn't reach hell, didn't use all of their skill points, or were doing a specific challenge build with the intent of making the game harder.


I don't know how you guys get off on this idea of being the unique flower using one ability and one ability only and having fun, but telling Blizzard to build the entire game around using just one single button is the most irrational criticism i have heard in a long time.

Again, you are making an argument for something that didn't really exist in the mainstream of D2.


If you hate thinking on your own and prefer to search for a guide telling you what to do, then yeah Diablo 2 is your thing. Feel unique all you want playing that unviable character that needs dupes to be playable, but don't go in forums telling how this is the way a game is supposed to be designed. You want to take the "dumping down" of Diablo 3 to the next level, just so you can please your nostalgia... and i am glad Blizzard is not listening to the likes of you.

More evidence you didn't play D2. Many players didn't look up builds. Many more managed to put their twists on common builds. No build was ever impossible with the proper investment. You are trying to build an argument from thin air using some imaginary vision you have for what D2 was.


Btw, -5% lightning resist facets do NOT make the game complex. Stop fooling yourselves. Everybody understands the concepts of fhr, breaking resistances and maxblock after ONE GUIDE. So no, you are not outsmarting anybody, you are not superior to anybody for knowing about these mechanics.
So? The game wasn't about proving your leet math skills. It was about building fun and powerful characters. It was about chasing down all the different tools you could find to push your character to the limits of ultimate power. The shear number of routes to get there provided the variety that made the game different with each playthrough/build.
Reply Quote
Okayyy. Go ahead and play a selffound zealot on /players 8 in hell!

Go play a selffound "passive only is still viable herpaderpa" on /players 8 in hell!

Go play the oh so viable assasin on /players 8 in hell.

Christ, arguing with nostalgia is like fighting the wind. You want to call the sorceress that uses 1! ability and one ability only a "lightning" sorc build? You want to call the other one a "blizzard" build? Fine, do so. But don't start pretending these are unique pretty flowers that were fun to play all the time. It's just so obvious to me you haven't played the game in a long time and it's even more obvious you used duped items all the time. Well gz. in D3 you can clear the entire inferno difficulty with just one ability and call it the "Fists of Thunder - Thunderclap" - build. Gz.

I don't know how you guys get off on this idea of being the unique flower using one ability and one ability only and having fun, but telling Blizzard to build the entire game around using just one single button is the most irrational criticism i have heard in a long time.

If you hate thinking on your own and prefer to search for a guide telling you what to do, then yeah Diablo 2 is your thing. Feel unique all you want playing that unviable character that needs dupes to be playable, but don't go in forums telling how this is the way a game is supposed to be designed. You want to take the "dumping down" of Diablo 3 to the next level, just so you can please your nostalgia... and i am glad Blizzard is not listening to the likes of you.

Btw, -5% lightning resist facets do NOT make the game complex. Stop fooling yourselves. Everybody understands the concepts of fhr, breaking resistances and maxblock after ONE GUIDE. So no, you are not outsmarting anybody, you are not superior to anybody for knowing about these mechanics.


Lol, I think you got the games backwards champ.

First I only play /players 8 if I want more xp, currently doing /players 7 for best drop rates.
I am doing selffound only anyway, since I only play single player (YAY not having to be online to play!!!) And my builds aren't efficient anyway. After MeleeZon I find every other Zon build boring. (even if they perform better)

None of this is Nostalgia... I am currently doing it, no rose tinted glasses here pal. And who uses 1 ability anyway? Sounds like a lot of game resets if you run into an immune pack. I also find it amusing that you think D2 build guides are what most people use. "Needs dupes to be playable" You make me laugh with that one. Hell Sigon set is all I need, Cleglaw's set crushing blow is amazing thanks.

The Facets comment would be relevant if I ever found one. I prefer an easy to make Infinity runeword on my act II merc for my Sorc to be viable at all times.

I am glad you enjoy D3 so much, but ignorant ranting is not going to help your cause, do a little research before going off on a tangent.
Edited by ShaiHulud#1223 on 2/17/2013 3:12 PM PST
Reply Quote

Please report any Code of Conduct violations, including:

Threats of violence. We take these seriously and will alert the proper authorities.

Posts containing personal information about other players. This includes physical addresses, e-mail addresses, phone numbers, and inappropriate photos and/or videos.

Harassing or discriminatory language. This will not be tolerated.

Forums Code of Conduct

Report Post # written by

Reason
Explain (256 characters max)

Reported!

[Close]