Diablo® III

WotB and Archon - Whack Attack

04/19/2013 04:26 PMPosted by Travis Day
Whatever you do, I hope you don't penalize those of us that use it as intended, that is people that just use it for the occasional boost and not a permanent boost.


I want to make this point clear. Wrath is an awesome ability, when the game first launched players used it the way it was designed to be used which was as a huge, temporary, power boost to kill a hard champ or fight a boss. The problem stems from the ability to keep it up 100% of the time. Any future change that we would consider making to either this or Archon would be focused on making these not a 100% uptime abilities. So yes as was stated above Wrath isn't the problem, Thrive on Chaos and the assist duration extending mechanic of Archon are the problems.


'' players used it the way it was designed to be used ''

force us to play which they decide WHAT IS FUN again !!
04/19/2013 04:26 PMPosted by Travis Day
Whatever you do, I hope you don't penalize those of us that use it as intended, that is people that just use it for the occasional boost and not a permanent boost.


Thrive on Chaos and the assist duration extending mechanic of Archon are the problems.


Dude, you just buffed this spell on the PTR. You'd think if you didn't like the gameplay, you'd fix that instead. Maybe remove the +1 sec duration on kill and make it benefit from Disintegrate's rune for interesting synergy.
FACT!

04/19/2013 04:44 PMPosted by Jt3z


I want to make this point clear. Wrath is an awesome ability, when the game first launched players used it the way it was designed to be used which was as a huge, temporary, power boost to kill a hard champ or fight a boss. The problem stems from the ability to keep it up 100% of the time. Any future change that we would consider making to either this or Archon would be focused on making these not a 100% uptime abilities. So yes as was stated above Wrath isn't the problem, Thrive on Chaos and the assist duration extending mechanic of Archon are the problems.
If you guys happen to do this you will lose more than half ur player base.
04/19/2013 04:10 PMPosted by Travis Day
I have a love hate relationship with Wrath and Archon for that matter. This is a topic that I felt I should at least comment on since it's come up on many occasions. There is no fundamental flaw with having a 2 minute cooldown ability that transforms your character and is really powerful, the problem is when it becomes a forgone conclusion that these AWESOME abilities are up 100% of the time and instead of being excited that they are up you are annoyed when they fall off. We have talked about what if anything we want to do with these abilities in the long term. I will say we have no short term plans to change them but we don't like that they aren't fulfilling their original purpose which is to provide a really awesome button that mixes up the tempo of combat for a small window of time.


See, Travis, that's how you see Archon, but it's not how all players see it. I wish your coterie of four-five designers would stop making assumptions about how others feel because many archon players I've played with are not "annoyed" when archon drops; like myself, they are just trying to get archon back quickly because we LOVE it and are excited to use it. This is not frustration or annoyance. There are many frustrations and annoyances about this game, and archon is NOT one of mine.

Archon has several disadvantages, and it is has no crowd control immunity from elites. You have to cancel it yourself to rebuff often. Comparing Archon and Wrath of the Berserker is unfair. They're not in the same league.
Posts: 1,422
04/19/2013 04:44 PMPosted by Jt3z


I want to make this point clear. Wrath is an awesome ability, when the game first launched players used it the way it was designed to be used which was as a huge, temporary, power boost to kill a hard champ or fight a boss. The problem stems from the ability to keep it up 100% of the time. Any future change that we would consider making to either this or Archon would be focused on making these not a 100% uptime abilities. So yes as was stated above Wrath isn't the problem, Thrive on Chaos and the assist duration extending mechanic of Archon are the problems.
If you guys happen to do this you will lose more than half ur player base.


And its dwindling. Did I spell that correctly?
04/19/2013 04:10 PMPosted by Travis Day
I have a love hate relationship with Wrath and Archon for that matter. This is a topic that I felt I should at least comment on since it's come up on many occasions. There is no fundamental flaw with having a 2 minute cooldown ability that transforms your character and is really powerful, the problem is when it becomes a forgone conclusion that these AWESOME abilities are up 100% of the time and instead of being excited that they are up you are annoyed when they fall off. We have talked about what if anything we want to do with these abilities in the long term. I will say we have no short term plans to change them but we don't like that they aren't fulfilling their original purpose which is to provide a really awesome button that mixes up the tempo of combat for a small window of time.


how about leave them alone, buff other abilities to be just as good a choice. i head Demon Hunters are in a bad spot.

Dont nerf. Buff.

if you MUST nerf... nerf so the people who drop 15m on a gear set can farm MP10 trash. thats gimpy. but people who have dropped 100m+ on item sets... leave them the flip alone.
Posts: 901
Whatever you do, I hope you don't penalize those of us that use it as intended, that is people that just use it for the occasional boost and not a permanent boost.


I want to make this point clear. Wrath is an awesome ability, when the game first launched players used it the way it was designed to be used which was as a huge, temporary, power boost to kill a hard champ or fight a boss. The problem stems from the ability to keep it up 100% of the time. Any future change that we would consider making to either this or Archon would be focused on making these not a 100% uptime abilities. So yes as was stated above Wrath isn't the problem, Thrive on Chaos and the assist duration extending mechanic of Archon are the problems.


Yet in this very last patch, that isn't even out yet, you buffed archon to benefit from assists so it can stay up longer. You just created (or made worse) a problem.

What the hell are we supposed to understand from that?
Edited by Pickering#1242 on 4/19/2013 8:05 PM PDT
04/19/2013 08:04 PMPosted by Lockheed


I want to make this point clear. Wrath is an awesome ability, when the game first launched players used it the way it was designed to be used which was as a huge, temporary, power boost to kill a hard champ or fight a boss. The problem stems from the ability to keep it up 100% of the time. Any future change that we would consider making to either this or Archon would be focused on making these not a 100% uptime abilities. So yes as was stated above Wrath isn't the problem, Thrive on Chaos and the assist duration extending mechanic of Archon are the problems.


Yet in this very last patch, that isn't even out yet, you buffed archon to benefit from assists so it can stay up longer. You just created (or made worse) a problem.

What the hell are we supposed to understand from that?


Your suppose to understand that the development team has no idea were to go with the game....game came out super hard....almost impossible...nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf....o to easy...okay now lets nerf the skills......they're going in circles without a plan.
Posts: 1,422
04/19/2013 06:41 PMPosted by Oraniquitis
If you've never seen a cooldown in an arpg, you've never played a decent one.


Diablo 2. Tell me how long the longest cooldown in Diablo 2 is.
04/19/2013 04:26 PMPosted by Travis Day
extending mechanic of Archon are the problems.


Why even have Archon if you can't extend the duration?

You have to go out of your way to select skills/passives that fit well with an Archon build. You can't use other skills when in Archon mode, so outside of self-buffs, no other skills have synergy with it. You already need insane gear to be able to maintain it on higher MP's.

Changing this in the slightest would be a very poor decision and would probably just pigeonhole even more players into CMWW/SNS.
Hi,

I haven't read the entire thread (yet!), but I felt I already have to credit the OP for a more or less spot on analysis on how overpowered WotB is.

The sad thing is the majority of Barbarian players don't have the balls to admit how brokenly overpowered their class is - for whatever reason. Those people are usually the ones who lurk in the forums to spam their "DH isnt weak..they have highest sheet dps!!11one" crap.

So, all the kudos to you for being one of the few Barb players to admit WotB is brokenly overpowered. And I'm glad Blizzard realizes it as well, though I'm also sad they don't intend any shortterm nerfs which I can't really understand since even if all WotB values were halfed (!) Barbarians would still be way overpowered and by far the strongest class.
Posts: 901
Hi,

I haven't read the entire thread (yet!), but I felt I already have to credit the OP for a more or less spot on analysis on how overpowered WotB is.

The sad thing is the majority of Barbarian players don't have the balls to admit how brokenly overpowered their class is - for whatever reason. Those people are usually the ones who lurk in the forums to spam their "DH isnt weak..they have highest sheet dps!!11one" crap.

So, all the kudos to you for being one of the few Barb players to admit WotB is brokenly overpowered. And I'm glad Blizzard realizes it as well, though I'm also sad they don't intend any shortterm nerfs which I can't really understand since even if all WotB values were halfed (!) Barbarians would still be way overpowered and by far the strongest class.


The biggest issue with it is the CC immunity, combined with it being up almost always.

Take one or the other out and it will be fine.
Edited by Pickering#1242 on 4/19/2013 8:33 PM PDT
Travis, Please do not nerf Archon. Archon is a very fun build but it is hard to use on higher MP's so its not overpowered. Lets have more buffs and less nerfs to the game.
04/19/2013 04:10 PMPosted by Travis Day
There is no fundamental flaw with having a 2 minute cooldown ability that transforms your character and is really powerful


While you are at this, check out Witch Doctor "Fetish Army" as well.
Edited by Fireblade#1295 on 4/19/2013 8:33 PM PDT
04/19/2013 04:52 PMPosted by Davez
WoTB kinda sux to keep up 100% of the time. We cant even get all the loots on the ground because of it. We cant rez a party member because of it. We have to RUSH to the next grp of mobs because of it.
first world problem? lol...
-Belt %3 ls
-Passive %3 ls
-Passive 5%cc + 50%cd.
Meanwhile DH has Archery passive which only gives 50% critdmg and forces you to use a 2h Crossbow - which is the only viable option for a DH aside from the Calamity Grenade build.
they are concerned about perma archon and they still implement archon assists.
i don't get it.

archon has to channel, can not use other skills, depends on quick kills and big mobs, and is vulnerable to CC.

WotB is an entirely different thing.

In Fallout games, wotb would be a perk (pros only) and archon a trait (pros + cons).
04/19/2013 04:26 PMPosted by Travis Day
Wrath is an awesome ability, when the game first launched players used it the way it was designed to be used which was as a huge, temporary, power boost to kill a hard champ or fight a boss.


I want to make this point clear, Insanity and Slaughter are huge power boosts. Archon is a huge power and resource boost.

ToC is a more for mobility, I could care less about the power boost. Barb has no decent CC breaking skills without long cool downs other than ToC.
This topic has reached its post limit. You may no longer post or reply to posts for this topic.

Please report any Code of Conduct violations, including:

Threats of violence. We take these seriously and will alert the proper authorities.

Posts containing personal information about other players. This includes physical addresses, e-mail addresses, phone numbers, and inappropriate photos and/or videos.

Harassing or discriminatory language. This will not be tolerated.

Forums Code of Conduct

Report Post # written by

Reason
Explain (256 characters max)
Submit Cancel

Reported!

[Close]