Diablo® III

[Guide/Video] - MP10 TR + EP + Bells 1.0.8

10/01/2013 09:45 AMPosted by baggins
will be done™
it's almost like the blizzard soon™

;p


Approved!
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does this build work well with VORCS runs?
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10/03/2013 10:50 PMPosted by MetaKnight0
does this build work well with VORCS runs?


I, personally get 20-30m less exp/h with VORCS compaired to FOM/Decaying Crypts. The monsters there just don't group around you as well as in FOM. I also seem to die more often in Act II.
But the change of scenery is nice sometimes...
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I, personally get 20-30m less exp/h with VORCS compaired to FOM/Decaying Crypts. The monsters there just don't group around you as well as in FOM. I also seem to die more often in Act II.
But the change of scenery is nice sometimes...

^this
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"Life is either a daring adventure, or nothing at all" ~ HK
Druin, the happy monk
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Now that this build is around for some time, I'm wondering what kind of XP/h is achievable with this?

I started off with a budget TR-Gear on MP6-7 and got around the same XP/h like pure TR on MP1. It was like 80-90M. As my gear and skill became better I could do MP9 for around 120-130M.

These are strictly solo values and include getting 5 stacks in Leoric's and FW and killing the keywarden, but skipping most elites in FOM.

Personal notes:
  • Using EP+Bell in lower MPs like 6 is not really worth it. I was either killing one EP'd Monster and thus most of the group before casting the Bell or I would get the entire group with one or two Bells.
  • Having high eHP is really worth it. Unlike with pure TR it's not only about high dps + high spirit regen. Playing on MP10 and not dying is the most important part here. If I need two bells to kill the group, so what? The XP-Boost per MP level and not losing time by dying totally makes up for this.
  • Applying EPs is still my soft spot. It takes time until I see DOT-Symbols above the monsters heads. If I wait before I see three of those applied before I cast the bell several beasts already tried to get into her pants. This might be due to my rather slow computer though. It feels like I have a constant delay in those phases. I mostly start TR-ing away before even seeing or hearing the bell drop.
  • Using a hybrid Nirvana/TR build for <MP9 was actually easier for me. It just doesn't have the EP phase. You go straight from hitting monsters to raining bells. At some MP level it takes more bells to kill the group though. Since they get scattered around by the knockbacks, it gets harder to kill the entire group. That's where this build shines, imo.
  • For the EP phase this is what I do now: I hold SPACE+Q while circling around my mouse pointer outside of the group and hitting E several times until I feel (and sometime see) that there are enough EPs applied. While not the fastest way to get them EPs out I feel like I get more life steal playing that way.

Anyways, I like to keep improving my paragon leveling and I find this build more challenging and rewarding than pure TR.
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Hey Beave,

I am currently holding steady at ~200m xp/hr solo with MP10 TR-EP-Bells.

I have found it is not worth it to run Leoric's and I often only get 2 or 3 stacks from Festering.
That is A-okay, just plow through FoM anyways.

If you want really good xp/hr, you also have to do Decaying Crypt which gives me ~240-250m xp/hr.

As for your points:
10/09/2013 04:10 AMPosted by Beave
Using EP+Bell in lower MPs like 6 is not really worth it. I was either killing one EP'd Monster and thus most of the group before casting the Bell or I would get the entire group with one or two Bells.

I agree.

10/09/2013 04:10 AMPosted by Beave
Having high eHP is really worth it. Unlike with pure TR it's not only about high dps + high spirit regen. Playing on MP10 and not dying is the most important part here. If I need two bells to kill the group, so what? The XP-Boost per MP level and not losing time by dying totally makes up for this.

This is an oft overlooked truth about TR-EP-Bells. Because so much of your damage comes from EP which can't do more or less DPS based on your sheet DPS, getting enough eHP to not die turns out to be more important than killing the monsters faster.

That being said, there is a level of eHP where you will no longer die to cow charges. At this point, it is not advised to get more eHP. Additional DPS will cause your SW to heal you faster AND your bells to kill the packs faster AND kill the elite packs faster.

10/09/2013 04:10 AMPosted by Beave
Applying EPs is still my soft spot. It takes time until I see DOT-Symbols above the monsters heads. If I wait before I see three of those applied before I cast the bell several beasts already tried to get into her pants. This might be due to my rather slow computer though. It feels like I have a constant delay in those phases. I mostly start TR-ing away before even seeing or hearing the bell drop.

10/09/2013 04:10 AMPosted by Beave
For the EP phase this is what I do now: I hold SPACE+Q while circling around my mouse pointer outside of the group and hitting E several times until I feel (and sometime see) that there are enough EPs applied. While not the fastest way to get them EPs out I feel like I get more life steal playing that way.

This is my recommended strategy for people who either experience lag or are new to the spec.
Holding "stand-still" and clicking in a circle with your mouse outside the radius of the circle of monsters will cause your EP's to get placed on mobs that are at "max range" of EP and it will get a good spread.

Eventually, you would ideally stop spamming and determine the exact # of EP's required to have a ~95% chance to kill the entire pack with the first bell. I actually click EP exactly 3 times because the game is pretty good at "queuing" my attacks and that will result in exactly 3 EP's without any wasted spirit or time.
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"Life is either a daring adventure, or nothing at all" ~ HK
Druin, the happy monk
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Aye i took me some practice.

Dodging and timing the charging bulls and figuring out how many EP's i would need before i could cast X amount of bells to get the boom.

Im finding in crypts i only need 1 or 2 ep's with 1-2 bells. This is without even using the mantra at times since the global cooldowns can sometimes lead to my death.

If i CW longer for more nado's to keep me healed it leads to mobs dieing before i can dot them up so i don't get the whole pack killed which slows down my runs.

in FoM i find 2 EP's with 2-3 bells + Mantra work better for me whtan 3 EP's + Mantra + Bells.

I think this is because the bells with their knockback buy me more time to dot or mantra up while interrupting attacks. So i like the extra bell drop vs's the extra EP.

If i had more armor and HP i bet i could get away with 3 EP's but 2 for me without a mnatra and dropping an extra bell makes my runs have a lot less deaths.

Druin, you and TianZI (sorry for spelling if wrong) have opened my eyes to the most fun way to play this game. Thank you so much. Nothing like running with my brother who is a barb and then all the sudden everything on the screen dies. Poof! Gone.

Its so fullfilling. I am enjoying this build and was happy to regear my monk to farm act 1 MP10 so easily.
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Druin, you and TianZI (sorry for spelling if wrong) have opened my eyes to the most fun way to play this game. Thank you so much. Nothing like running with my brother who is a barb and then all the sudden everything on the screen dies. Poof! Gone.

Its so fullfilling. I am enjoying this build and was happy to regear my monk to farm act 1 MP10 so easily.

I am so glad to hear this and I am sure TianZi is as well!!

We both love finding and sharing new builds/playstyles that are a little off the beaten path and it is so great to hear about people having fun playing with those specs!

10/09/2013 10:16 AMPosted by ArchangelMD
Im finding in crypts i only need 1 or 2 ep's with 1-2 bells. This is without even using the mantra at times since the global cooldowns can sometimes lead to my death.

I find that the mobs in crypts are so low on HP that I can actually use Leoric's + Zuni boots instead of 2x nat's AND only 1 or 2 EP's then 1 bell.

I love that place! :D
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"Life is either a daring adventure, or nothing at all" ~ HK
Druin, the happy monk
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I am currently holding steady at ~200m xp/hr solo with MP10 TR-EP-Bells.

I have found it is not worth it to run Leoric's and I often only get 2 or 3 stacks from Festering.
That is A-okay, just plow through FoM anyways.

If you want really good xp/hr, you also have to do Decaying Crypt which gives me ~240-250m xp/hr.

Hmm, way to go for me...
Can you guesstimate how much you would get if you'd only have ~200dps? It should probably be more than 133XP/h, cause the actual mobs killing time should not be the major factor here.

Are these 240-250m xp/h for the entire run or just for the Decaying Crypt's portion of the run when it spawns?

In DC, did you do some testing if it is better to quickly kill the entire pack after maybe one spewing of the mothers or rather keep them vomiting new zombies? I sometimes just stand still and only EP (no bells) the zombies which are coming at me while quickening. When they explode they don't kill the mothers, which stand farther away.
At some point they start producing less often, so it's time for them to meet my bells, but until then I easily killed more than hundred zombies

I am currently testing this run:

  • Resume game, take Circular Breathing instead of Overawe, take FOM waypoint, use the minimap and http://i41.tinypic.com/mwcpio.jpg to find the Decaying Crypt. If it did not spawn, leave game, resume game until you find it.
  • TR through DC aggroing the monsters until you find Level 2, go in, port home. Change gear and/or Mantra
  • Get three stacks in Festering Woods not TPing back. Then use the portal to Level 2, open the chest for stack four and do the event for stack five.
  • Clear Level 2 and Level 1 backwards and leave through the entrance
  • Clear FOM

Even though this is better in a group, since you can find DC faster, I have the feeling I get slightly better xp/h. I don't know the chances of DC spawning, but so far I did not need to start a new game more than five times to find them. What I like about it, is that I easily get to five stacks and start in the best xp-place of sanctuary. :-)

Is it really worth it to buy a Leoric's ring for DC? I know I'm the only one who can answer that :-)!? I guess when I start leveling a new char I might be glad I did.
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10/10/2013 03:36 AMPosted by Beave
Can you guesstimate how much you would get if you'd only have ~200dps? It should probably be more than 133XP/h, cause the actual mobs killing time should not be the major factor here.

I assume I could get at least 160m xp/hr probably a bit higher. The main thing you are taking a hit on when you drop DPS is the speed you kill elites and the efficiency with which you kill packs of mobs.

At 250kdps with SoJ, I down elites quite quickly by pretending to be a cookie-bells monk and at 300k dps with Hellfire I kill 99% of packs in FoM with EP EP EP Overawe Bell. This whole combo takes very little time and lets me get moving to the next pack extremely quickly.

10/10/2013 03:36 AMPosted by Beave
Are these 240-250m xp/h for the entire run or just for the Decaying Crypt's portion of the run when it spawns?

This is only in DC. In FoM I get between 210m and 180m. The only way I break a 200m average is with DC involved in some of the runs.

In DC, did you do some testing if it is better to quickly kill the entire pack after maybe one spewing of the mothers or rather keep them vomiting new zombies?

I did test this!

With 5 stacks, if you sit there with 5 Wretched Mothers spawning 15 zombies per wave, you will get ~180m xp/hr. This makes it a non-efficient way to do it. The reason behind this is that you can quite easily get more than 15 monsters dead per ~15 seconds if you just blaze through an "activated" or "primed" DC.

10/10/2013 03:36 AMPosted by Beave
I am currently testing this run:

I am enthralled by this idea and I will test it as soon as I get home. It seems absolutely wonderful.

Note: if you choose not to switch auras, you can kill elites as you find them in DC itself which doubles as extra NV stacks and less threat while clearing trash later in terrible Leoric's+X gear.

10/10/2013 03:36 AMPosted by Beave
Is it really worth it to buy a Leoric's ring for DC?

All a matter of perspective. My Leoric's was something like 180m gold (I think). That money could alternatively be used to upgrade 1/15th of one of my items. This makes it quite worth it for me! :D

On MP10, Leoric's is worth ~ 6% total xp. If you are getting 180m xp/hr in DC without it, equipping Leoric's will increase that to 190.8m xp/hr. That is a pretty significant difference!

However, you said it best --
10/10/2013 03:36 AMPosted by Beave
I know I'm the only one who can answer that :-)

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"Life is either a daring adventure, or nothing at all" ~ HK
Druin, the happy monk
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Hi Driun,

i wonder if you could give me advice about a few things i'm currently wondering about:

1. how could i optimize my gear for this build? (mainly gain eHP without losing too much DPS?)
2. should i stay with the "standard" version of your build or would it be better with one of your variations (FoT-Quickening, Inner Storm/Fire Storm?)
3. Should i pick a SoJ? I would drop to about 180k DPS (seems quite low). I would have tested, but decent Bell-SoJs are quite expensive on EU...
4. what is, in your opinion, the spirit-reg-sweetspot for roaming FoM with TR?

Pardon my bad english :)
Edited by rnbounty#2920 on 10/14/2013 10:15 AM PDT
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Hey Druin,

First off I loved the video as it helped me a TON on figuring out exactly how to optimize this build's "rotation". I am completely new to the monk aside from the leveling process and the gear may be a little fail as I am trying to figure that portion out as well. I also want to apologize for posting this on my SC2 tag because for some reason or another I have never been able to get my D3 tag to work on the forums (yay support). My profile tag is Halfish#1706, and I have a couple of questions:

1. I die. A lot...I am currently running MP6 and can somewhat manage MP7 if I don't get unlucky with the elites. Is my eHP just that abysmal? Any suggestions gear wise would be super appreciated.

2. Is being such a low paragon level what is keeping me out of being able to comfortably solo in the mid range MP levels? Again I apologize if this question seems obvious but I am fairly new to the end game. That being said, looking at my gear what MP level SHOULD I be in?

Anything you see outside of these questions that I should work on tweaking would be greatly appreciated. I learned a lot from your video and thread and plan on going hard into this character. The monk is a super enjoyable class with a nice touch of finesse.

PS I am sitting on around 250m gold at the current moment so budget wise that's what I have to work with for improvements. Thanks again!
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hi, can some one tell me what gear I need to upgrade.
Until now I only use old TR just to collect crafting materials.
I;m planning to raise this monk after I finish with my barb.
budget 100 mill.

ps; I have inna pant with vit that currently my barb using
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I tried this build, not very good for those with less than optimal connections and computers, particularly in the EP phase.

That plus my crappy old PC stutters when the big ka-boom goes off =(.
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My Monk "tempest" has been trying this out ... but, I just dye so often. Some times ... I can run into a pack of MP10 monsters in DC and kill them .... but, a lot of times they kill me. What am I doing wrong ... or is it my gear?
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AdA> I think your EHP is pretty decent so that shouldn't be you primary concern. Your dps however is really low for this and on top of that the LS on your skorn is also more or less as low as it can be. These two issues act together in giving you really low life return from Bells.

You also use the aggressive variant with both Overawe and SW - Inner storm, if you switch to MoE - Backlash and SW - firestorm you'd be much safer from attacks. I have to play very cautious even with MoE and firestorm at MP10, For a more relaxed playtime, I switch to MP9.
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AdA> I think your EHP is pretty decent so that shouldn't be you primary concern. Your dps however is really low for this and on top of that the LS on your skorn is also more or less as low as it can be. These two issues act together in giving you really low life return from Bells. You also use the aggressive variant with both Overawe and SW - Inner storm, if you switch to MoE - Backlash and SW - firestorm you'd be much safer from attacks. I have to play very cautious even with MoE and firestorm at MP10, For a more relaxed playtime, I switch to MP9.


Thanks so much Metasvinet. Great advice ... I can't wait to work it out.

I'm going to find that 2 hander with a little more life steal and bring up my dex (for higher dps) ... in the meantime ... I'll attempt farming at a lower MP with Backlash and Firestorm
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OK ... got an axe with more life steal and switched my skills up. It's SO much less stressful! I think I might even be able to handle MP10 fully now. ty my dude.
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@druin and other big monk brothers,

I am trying to come up with a skorn monk that can survive, and even immortal, in hardcore.

Do you feel comfortable that your build can really guarantee "no-death" in hardcore?
and at what mp level?

I am testing it in SC at the moment...
I rarely die..but still die some...

You big monk brothers have more experience than I do...just wanna see how confident you are on a "no death" skorn build...in hardcore.
Edited by Luffy#1946 on 10/28/2013 3:25 PM PDT
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@druin and other big monk brothers,

I am trying to come up with a skorn monk that can survive, and even immortal, in hardcore.

Do you feel comfortable that your build can really guarantee "no-death" in hardcore?
and at what mp level?

I am testing it in SC at the moment...
I rarely die..but still die some...

You big monk brothers have more experience than I do...just wanna see how confident you are on a "no death" skorn build...in hardcore.

Lordy no!

Do not, I repeat DO NOT use this spec in HC.

I would advise never using EP on any spec ever in HC. You will someday cast it on a cow, that cow will get next to an elite with RD and then die and you will die instantly.

Low MP TR works fine on HC because you have LS and a bunch of perma-on AoE skills to protect from DC's.

You would have to ask some of the HC people (Jco) if any other 2h builds are viable but I wouldn't put any money on it! <3
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"Life is either a daring adventure, or nothing at all" ~ HK
Druin, the happy monk
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