Diablo® III

Mana Regen isn't the problem for WD

the skill diversity problem is really just a ls/loh problem, only bears and well of souls have the right lifesteal mechanics to scale into the higher mps.
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lol at people who think of brawling as PVP.... lets see who can one shot each other first with 0 reason to do so other then sheer boredom.

Simply put the OP wasnt talking about Brawling or for some of u "lolPVP" he was talking about balance in terms of the actual part of the game that matters.
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You got a point OP but then again for mp9/10, I want bears,paranoia,harvest and slamdance for me it´s fun and efficient.

If I want to play with the countless of other wd builds, I just go and chill on mp6-8.

Like mentioned allready, other classes have the same issue when it comes to higher mp and build diversity.

Barb has 2 and a half builds for every mp.

Till patch 1.07 monk had 2 builds, tailwind for mp0 and the cookie cutter for every other mp.

Wizzies always complain that they got 2 builds, archon for low and permafreeze for high, Imo wiz has ok build diverstity and I like meteors myself.

DH is fuc^^^^ real hard, bad resource system and survivability and no real build diversity at any mp, hell there´s not many dh´s out there that can solo mp9/10 and most dh´s are useless on mp10 parties.

Just my 2 cents.
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If you think a 50m CM wiz is a real CM wiz, then good luck. A 50m cm wiz prob does around 500k effective DPS (and dies a lot), which is absolute !@#$ compared to a 50m witch doctor, which probably does 650k when averaging mana downtimes. Trust me, witch doctors have it bad, but don't even think that cm wizards have it good unless you have a considerable amount of gold put into them, think 500m+ as their damage sucks %^- if you can't run storm armor, shards
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there not gonna balance the game around high MP's.

/thread
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I have played the wiz, the barb, the DH, the monk, and the WD...mana is an issue but not too bad. They have reasonable cool downs on their abilities. The wizard...which I am most familiar has some limitations...one of which is the build diversity on higher mps. The CM build is the most viable (although living lightning has potential...just a bit harder). The CM build doesnt offer a lot of build diversity (you have to slot in 5 things to make it work...you might choose a different type of armor spell, but not a lot of variability)...it only leaves you one slot for build diversity. As far as mana regeneration...you need an APOC of at least 18 and a wicked high attack speed to proc mana regen. This gear costs a tonne...dont care what is being offered on diablo progress for 50 million...try running mp 9-10 in that gear...one word - toast! The wiz has only 100-120 mana and a meteor spell costs 50! ouch. Does the CM build work...yes (and very well)...but don't assume that the WD has such a crutch that the other characters don't. imho.
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Strawberry has a point.

But just parry up CMWW with Zero Dogs and your right on track.

You can run Zero Dog's and not be at Zero yet. Same with CMWW. And both cost alot less gold.

But it lets you farm lower mp's to build power levels and gear up and learn your build.

They both need to be tankie with high eHP and so on.

But on the hole Wizards can build out side of there two standared builds same as WD can and

just like WD it will work but your not going to be as fast in most casses.

But and the trade off also is differnt for each.

Wiz can build out side of CMWW/Archon and still not have any real resoures problems with the right gear and build there are more then a few. The second thing to note is that they reg there resoures alot faster.

On the other hand WD mana managment is a piece of cake out side of Bears/Acid cloud too.

Right now I would say Wiz and WD are very balanced with each other.

The one thing that sets Wizards ahead of WD is all there Hit on Crit ablitys/gear/passives just flat out work better then the WD's On Death abilitys/gear/passives at higher mp's and long boss fights.

And that is the core of most WD's complant's. Not mana management.

Edit: To clear that up would WD's even realy be complaining at all if GI/GF/and the MP gear all worked on Crit.

Well the stupid one's mite but not anyone else.
Edited by Umbra#1460 on 2/25/2013 12:24 AM PST
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You are best class for PvP and you want to be best farming class too??? Get real... Can't be best in every aspect...


Barab. what are you talking about?

Since when did PvP come into the picture? this is something that is NEW, that was RECENTLY IMPLEMENTED. What the man is asking for, is for a little help from the Devs with something that has been here SINCE LAUNCH!

hypothetical scenario for you Barab: Blizzard adds in a new zone that you excell at. WHELPS, with your logic, i think it would be appropriate to nerf w/e class it is you play b/c apparantly it's not fair to be good at something RECENTLY PATCHED IN.... AND to be decent at something that's been around since launch.

you should get real.
Edited by Kakashi#1364 on 2/25/2013 4:55 AM PST
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this whole problem stemmed when Whats-his-face decided to remove a skill slot. Going from 7 skills (complete/thoughtful builds) to 6 (thoughtful/incomplete builds).
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i agree w/ Umbra.

but also, One would think, that if you Gear for Max mana//Mana regen (taking a HUGE dps nerf), you would be able compensate by the passive PtV. NOPE.. can't do. your better off gearing dps, and passive for mana managment. you atleast get the addition of Spirit Vessel. dps gear+ mana passives + spirit vessel Vs. mana management gear + dps passives + .... you're still forced to get mana mangement passives.

PtV needs to be tweaked.
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WD popular spells like Zombie bears and Acid rain requires some gear tweaking to ensure smooth flow without mana bottle-neck especially in MP 9-10 when some elite packs takes a few minutes to bring down.

To optimize mana sustainability, 4 pc Zuni bonus is almost mandatory(including String of Skull with appropriate mana reduction bonus), Visage of Giyua or appropriate rare with mana regeneration and a rare ceremonial knife if you can find a good one or other weapons with desired stats will do..

Passive wise, Blood Ritual and VQ is recommended.

I under estimated widow-maker + VQ previously. I was running bears/AC/ROT build and was comfortable with 1.51 attack speed per second till I tried replacing ROT with widow-maker and increased my attack speed to 1.64 with a witching hour, I find that my mana pool never go down beyond 80% level when spamming bears with widow makers. I can even spam AC like 2-3 times every 5 seconds.

I think this buid/gear specs should sustain up to 1.75 attack speed with no mana issues. Devouring swarm is just added for the theme factor to complete the Bad Medicine build.
Edited by Choobie#6148 on 2/25/2013 7:12 AM PST
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@op: you clearly arent maxed out in mana regen gears,wd's arent the best balanced class out there but its possible to never run out of mana if you gear properly
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check my gears and build. I farm MP9 without a single death.
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