Diablo® III

After Playing HOTS...Really? *This* Is How You Boss!

HotS is amazing so far. +100 reputation with me there, Blizzard.
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03/12/2013 06:43 PMPosted by Cyberbard
HotS is amazing so far. +100 reputation with me there, Blizzard.


Agreed. There were tons of parts where I went 'oh man that is AWESOME!'. I did that...maybe once in D3. It was sad.

If they put this much work into the Diablo 3 expansion *and* go back and overhaul the bosses and crappier parts of D3 (the endless samey dungeons of A2 especially) it would make me think that Blizz are back on form.
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03/12/2013 06:41 PMPosted by Kestral
I found a boss that very similar to Belial fight in Hots.... I was like... really?Guess what... Instead of Q W E, I did 1234 spam which of course fails. (Likely because my mind is on auto D3 mode in excessive paragon level farming)


Except that that boss is actually more varied mechanically than Belial, is more challenging (at least on the difficulty I played) and most importantly is actually introduced to the players in a manner that makes them care about the confrotation before they fight him :|

Although I did feel a momentary panic when he didn't drop anything.


Maybe because you did not have 5 NV when you kill the boss, so nothing drops.

(Actually, there are. The whole planet is now yours)
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SC2 single player has always been a mix of RPG/RTS
Same as Warcraft 3.

SC2 mutiplayer is very fun, competitive, but full RTS unless you play custom games.

Always liked SC1,SC2, now waiting for my HOTS copy in a day or two.

I'm dumb founded how SC1 campaign and story greatly overwhelms that of Diablo 3.

Diablo 3 is supposedly RPG focused with Action.

Yet, there's really no RPG, there's action, and dumb down systematic features.

Shame the quality of D3 is extremely low.

At least the SC2 team has passion.

SC2 improved on SC1.
Diablo 2 improved on Diablo 1.

Diablo 3.... just slapped cain in the face and told him to GTFO.

An iconic npc, gets killed, in the most, undramatic and the slap in the face way.

It's d3's team way of saying, d1-d2 sucks, we're re-inventing diablo.

/gg d3 team.

EDIT:

I give credit to the Programmers for their engine, and the artist for the high level cinematic and art.

But overall it feels like they meshed a bunch of programmers and business/marketers together.

Not passionate game developers/programmers.

I guess profit and greed is today's model.
Edited by ktbanh#1757 on 3/12/2013 6:56 PM PDT
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I think its safe to say that despite its great sales, Diablo III was not up to par. All you do all day is hope to get some trifecta items, legendary's, set pieces, and what not to improve the damage of your character slightly. There are some builds, but they seem limited and to me hardly that fun.

The only reason I bother playing this game is simply to smash things up. I don't even care about reaching plevel 100, farming bosses or certain locations for gold or xp. That is fracking boring as hell. Apparently though quite a few people for some reason like doing boring mundane things over and over again for small bonuses over time.

Personally I just like to smash things up. If Blizzard's Diablo team created bosses that had more interesting fights, in really amazing environments that were so amazing we'd que up for it just to do it, then I would be all over it. If HotS is that good I might as well just play that and have fun with the multiplayer.
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At least the SC2 team has passion.SC2 improved on SC1.Diablo 2 improved on Diablo 1.Diablo 3.... just slapped cain in the face and told him to GTFO.An iconic npc, gets killed, in the most, undramatic and the slap in the face way.It's d3's team way of saying, d1-d2 sucks, we're re-inventing diablo.


SO MUCH THIS.

I'm actually putting together a big thread on this exactly, comparing D3 to Borderlands 2 (which I finally played through).

Borderlands 2 made me care more about a freaking BIRD than Diablo 3 did about it's main characters.
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Posts: 13,628
03/12/2013 07:07 PMPosted by Kestral
At least the SC2 team has passion.SC2 improved on SC1.Diablo 2 improved on Diablo 1.Diablo 3.... just slapped cain in the face and told him to GTFO.An iconic npc, gets killed, in the most, undramatic and the slap in the face way.It's d3's team way of saying, d1-d2 sucks, we're re-inventing diablo.


SO MUCH THIS.

I'm actually putting together a big thread on this exactly, comparing D3 to Borderlands 2 (which I finally played through).

Borderlands 2 made me care more about a freaking BIRD than Diablo 3 did about it's main characters.


I don't know man... I never cared about Diablo's main characters. Starcraft and Warcraft, on the other hand, did a great job making me care about characters! I will always remember when I had, reluctantly, kill Fenix because it was part of the main objective :(
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03/12/2013 07:10 PMPosted by DoomBringer


SO MUCH THIS.

I'm actually putting together a big thread on this exactly, comparing D3 to Borderlands 2 (which I finally played through).

Borderlands 2 made me care more about a freaking BIRD than Diablo 3 did about it's main characters.


I don't know man... I never cared about Diablo's main characters. Starcraft and Warcraft, on the other hand, did a great job making me care about characters! I will always remember when I had, reluctantly, kill Fenix because it was part of the main objective :(


Uh...I agreed with you :) I never cared about D3s characters. I cared a lot more about characters in SC2, Borderlands etc. Games that aren't even RPGs.
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Posts: 13,628
Just saw that first boss fight! It reminded me of Belial :o
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Posts: 671
Starcraft is one of the few things Blizzard has that's still good. I hope to god they don't make it worse by moving the good people over to Diablo.
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Just imagine if SC2 was planned to get ported to console, and get simplified overhaul so hard from the original Starcraft.
No need to upgrade anything,
All units can be purchased from only 4 types of building,
No gas gathering, just Mineral because it's complicated.
No micro management it's all automated.
No grouping of units, because it clutter the interface.

That's how Diablo old school fans feels.
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Just imagine if SC2 was planned to get ported to console, and get simplified overhaul so hard from the original Starcraft.
No need to upgrade anything,
All units can be purchased from only 4 types of building,
No gas gathering, just Mineral because it's complicated.
No micro management it's all automated.
No grouping of units, because it clutter the interface.

That's how Diablo old school fans feels.


Really?

I didn't mind the mechanics of D3. The simplification etc all sounded good on paper.

What sucked was the execution.
Bland, predictable plot with zero emotional investment.
Horrible itemization. Game built around the AH.
Poor graphical design.
Uninspired bosses with zero emotional investment.
Poorly balanced inter and intra class skills.
Horrible, unfulfilling endgame design.

Some of the above has finally started to be remedied...but on release it was awful.

HOTS, BL2 and other recent good games feel like they are designed by passionate devs. Diablo 3 felt like a game designed by accountants.
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03/12/2013 08:23 PMPosted by Kestral
I didn't mind the mechanics of D3. The simplification etc all sounded good on paper.


SC2 stay true to it's predecessor, Why cant D3?
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Posts: 4,661
Just imagine if SC2 was planned to get ported to console, and get simplified overhaul so hard from the original Starcraft.
No need to upgrade anything,
All units can be purchased from only 4 types of building,
No gas gathering, just Mineral because it's complicated.
No micro management it's all automated.
No grouping of units, because it clutter the interface.

That's how Diablo old school fans feels.


Really?

I didn't mind the mechanics of D3. The simplification etc all sounded good on paper.

What sucked was the execution.
Bland, predictable plot with zero emotional investment.
Horrible itemization. Game built around the AH.
Poor graphical design.
Uninspired bosses with zero emotional investment.
Poorly balanced inter and intra class skills.
Horrible, unfulfilling endgame design.

Some of the above has finally started to be remedied...but on release it was awful.

HOTS, BL2 and other recent good games feel like they are designed by passionate devs. Diablo 3 felt like a game designed by accountants.


I'll agree on this. I think everyone thought that the simplification SOUNDED good but no one really thought of the consequences.

Skill Trees is one example: Getting rid of the skill tree meant a TON less replay value and also less if not any adding to your skill build via itemization.

Another example is weapon damage being the only thing you focus on in Diablo 3. Players are stuck with only their DPS as an option in dealing damage. Diablo 2 you had proc on hits like bleeding (d3's version is terrible), crushing blow, chain lightning and many other damaging proc on hit. Diablo 3's damage proc on hits only appear on legendary items and their damage doesn't scale so it's really a joke.

THEE most ironic thing that Blizzard's D3 team did was openly mock Diablo 2 and it's creator and fans only to copy elements of Diablo 2 after release (monster power, ubers, paragon leveling in which Blizzard was at first against having a long level grind experience *thus level 60 instead of 99*).
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Diablo 3 boss was hard, but they nerfed it after patch 1.03.

I still remember:

- I have to watch Belial's animation to guess which attack he will use, and avoid it before he smash. also have to move from poison explosive..any failure to do this = dead

- I have to watch Siegebreaker's animation and run away as soon as he start his power combo attack, it will one shot you.

- for Azmadon, one fireball can kill you, even on melee range. and I have to walk out his fallen corpse etc... basical all his ability are danger and you can only attack him when he don't use ability.

- Izual , one of hardest boss, need to learn how to avoid his instant dead charge by move around circle etc

It was pretty challenge but got nerfed sooo hard because everyone complant about it.
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03/12/2013 07:46 PMPosted by DoomBringer
Just saw that first boss fight! It reminded me of Belial :o


Well, I think it is Belial - The lord of lies.

He all along was lying in D3, he was the boss meant for SC2....
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Posts: 837
comparing sc2 with diablo would be like comparing diablo to torchlight. two different games.diablo never had the kind of fund and expectation sc series had, and is much more commercialized as a result.
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Posts: 4,661
Diablo 3 boss was hard, but they nerfed it after patch 1.03.

I still remember:

- I have to watch Belial's animation to guess which attack he will use, and avoid it before he smash. also have to move from poison explosive..any failure to do this = dead

- I have to watch Siegebreaker's animation and run away as soon as he start his power combo attack, it will one shot you.

- for Azmadon, one fireball can kill you, even on melee range. and I have to walk out his fallen corpse etc... basical all his ability are danger and you can only attack him when he don't use ability.

- Izual , one of hardest boss, need to learn how to avoid his instant dead charge by move around circle etc

It was pretty challenge but got nerfed sooo hard because everyone complant about it.


Agreed. Before the massive nerf, bosses in Inferno were insanely challenging on the verge of unfair lol.
Edited by DeMasked#1233 on 3/12/2013 8:50 PM PDT
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Posts: 671
The problem with D3 is the utter failure to tie damage with mechanics. Did that molten mob just run through you? Sorry, you're dead. Proper mechanics should be like the Belial fight. Give players visual cues, and more importantly the chance to do something (as opposed to equip something) to mitigate incoming damage.

Because the mechanics in D3 are so bad, we've had to resort to just stacking life, armor and resist. It's the same thing with DPS. Since all the proc stuff is severely gimped, we're reduced to stacking cc, cd and asi. The end result of all this? Combat is reduced to utterly boring tank and spank affairs.

Trying to simplify things was the worst decision JW ever made. Complexity is good. Complexity makes things interesting.
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03/12/2013 04:34 PMPosted by vexorian
Great. Now we have WoW accounts posting Starcraft 2 reviews in Diablo 3 forums.


imao
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