Diablo® III

If Duped Gold is Traced to Your Account >> Rollback

05/08/2013 04:32 PMPosted by Ramzies
You think Blizzard cares? They could have easily done the same with botters but then that would take away from their proffit.


This.^
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this would be best
but dont think blizzard is smart enough to do it
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Posts: 5,948


I don't think the issue with "scams" was ever that they didn't have logs. It's just something that they have never done for this game. If you put items/gold in the trade window and hit accept... thats final. There was no exploit or anything... just human error.

As far as item drops... If the items were bought with duped gold... I don't see why it matters where the items end up. If the items came from a in game trade or an AH listing... they will be flagged for rollback.


Wrong, there were scripts that would swap gold amounts and hit accept before it was humanly possible to react before they fixed the trade window but w/e


We'll just agree to disagree :)
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05/08/2013 05:19 PMPosted by Glock
Glock, do you finally see the light?


Before a patch... you think the first step isn't to make backups ?


i really hope they do, but this is blizzard, so who knows.
its not like they consider the state of game economy critical.
they've already got their 700m from selling the game.
they're a faceless corporation led by ruthless business leeches where profit above anything else is the gospel.
if they can save money by doing weekly backups instead of daily/hourly you can be assured it is done so.
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Posts: 5,948
this would be best
but dont think blizzard is smart enough to do it


I'm just some dude that plays around with computers... if I can come up with this I sure hope people getting paid to manage servers and data can :D

i really hope they do, but this is blizzard, so who knows.
its not like they consider the state of game economy critical.
they've already got their 700m from selling the game.
they're a faceless corporation led by ruthless business leeches where profit above anything else is the gospel.
if they can save money by doing weekly backups instead of daily/hourly you can be assured it is done so.


Or the could save money and just do backups each patch. :D
Edited by BannedName#1439 on 5/8/2013 5:30 PM PDT
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You put alot of faith in Blizz's "logs".
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05/08/2013 05:32 PMPosted by Bullfrog
You put alot of faith in Blizz's "logs".


With real money involved... they have legal obligations to have pretty detailed logs.
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Or the could save money and just do backups each patch. :D


yeah that seems more profitable :)

poor guy who has to do the backups, its a thankless job (i can tell from experience).
if everything works no one cares, when the sheet hits the fan and there are no 0sec backups or they are corrupted he is the one getting canned :(
Edited by Grave#2119 on 5/8/2013 5:36 PM PDT
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Can we get a blue to confirm this?
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05/08/2013 05:33 PMPosted by Glock
You put alot of faith in Blizz's "logs".


With real money involved... they have legal obligations to have pretty detailed logs.


Assuming they have logs THAT detailed, it would take a good long time to scour them for would they would define as "suspicious" activity. Buttons pressed and players trading items (like your gem trade example) seem like a difficult way to get there.

At the AH, they could look for high priced transactions and look for patterns maybe?

This is all highly speculative, of course...
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Assuming they have logs THAT detailed, it would take a good long time to scour them for would they would define as "suspicious" activity. Buttons pressed and players trading items (like your gem trade example) seem like a difficult way to get there.

At the AH, they could look for high priced transactions and look for patterns maybe?

This is all highly speculative, of course...


Ok, I'll break down my thought process.

Player 1 Dupes gold. Blizzard detects this easily from the RMAH logs.

Player 1 buys items(gems?) from the AH from Player 2 and Player 3
Player 1 enters game (to trade or drop items) with Player 4

Player 2 buys items (with the duped gold he got from Player 1) from the AH from Player 5

Player 3 enters game with Player 6

Player 4 sells items on the AH to Player 7
Player 4 enters game with Player 8

Player 9 doesn't dupe gold or sell/buy anything on the AH or enter any games with any of these players

Player 1 gets a rollback.
Player 2 gets a rollback.
Player 3 gets a rollback.
Player 4 gets a rollback.
Player 5 gets a rollback.
Player 6 gets a rollback.
Player 7 gets a rollback.
Player 8 gets a rollback.

Player 9 doesn't get a rollback.

In this example only Player 1 duped gold... but the other 7 players had indirect contact/interactions with Player 1 so they all have to get a rollback... to be safe.

Player 9 didn't have any contact or interaction with any of the players linked to Player 1. He doesn't need a rollback.
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100 Night Elf Hunter
12320
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05/08/2013 04:59 PMPosted by Projektalice
I still have these currently.. [this means they HAVE NOT reversed transactions affected by yesterday's events]


They haven't gotten to you yet.
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Posts: 353
Accounts of players trading gems wont be rolled back cause its unfair to the player because they iddnt participate in any scamming, they just sold a product on a market that was out of ocntorl. The AH transaction will be reversed and all will be well.
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It would make me happy if they would roll back all gold transfer transactions from post-patch but I don't think they're going to do anything. They're just going to leave their pile of poop to fester because that's been the D3 team's MO for the past year.
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05/08/2013 05:52 PMPosted by QuantumLimit
Accounts of players trading gems wont be rolled back cause its unfair to the player because they iddnt participate in any scamming, they just sold a product on a market that was out of ocntorl. The AH transaction will be reversed and all will be well.


I disagree. They are already suspending accounts of players who did nothing but sell gems yesterday.
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Having been involved heavily in the development of massive databases, I think Blizzards targeted rollback process is the best to do, and really wouldn't be too hard to address the vast majority of issues.

What concerns me and no one seems to have brought up in any of the threads that I have read is that the AH only received two small updates, one to change the increments of Gold from 1 million to 10 million and the second to implement the tooltip comparison.

In neither of these would it be likely that this "new" exploit/bug would be introduced, so I have a strong suspicion that it may have been going on longer than just after this patch.

As the parameters to identify the transactions for the exploit are quite clear, they should easily be able to identify exactly when this all started, and it could have been months ago. By just doing a simple rollback and not investigating you could be letting the earliest adopters get away free and clear if in fact this issue did predate this patch release.

It is certainly something I would be exploring if I am at the helm of the data corrections and I hope Bizzard are looking thoroughly at the totality of this problem.
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how about my friend who use usd to buy gems,
profit from usd, and cash out it
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or, they could roll back everything and not have to worry about all the sneaky ways players swapped duped gold/bad items etc. The mess they find themselves in is what to do with RMAH sales, where they need to coordinate with paypall on the sale of gems mostly that were sold for $$ and bought for free - blizzard should eat this cost cuz they made the mistake, but instead they choose to go the route of rolling back per-account which may cause yet MORE dupping to save them from having to deal with the real $$ headaches mentioned.
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05/08/2013 05:52 PMPosted by QuantumLimit
Accounts of players trading gems wont be rolled back cause its unfair to the player because they iddnt participate in any scamming, they just sold a product on a market that was out of ocntorl. The AH transaction will be reversed and all will be well.

Accounts of players trading gems have to be rolled back or they are leaving duped gold in the economy. The market was out of control because of a massive amount of duped gold. Who was buying the gems for 200 million gold, when gems were already correctly price on the RMAH to reflect the 3rd party price of gold? Dupers that's who they pass the gems through a few mules to try and hide them and turned around and sold the gems on the RMAH for $$$. That's what was happening dupers were flipping duped gold for real moeny as fast as they could using gems. As the price of gems went up on the GAH their real money value was also increasing on the RMAH as people tried to get in on the super inflation thinking they were Gordan Gekko.

The dupers made a lot of real $$$ in a few short hours, but people think they should be able to keep duped gold because they didn't dupe.
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05/08/2013 05:50 PMPosted by Glock
Player 1 Dupes gold. Blizzard detects this easily from the RMAH logs.


This could be a big assumption depending on how they track transactions. I agree with your general premise about how they would go about finding violators.

It could be as easy as finding 2 billion dollar transactions between patch release time and when AH was shut down, then finding a pattern (to detect multiple, intentional duping).
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