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Can you please figure out once and for all how pet damage is calculated?
This is a mystery, we have no idea how this is works. I tried using a low damage 1 aps weapon and stacking +min damage. My poison dart damage was the same each time but the dogs damage jumps all over the place. Crits seem somewhere around 50% regardless of how much CD you have, no idea if it effects the base damage or not.
lol I really don´t check these parts of forums very often, not sure if this is luck that I came across this or what...
That link MCP posted has nice info, so what exactly do you want me to test? Do yu want to be able to calculate the damage your pets deal and how often they attack?
Also, I´ve never used pets myself so do you only care about dogs or the big guy or even fetishes? I do have a bit of experience with testing Call of the Ancients but it was a pain...wish me luck.
OK found this in my "WD mechanics notepad" that I seem to have tested a couple of weeks ago:
Fetish Army - Devoted Following = aps * 20% weapon damage per hit, frequency all over the place
Fetish Army - Tikki Torchers = Torchers deal aps * 15% weapon damage per hit (each of the 2)
Fetish Army - Head Hunters = aps * 20% per hit (each of the 2)
Edited by Nubtro#2147 on 6/7/2013 1:11 PM PDT
Thanks for stopping by :)
Mostly interested in dogs to maximize the leeching beasts rune, but would be interesting to see if Garg and Fetishes behave differently.
Two main questions:
1) Does critical damage effect pets damage? They seem to always crit 50%, some speculate that crit damage affects the base damage, I don't think it does but had a hard time getting confirmed results.
2) Why does the damage fluctuate so much, it does it even when i had min damage = max damage. Is it because of the aps * % weapon damage per hit mechanics?
Note: If you are not a frequent pet user - you can dismiss some of the dogs by right clicking on the top left icon, good way to give yourself just a single dog for testing.
First test complete.
-> aps * displayed tooltip damage per hit, so aps * 130% weapon damage
-> frequency seems to be 1.4 second per attack (84 frames)
-> it can crit but it ignores your character´s crit damage and only uses the default +50% CD, so its crit deals 1.5-times normal damage
APS doesn´t affect swing speed, it directly affects the damage it deals.
My test was 2203 int, 96 base weapon damage (33-48 white spear +33 min ring +30 min ring), 25% IAS on gear, so 1.50 aps. 100% weapon damage would be 96*23.03=2210.88.
Humongoid dealt 4311 normal damage (4311/2210.88=194.99% weapon damage). 194.99%/tooltip 130% = 1.50 (your aps).
1. MCP sheet damage/inventory damage/displayed damage (what you call dps) is never used to calculate skill damage in this game.
2. I didn´t get damage fluctuation because I only had 96-96 weapon damage. After testing a weapon that has a range, it uses the full range of the weapon not an average weapon damage number.
Edited by Nubtro#2147 on 6/7/2013 1:20 PM PDT
From that thread:
1. They always crit at 50% damage. Crit chance works. IAS doesn't AFAIK, even BBV.
2. Their damage is based on your DPS total. So IAS and crit damage actually does change their damage. It's not weapon damage as the tool tip says.
Not sure on their damage range. It's entirely confusing since they use DPS total rather than base damage.
Go to that thread and search for DPS, it shows Peter's test, including damage ranges.
Edited by MCP#1477 on 6/7/2013 1:19 PM PDT
So here´s an overview of all gargantuan runes:
HUMONGOID = (aps*130%) weapon damage Cleave each 84 frames (1.4 sec)
OK I get what you meant by fluctuation lol. The dog is all over the place (thanks for the tip to dismiss all but 1).
Same test with 2203 int, 96 base weapon damage and 1.50 aps. 100% weapon damage would be 2210.88.
Life link dog
damage ticks: 263-314-266-472c-425c-292-398c-317-246-316-267-378c
frame difference between ticks: 120-94-94-130-113-105-97
The lowest damage I got in this test was 252 (378crit/1.5) = 11.3% weapon damage and highest 317 = 14.3% weapon damage. Not sure what´s happening here as it makes no sense to me.
Using a different aps weapon didn´t affect the fluctuating attack frequency. The damage changed slightly (10-31 dagger +33 +30 = 73-73 instead of 96-96). Also, 1.875 aps instead of 1.50.
damage ticks: 251-224-233-266-254-228-278-252-350c-353-222
frame difference between ticks: 96-107-98-144-102-106-90-96-152
222 lowest = 13.2% weapon damage
278 highest = 16.5% weapon damage
Well, this is crazy. Be sure to ask about Dog damage in the next "ask the devs" thread if we ever get one...
RESTLESS GIANT works like HUMONGOID (tooltip damage * aps per hit), the enrage changes its damage from (100% * aps) to (300% * aps). The attack speed bonus is difficult to test as it seems the developers forgot to apply the "no flinching" change from a previous patch to pets....because the RG´s swings were disrupted by the elite´s attacks a few times.
BRUISER´s special swings (aps * 200% weapon damage) are separated by 6 normal swings, which means it´s a 3 sec stun roughly each 9.8 seconds. Note that each swing is a separate attack and if it gets disrupted (by the aforementioned "flinching"), it counts but is omitted.
WRATHFUL PROTECTOR is a funny fellow. It deals aps*aps*110% weapon damage (yes, aps is applied twice multiplicatively.
Edited by Nubtro#2147 on 6/11/2013 10:29 AM PDT
So trying to figure out if dogs damage is (more or less) = aps * % weapon damage :
1) For the 1.5 aps weapon: 1.5*0.09 = 13.5% which falls between the 11.3% - 14.3 range
2) For the 1.875 aps weapon: 1.875*0.09 = 16.9% which doesn't quite fall in the 13.2% - 16.5% range.
Well, at first I wanted to write "couldn´t figure out WP" but as I was writing it I tested one more calculation and it worked out.
test 1 dagger (1.5 aps), 25% gear IAS
73*23.03 = 1681.19 (100% weapon damage)
6501 = 386.7%
test 2 spear, 25% gear IAS
96*23.03 = 2210.88 (100% weapon damage)
5472 = 247.5%
test 1: 1681.19 * 1.1 * (1.5*1.25) * (1.5*1.25) = 6501.48 (correct)
test 2: 2210.88 * 1.1 * (1.2*1.25) * (1.2*1.25) = 5471.93 (correct)
But then I tested it with Slam Dance and got 13997 damage on the dagger and 11781 on the spear. According to my formula, I should´ve gotten 11373 with the dagger and 9572 with the spear. There´s some sort of 23% multiplicative bonus I´m missing, or there´s some sort of catch or hidden BBV bonus hmm...
Wrathful Protector is among the very few WD skills that benefits from more aps. But as I said, the biggest problem with pets from my perspective is that they flinch when hit for a certain amount of damage (like characters did before it got fixed).
EDIT1: Oh wow I think I figured it out. WP seems to gain a 60% damage bonus instead of 30% from Slam Dance. This is the 23% I was missing (1.6/1.3 = 1.2307).
So yeah, very cool rune. Full of surprises.
EDIT2: OK managed to test the IAS increase of Restless Giant. It´s not really 35%, his swing frequency changes from 84 frames (1.4 sec) to 66 frames (1.1 sec), which means by 27.27%.
EDIT 3: The doubled damage bonus from Slam Dance is limited to that skill. I just tested it alongside Paranoia and got a 80% bonus (30+30+20).
Edited by Nubtro#2147 on 6/7/2013 5:04 PM PDT
Nubtro may have quit, but many thanks to him for discovering the formula for pet damage.
I just re-tested and attack speed does indeed increase pet damage, and crit chance doesn't, though crit chance increases pet crit chance.
My tests were erroneous because I saw the easiest link, that my pet was doing damage very close to the character sheet damage. It was probably a coincidence that the combination of attack speed, crit chance, etc made my character sheet damage look similar to pet damage.
Now, to test the rumour that thorns damage is increased by your main stat, and how mask of jeram works, before the AH closes!
Edited by Peter#1403 on 3/16/2014 11:34 AM PDT
My Wrathful protector is critting for 10 mil in Slam dance but only on elites. Would seem t hat pets get your + damage to elites ?
Also because he is a " Fire spell " Is he getting buffed by + fire damage ? I hadn't really used him before 2.0 , but he seems reaaaaally good.
Wtb Taskers :(
Edited by Buffmoonkins#1183 on 3/16/2014 11:48 AM PDT
Lol we'll get to it.
But in other news, thorns damage is really increased by our intelligence stat! I don't know the exact formula, but does increase thorns.
Simple tests show that thorns damage is increased by 25% of your intelligence stat.
So if you have 1000 intelligence, thorns damage will increase by 250%.
Edited by Peter#1403 on 3/16/2014 12:23 PM PDT
This explains why my garg hits like a truck when I did a few tests mixing in my wiz gear to achieve 275k dps excluding MoJ. Thanks for the testing the exact mechanic on its sheet vs weapon damage, it makes planning my gear choices and stat priorities a bit more clear cut for the time being.
My WD has a wimpy 140k dps, but the wrathful protector rapid fires 1.5-2m crits with my gear. According to your tests that number will skyrocket when I can use the mystic to reroll some of my items.
My guess for the double slam dance damage is that it's giving it to you on the damage calculation and then again when calculating each swing. This will probably get nerfed at some point because it's probably not intended behavior. Then again blizzard likes hidden mechanics except when they say they don't.
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