Diablo® III

How many legendaries should be junk when you find em?

Id' say 90% of them if not more are a brimstone when you find them.

I'm curious as to what everyone thinks on how many of them should be valued as a brimstone?
You really could find 10 pairs of say Lacuni's in a row or even 10 Echo fury's in a row and they could all be worthless. Nothing more than a brimstone. I've already found 2 of each and both were brimstones.

Soo.. Should 20% be a brimstone? 40%? 60%?

Is the 90% the way it really should be ?
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@Jersey what thread are you responding to? You aren't even close to talking about the topic....

Just my opinion, I think legendaries should not have the random affixes. Having low end and high end legendaries is a good thing, not everything should be godly powerful. Also weapon damage for legendaries has too large a gap. Take Echoing Fury for example, it can roll between 687 and 1323 dps. This is a crazy huge damage difference that doesn't make sense to me.
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Soo.. Should 20% be a brimstone? 40%? 60%?

Is the 90% the way it really should be ?


There's no way to change the figures long-term. In fact, if 90% are brimstones today, without changing any items at all, 95% will be brimstones in a month (or two or 3's time).

As you well know, legendaries that sold for 500k-1m a few months ago are now brimstones, and legendaries which sold for 50m a few months ago are now 5mill. Thats the way it works, everyday there are more items, and nowhere for them to go.

Those !@#$ty EFs and Lacunis, would have been sellable a while back, now the market is flooded with them (think about it, you've found 10 lacunis, who is going to use the ones that don't roll well).

For interest's sake, look at the HC AH. Brimstones are ~300k each and the cheapest IK Helm (which would sell for 50-100k on the SC AH) is over 20mill. Same item, different supply/demand.

Hypothetically speaking, lets say you changed lacunis to always roll with 3-6% crit and all res. Short term, almost all lacuni's would be sellable. After a few weeks (or a month or 2), lacuni's with low crit and low all res would be practically brimstones, they would either need a high crit roll or a good random stat. And after a few months, unless they rolled with a good random stat and high crit, they would be brimstones and you'd be back to the 90%+ are brimstones scenario.
Edited by Menlyn#2964 on 3/15/2013 9:36 AM PDT
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All legendaries should hold a value to someone. Salvaging a legendary should not be taken lightly, and brimstones should not be as cheap as they currently are.

This is of course a preferred scenario, and not our current situation.
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@Jersey what thread are you responding to? You aren't even close to talking about the topic....

Just my opinion, I think legendaries should not have the random affixes. Having low end and high end legendaries is a good thing, not everything should be godly powerful. Also weapon damage for legendaries has too large a gap. Take Echoing Fury for example, it can roll between 687 and 1323 dps. This is a crazy huge damage difference that doesn't make sense to me.


This one, and I did respond to it. I didn't dive into Brimstones much because they make useless gear. And part of the problem with this game is there is so much Bad gear that most of it does in fact get sharded into Brimstones

The Problem is NOT mats. Its the gear! which was Exactly what I discussed! along with a couple other things.

Have a great day!


lewl?
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As many have stated, no legendary should be junk.

But, because of many reasons (design-rng-boa crafting, etc) 99.99% of them are.

Let's hope this gets fixed for good in future patches (aka band aids) and expansion sets.

:)
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As many have stated, no legendary should be junk.

But, because of many reasons (design-rng-boa crafting, etc) 99.99% of them are.

Let's hope this gets fixed for good in future patches (aka band aids) and expansion sets.


03/15/2013 09:35 AMPosted by CuRsEd
All legendaries should hold a value to someone.


Not really possible.. Lets take a Dead Man's Legacy (which even the worst possible roll, is better than 95%+ of rare quivers). Assuming every player has a DH, they can only use 1 DML. So at the start, over time, you find one and equip it, now you find another one, so you take the better one and sell the worse one. At some point, there will be more DML's in the game than DHs, and at that point, the worst ones will be worthless, and what was previously a mid range DML is now a low-end one.

There are two possible ways to change this.
1. Nerf the legendary drop rates HARD. This doesn't really change the scenario, it just increases the time required to reach saturation point. This would have been better for the economy (perhaps), however, players like to find items, and going days (or weeks) without legendaries isn't fun.

2. Remove all random stats. Make the legendaries just like D2, where they have fixed rolls (or in a few cases, very minor stat differences). This achieves the goal of making all legendaries worth something to someone, however, by the same token, all legendaries become worthless. Everyone has the absolute BiS gear, and once saturation point is reached, those items will still be brimstones. In Diablo2, Shako was the BiS helm for many classes, yet everyone had a shako, and even after ladder seasons were reset, it would only take a few weeks for everyone to have one.

PS. The DML example can apply to most items, with a bit of variance. No matter what you do, your character can only equip 13 items, (with maybe a few extra in the stash for variable builds), and after those items have been equipped to a reasonable level across the player base, saturation point is reached, and the bottom tier of items becomes worthless. As time passes, the bar is raised, and items which were previously sellable or "useful" become worthless.
Edited by Menlyn#2964 on 3/15/2013 9:54 AM PDT
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I've wondered if they should up the vendor value of legendaries.

Hypothetically, let's say you made legendaries have a vendor value of 50,000 gold. Brimstones would likely follow in price because otherwise people would just vendor them instead of salvage for the gold.

This also would set a low end price for the legendary on the AH. So talking about legendaries dropping to point, the point would just be higher. They will always drop and there is no way around that IMO and actually I think it's fine anyway.

But at that point at least brimstones would be worth something.

I still think they need to take a certain number of legendaries and make them so they simply cannot roll bad. Sure their value on the AH will likely be less and that is fine. But it will also reduce the number of brimstones being brought into the game. Much in the same way this next patch may do the same thing.
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It would be nice if 60% of the legs were junk, instead of the 99.9999999% that it is today.
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03/15/2013 10:15 AMPosted by Fatvirgin
Just my opinion, I think legendaries should not have the random affixes. Having low end and high end legendaries is a good thing, not everything should be godly powerful. Also weapon damage for legendaries has too large a gap. Take Echoing Fury for example, it can roll between 687 and 1323 dps. This is a crazy huge damage difference that doesn't make sense to me.


I can't agree with this more. Diablo 2 did this perfectly. If you found an Azurewrath or a Stormshield or a Shaftstop, you knew the item would be good for your new barb, even if it was poorer quality. (Before runewards of course). The high end legendaries should be different from the low end in stat range, not affixes.
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Drastically up the quality of legendaries and you'd have to drastically cut the drop rates...

Then the qq about never finding legendaries will begin again.

This is the song that never ends.
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Trust me there are to many people that don't think all legendaries should be good. As soon as you put the proper stats on them to make them good, then people start saying you just gave them everything!!

Some of the biggest problems I see right now are things like All resist. It rolls so low that you cannot build your resists up high enough with say 4 or 5 item slots.. There should be some item slots where AR rolls higher thereby allowing you not to need it on other item slots. But then people scream it's OP'd and the game remains broken with you needing like 5 or 6 properties on every item slot. It's just a terrible design IMO. I was thinking Chest armors and shields should roll from like 75AR to 150 AR. This would make items that don't roll AR but have all the other right properties more valuable because they could then be used.

But apparently people think choices is fun. I'd agree if I wasn't choosing between which stat I want to gimp myself with by giving up.
Edited by AxeLord#1992 on 3/15/2013 10:50 AM PDT
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The term "Junk" is relative to where you currently are in stats when a legendary drops. I have found several legendaries that I have given to a friend that were upgrades to his rares but were not upgrades to my AH legendaries. The biggest problem I see is having to buy items to find better items. Really bad design on their part. The items and AH should have only been setup for min-maxing but they went ahead with a complete random drop system and that makes it too hard for regular players to find items at a decent pace to feel any kind of reward from this game. I am glad that they are addressing some of these issues, just wish it had been done 6 months ago.
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03/15/2013 10:54 AMPosted by Ronix
The term "Junk" is relative to where you currently are in stats when a legendary drops. I have found several legendaries that I have given to a friend that were upgrades to his rares but were not upgrades to my AH legendaries. The biggest problem I see is having to buy items to find better items. Really bad design on their part. The items and AH should have only been setup for min-maxing but they went ahead with a complete random drop system and that makes it too hard for regular players to find items at a decent pace to feel any kind of reward from this game. I am glad that they are addressing some of these issues, just wish it had been done 6 months ago.

I wish it had been done 12 months ago.

I don't think this patch will go far enough anyway. I think it will be another baby step at best. But I hope I am wrong.

Also I disagree on your definition of junk. Items like Frostburn gloves will never be good. Any pair of rares with high main stat and attack speed and all resists are better.
Edited by AxeLord#1992 on 3/15/2013 11:10 AM PDT
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My 2c's.

I think most Legendaries should NOT be junk when you find them. Their stats should be such that even with RNG, they are all still "Good" to "Great" even borderline "BiS". Right now, with RNG, most of the true end of game legendaries can vary from worse than bad - BiS, ... My friend got two drops last night from one elite group (lucky bastard) one was green one was gold. Ended up being IK gloves and Manticore. The gloves rolled 10%CC, but two conflicting main stats, and worthless other stats. The Manticore rolled two sockets, 80%CD, 200 Dex, and xxx life on hit. Freaking awesome...except for the DPS was (no joke) 950... What a shame.

I found frostburns last night...instant brim. The problem is that I don't expect all Legendaries to be BiS, but because itemization is so horrible, there just isn't a place for frostburns. They can NEVER be worthwhile. Well maybe if you could wear them at level 20...but you can't!...they are a horrible level 60 item.

I wish it was more like D2 where most "legendary" items were at least good, but just the percent of life steal varied slightly...so like you knew the titans revenge was going to be cool, you just kept looking for the 200ed, 8ll one (I can't remember what max stats were), but even the worst one, 4ll and 155% ed (something like that) still give you +2 to all skills and +2 to some other skills. Long story short, when you found one, even the worst one, it was still pretty good.
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