Diablo® III

PvP Guild (PayToWin) Awaits Open Challenge!

It's nice to see different classes taking top spots in the VC tournaments.
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Probably will do VC tourney this week if I can hit my goal of 200kdps and 1m elite EHP unbuffed
Edited by Flim2theFlam#1308 on 6/18/2013 1:05 PM PDT
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how do i join this? add me please, fr0g#1123
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@FR0G, my list is full but please add Asmodai#1359 and make the topic (guild tryout)
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Congratulations to Mafia (1st) and SkyIsLimit (2nd) for taking 1st two spot in the 8th VC tournament!

Damn, if only Mafia didn't run into Asmodai in the round of 8, we might see history repeating itself again.

@Iria You need to try harder next time. ;)
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Yeah congrats to Mafia! Some good matches tonight but lots of good players knocked out early :(

Really neat idea, but if you get all the top players who will join the other guild :P

Also I was posting in the VC Rules a lot of people have been asking me about retracting the Plague bat ban vs Monk. Figured this would be a better place to ask since I cannot comment on the matchup.

http://www.viciouscattle.com/forum/thread-1327-1-1.html
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Congratulations to Mafia (1st) and SkyIsLimit (2nd) for taking 1st two spot in the 8th VC tournament!

Damn, if only Mafia didn't run into Asmodai in the round of 8, we might see history repeating itself again.

@Iria You need to try harder next time. ;)


It was really a coinflip victory for Mafia lol. We were both at 20% hp and he landed a critical Dashing Strike as I was about to launch an Impale lol. The score was 3:2 for Mafia but not as close as the SaltyDog vs Lazar duel lol.
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A lot of wds have commented on this already, which is vs. top gear players plague bats is needed. Its our only source of major dmg comparable to bells or wotb. Taking it out leaves us handicapped to play one build, which is full dps to do dmg with haunt or other gimmicky skills and hope we get a crit. Plain and simple bats was taken out early on in tournaments because it was "op" at the time, however nowadays with newly established builds things are beginning to be more balanced. On the flipside, i do believe bats should not be used on wiz and dh since they both lack the burst dmg of a monk or barb.
Edited by Asmodai#1359 on 6/24/2013 4:53 PM PDT
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Yeah, I agree with allowing Plague Bats on Monks. As a DH, I have no options versus a tanky WD with them. Against low-medium EHP WD, I can use Impale + Fan of Knives (even against Plague Bat WD). Against tanky WD, I can use Rapid Fire; but Plague Bats hard counters Rapid Fire builds (DH shots get stopped by pets, the Plague Bats do not). So tanky Plague Bat WDs are near impossible for DH. Also, the damage those Plague Bats do is insane!
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Well said Asmo & Iria!
Even in my 3 mill ehp tank build with 1000 AR and 200k HP bats will still melt me.
The DoT they produce seems to be the highest on game right now.

Also, unfortunately in that build my dps is only 100k...
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Congrats Mafia!

Just watched the fight? Dashing strike kill?
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Witch doctors main counter is burst damage. Thus the 2 melee classes is able to take witch doctors out when they do 2 consecutive critical hits of burst damage. There are no other classes that have this ability.

I have chat with Pony on this many weeks back and both of us agreed that we need to let the players play more matches so that they can see the outcome and agree on a lift to banning bats vs monks and WOTB barbs. (Sorry Asmodai, need a witch doctor like yours to illustrate this :P)

Another topic that was covered back in our chat is bunker styled DH. For this, my personal take is that it has to be banned. It gives DH that edge. For WD to fight that, with bats banned against DH, this match will last very long. For monks and barbs and wizard, it will be similar.
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Im down to lead the Section Beta part of this guild! The Ying to the Yang :) Ill look for other members to fill in!
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For the 4th time in a row another guild member has taken this weeks VC tournament! This time it is Asmodai. Who will put an end to the guilds winning streak!?

Also, very nice job to Iria for getting revenge on The Maf.
Edited by Refraktion#1134 on 6/30/2013 10:58 PM PDT
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06/27/2013 09:13 PMPosted by Kira
Another topic that was covered back in our chat is bunker styled DH. For this, my personal take is that it has to be banned. It gives DH that edge. For WD to fight that, with bats banned against DH, this match will last very long. For monks and barbs and wizard, it will be similar.


Yeah this is a tricky issue. Without bunker style, the match tilts in favor of a very tanky WD with Haunts and pets. With bunker style, the match goes to stalemate (but at least it isn't really one-sided). DH can beat low EHP and medium EHP WDs with some trouble but I have been moderately successful in these cases. However, against high EHP WDs, I simply cannot damage them enough before dying since I need to penetrate their wall of dogs (which had more EHP than the WD themselves)! The WD however, can easily attack the DH since they only have 1 pet and most of the WD's attacks go over obstacles. This pet issue is exacerbated with Spirit Walk/Vessel, Healing Journey, Blood Ritual, etc.

Short story:
Allow plague bats = DH lose to tanky WD.
Ban bunker style = DH lose to tanky WD.
Ban pets and bunker style = DH have advantage to WD.

GG to Asmodai for winning the tournament, but it was a slow and stale duel!
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[

GG to Asmodai for winning the tournament, but it was a slow and stale duel!


Most riveting duel ever, had me on the edge of my seat the whole time!
Edited by scrapz#1142 on 7/1/2013 5:29 PM PDT
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07/01/2013 02:01 PMPosted by Iria
Ban pets and bunker style = DH have advantage to WD.

What about banning bunker for DH and banning dogs + plague bats for WD.

Only Gargantuan is allowed for WD as pet. This will be similar to DH having a boar.

Probably need some test runs to know if this will be a balanced match up between DH and WD.
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Ban pets and bunker style = DH have advantage to WD.

What about banning bunker for DH and banning dogs + plague bats for WD.

Only Gargantuan is allowed for WD as pet. This will be similar to DH having a boar.

Probably need some test runs to know if this will be a balanced match up between DH and WD.


I think this scenario will be in favor of DH, but we can test later.

Edit: It also depends on your definition of "bunker style". My definition of banning it is simply banning Sentry - Aid Station and Guardian Turret, but still allowing Brooding and Perfectionist.
Edited by Iria#1342 on 7/2/2013 12:09 PM PDT
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We need to put it to test to know if this rule (No bunker Vs No Dogs + No Plague Bats) alone is suffice to make it more balanced between DH and WD.

By bunker style, my definition is with sentry + (aid station or guardian turret). Brooding and perfectionist is allowed. The 4% regen makes it too OP.

It is the same situation whereby barbs were supposed to get 4% regen from inspiring presence. That didn't happen because it was way too OP in PTR test.

The same goes to guardian turret. From tests that were made, 15% damage reduction is very similar to the 2% extra life regen.
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Update: Did the no dogs + no plague bats, just Garg as pet test with Iria. Doesn't seem to work. Not able to get a kill off Iria at all while he gets all the kills. Basically no pressure applied to him.

Rapid fire + Thrill of the Hunt expose the need for dogs as they will help to block the 2 seconds immobilization that occurs every 7 seconds. Without dogs, the WD is opened to 2 windows of 2 seconds damage from rapid fire. The 15 seconds cooldown window of spirit walk can only help to handle 1 root. End up DH has the mobility and WD is without.

We will be doing more tests tomorrow on the following setup:

No dogs + no plague bats vs No bunker + no thrill.


I don't think this will work either cos personally I feel it will very likely tilt the favor towards WD. Anyway, will need to test this out to know.

At current state, DH vs WD is the toughest match up to balance but plague bats is definitely too OP for DH to handle. It has to be banned.

@Iria Thanks for the test runs. I will likely do a few more test runs with you using the "no dogs + no plague bats" (the setup used in first test run which you can use Thrill). But this time round I will use a SOJ to see if it helps to apply some pressure.
Edited by Kira#1414 on 7/5/2013 2:59 AM PDT
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