Diablo® III

I hate to make this topic but .. ladder.....

06/18/2013 12:21 PMPosted by Sephiroth
I don't want d3 to become d2 with better graphics.


me neither. but I want D3 becomes a superset of D2. Not a subset of D2. or else...

...it's not Good Game.

it's Good Grief.
Edited by MisterAjikko#1937 on 6/18/2013 1:40 PM PDT
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have you guys heard about sports?

i heard they have world rankings based on competition against the best of the best

doesn't that sound more exciting than left clicking?

oh but i am the world's best left clicker it's my unique talent
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IF I am not mistaken...

1. Everyone agrees that a ladder system would reset characters, each time it was up for renewal

2. A ladder system should remove the auction or biding for items, unlike how it was in D2 - you want a torch then get me a 5 zod runes (or what have you)

3. A ladder system would seem to put everyone on a level playing field

4. The ladder system should be designed with the idea for progression, seeing old, yet new content again, and same items but with a shiny, new presence

5. Ladder system would remove the jealous, and envious rages? Barb+WIZ+MONK are just wiping the floor through ubers and I cannot compete with them...I have to buy their craps drop downs?

I support the ladder system. I liked being able to stand in the chamber of B'aal and get gobs and gobs of exp to reach that ever top tier level of 99 - at best I got 77?

But I would also like to have the ladder character in regular games to see how well it can stack against the ubers or would the character just wipe the floor and make it no longer be a challenge even for solo?
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I feel that they should focus on adding more content to explore than re-exploring content.

If there's a ladder, there must absolutely be NO additional incentive to play it other than personal goal. Same with Self Found if that was to be implemented. No ladder exclusive items. No increased drop-rate. Nothing :/

I would much rather have "PvE challenges" in an Arena... in which I can challenge myself and try to improve my "high-score" than having to regear to get back where I was before the ladder reset... only to have it reset again.


Incorrect. Ladder in D2 was awesome because you had access to vastly more powerful crafted gear. It wasn't necessarily easy to build but once you did you could feel the difference. Ladder absolutely should have an advantage. What it doesn't need is the same AH which D2 in essence lacked.
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I think the fresh start would be nice, as I do not have the time to be competitive and now that gold is so inflated I cannot afford anything either.
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06/17/2013 07:35 PMPosted by badomen
GET A JOB


06/17/2013 07:36 PMPosted by badomen
GET A GIRLFRIEND


Have both and soon to be married with a house .... and you ? LOL ! Don't even bother trying to answer that because we all know what kind of people make those comments.
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I think one thing that ladder players should get over non ladder characters is achievements based on rank at the end of a season or maybe just a portrait / banner sigil that represents you're down for the cause.
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I feel that they should focus on adding more content to explore than re-exploring content.

If there's a ladder, there must absolutely be NO additional incentive to play it other than personal goal. Same with Self Found if that was to be implemented. No ladder exclusive items. No increased drop-rate. Nothing :/

I would much rather have "PvE challenges" in an Arena... in which I can challenge myself and try to improve my "high-score" than having to regear to get back where I was before the ladder reset... only to have it reset again.


Incorrect. Ladder in D2 was awesome because you had access to vastly more powerful crafted gear. It wasn't necessarily easy to build but once you did you could feel the difference. Ladder absolutely should have an advantage. What it doesn't need is the same AH which D2 in essence lacked.


I agree that the game should be exciting to play. If Ladder does that to you, that's cool. You have to look at the other side. If ladder gets exclusives, what about Non-ladder players? They get punished (with less content). That's just a horrible thing to do. I could even use myself as an example. We can all agree that at some point, (for many of us) the game was just horrible and not fun. I stayed and continued playing, because I have faith that Blizzard will fix the game. Even if the Itemization is bad... even if there's no end-game content (that I care about) to make use of my gear, I continued playing the game, knowing that I will have an advantage over those who gave up. I keep farming gold, gems, and other items. If they are going to put a ladder and have exclusives, why am I even playing right now? There's nothing to do except to farm new gear... but what's the use of new gear if you can't even use it for new content?

Ladder exclusives punishes those who continued playing the game and reward those who left. If you want to add more content, go ahead and add more for everyone. If there's ladder exclusives, that means that I've spent over 1500 hours for absolutely nothing since I won't be playing NL (because I want access to all the content). I might as well sell all my gear and hope to get some $ out of this.

Many people who wants ladder are not even sure what they truly want. From the looks of it, people want this:

=> BoA for every loots
=> No trading allowed
=> Reset X months

What they truly want (for many of them, IMO) is...

=> Being able to find upgrades without feeling forced to use the AH. This can be solved by fixing the itemization... you don't even need a ladder system.
=> Things that make you more powerful, but cannot be bought through the AH. (Maybe BoA Legendary items, crafting... maybe some runes to improve your current skills... maybe what they really want, is more customization for their characters and feel that they are making progress after level 60)
=> More end-game content. Have a PvP arena. Have tournaments. Have PvE challenges in the Arena. Have survival against endless waves. If people actually had something to do, a reason to get better loots, they wouldn't want to replay the same content to get back to where you were before the reset...
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IF I am not mistaken...

1. Everyone agrees that a ladder system would reset characters, each time it was up for renewal

2. A ladder system should remove the auction or biding for items, unlike how it was in D2 - you want a torch then get me a 5 zod runes (or what have you)

3. A ladder system would seem to put everyone on a level playing field

4. The ladder system should be designed with the idea for progression, seeing old, yet new content again, and same items but with a shiny, new presence

5. Ladder system would remove the jealous, and envious rages? Barb+WIZ+MONK are just wiping the floor through ubers and I cannot compete with them...I have to buy their craps drop downs?

I support the ladder system. I liked being able to stand in the chamber of B'aal and get gobs and gobs of exp to reach that ever top tier level of 99 - at best I got 77?

But I would also like to have the ladder character in regular games to see how well it can stack against the ubers or would the character just wipe the floor and make it no longer be a challenge even for solo?


I dont exactly understand what you mean. Why would ubers not be a challenge and why would you be getting their crap drop downs ? Also , Only 77 ?
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Incorrect. Ladder in D2 was awesome because you had access to vastly more powerful crafted gear. It wasn't necessarily easy to build but once you did you could feel the difference. Ladder absolutely should have an advantage. What it doesn't need is the same AH which D2 in essence lacked.


I agree that the game should be exciting to play. If Ladder does that to you, that's cool. You have to look at the other side. If ladder gets exclusives, what about Non-ladder players? They get punished (with less content). That's just a horrible thing to do. I could even use myself as an example. We can all agree that at some point, (for many of us) the game was just horrible and not fun. I stayed and continued playing, because I have faith that Blizzard will fix the game. Even if the Itemization is bad... even if there's no end-game content (that I care about) to make use of my gear, I continued playing the game, knowing that I will have an advantage over those who gave up. I keep farming gold, gems, and other items. If they are going to put a ladder and have exclusives, why am I even playing right now? There's nothing to do except to farm new gear... but what's the use of new gear if you can't even use it for new content?

Ladder exclusives punishes those who continued playing the game and reward those who left. If you want to add more content, go ahead and add more for everyone. If there's ladder exclusives, that means that I've spent over 1500 hours for absolutely nothing since I won't be playing NL (because I want access to all the content). I might as well sell all my gear and hope to get some $ out of this.

Many people who wants ladder are not even sure what they truly want. From the looks of it, people want this:

=> BoA for every loots
=> No trading allowed
=> Reset X months

What they truly want (for many of them, IMO) is...

=> Being able to find upgrades without feeling forced to use the AH. This can be solved by fixing the itemization... you don't even need a ladder system.
=> Things that make you more powerful, but cannot be bought through the AH. (Maybe BoA Legendary items, crafting... maybe some runes to improve your current skills... maybe what they really want, is more customization for their characters and feel that they are making progress after level 60)
=> More end-game content. Have a PvP arena. Have tournaments. Have PvE challenges in the Arena. Have survival against endless waves. If people actually had something to do, a reason to get better loots, they wouldn't want to replay the same content to get back to where you were before the reset...


The only thing id want out of ladder is MAYBE 1 craft-able item like rings but its not 100% needed.
Of course a reset would have to happen more often.
No one wants different content and exclusive items that DROP.

I still dont understand how anyone can have anything negative to say about ladder. D2 has ladder which also has ladder only runewords like "Insight" for example. Sure they are easy to make for the most part but you can only do this on ladder. So when they reset the season all the ladder Insights have gone to non ladder in turn makes even more of a gold sink because now non-ladder players can use them. Honestly If a ladder came out tomorrow, How could anyone not make a new character and start going hard ? All I see on these forums are omg this game is too easy with the gold i bought with my credit card . Omg theres no end game even though im only lvl 20 paragon cuz i bought all my loots . Like give me a break here THERE IS NO DOWNSIDE! Anyone who says their character and gear will get erased is lacking brain cells .... IMHO! ( which is all im seeing in general discussion )
Edited by Yukmout#1681 on 6/18/2013 2:19 PM PDT
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I agree that the game should be exciting to play. If Ladder does that to you, that's cool. You have to look at the other side. If ladder gets exclusives, what about Non-ladder players? They get punished (with less content). That's just a horrible thing to do. I could even use myself as an example. We can all agree that at some point, (for many of us) the game was just horrible and not fun. I stayed and continued playing, because I have faith that Blizzard will fix the game. Even if the Itemization is bad... even if there's no end-game content (that I care about) to make use of my gear, I continued playing the game, knowing that I will have an advantage over those who gave up. I keep farming gold, gems, and other items. If they are going to put a ladder and have exclusives, why am I even playing right now? There's nothing to do except to farm new gear... but what's the use of new gear if you can't even use it for new content?

Ladder exclusives punishes those who continued playing the game and reward those who left. If you want to add more content, go ahead and add more for everyone. If there's ladder exclusives, that means that I've spent over 1500 hours for absolutely nothing since I won't be playing NL (because I want access to all the content). I might as well sell all my gear and hope to get some $ out of this.

Many people who wants ladder are not even sure what they truly want. From the looks of it, people want this:

=> BoA for every loots
=> No trading allowed
=> Reset X months

What they truly want (for many of them, IMO) is...

=> Being able to find upgrades without feeling forced to use the AH. This can be solved by fixing the itemization... you don't even need a ladder system.
=> Things that make you more powerful, but cannot be bought through the AH. (Maybe BoA Legendary items, crafting... maybe some runes to improve your current skills... maybe what they really want, is more customization for their characters and feel that they are making progress after level 60)
=> More end-game content. Have a PvP arena. Have tournaments. Have PvE challenges in the Arena. Have survival against endless waves. If people actually had something to do, a reason to get better loots, they wouldn't want to replay the same content to get back to where you were before the reset...


The only thing id want out of ladder is MAYBE 1 craft-able item like rings but its not 100% needed.
Of course a reset would have to happen more often.
No one wants different content and exclusive items that DROP.

I still dont understand how anyone can have anything negative to say about ladder. D2 has ladder which also has ladder only runewords like "Insight" for example. Sure they are easy to make for the most part but you can only do this on ladder. So when they reset the season all the ladder Insights have gone to non ladder in turn makes even more of a gold sink because now non-ladder players can use them. Honestly If a ladder came out tomorrow, How could anyone not make a new character and start going hard ? All I see on these forums are omg this game is too easy with the gold i bought with my credit card . Omg theres no end game even though im only lvl 20 paragon cuz i bought all my loots . Like give me a break here THERE IS NO DOWNSIDE! Anyone who says their character and gear will get erased is lacking brain cells .... IMHO! ( which is all im seeing in general discussion )


Maybe if you opened your mind a little, you could understand why people who never intended to play ladder would be upset of having access to less content.

If you can't even acknowledge that point, I'm just going to put you on my ignore list.
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I feel that they should focus on adding more content to explore than re-exploring content.

If there's a ladder, there must absolutely be NO additional incentive to play it other than personal goal. Same with Self Found if that was to be implemented. No ladder exclusive items. No increased drop-rate. Nothing :/

I would much rather have "PvE challenges" in an Arena... in which I can challenge myself and try to improve my "high-score" than having to regear to get back where I was before the ladder reset... only to have it reset again.


this is absolutely correct. I would much rather have a PvE challenges setup where I can be scored on the output of my current chars. Why should I have to reroll a toon? In D2 there were actual reasons to reroll your toons other than ladder, so it was no big deal to create a new one, especially since it was easy to burn through the acts if you knew how. I also like the idea of the challenges over an actual reset, because if implemented you could reset scores for the season on a monthly or bi-monthly basis. so even if the same people are participating theres no guarantee they will be at the top each ladder season, based on efficiency and skill.

As for ladder only items. What if I don't want to re-roll my toons? Are you telling me that I'm a bad Diablo gamer and should be punished by having a more limited access to gears, top quality gears no less? I always hated this about Ladder in D2, yeah you get nice stuff to drop to reward you for re-rolling and participating, and I even did it, but I eventually got to the point where I didn't care enough about the ladder only loot because I could afford it on non-ladder after like 3 re-sets. So big whoop.

I would personally rather be put in a situation where I felt it was necessary to paragon level, over playing a re-set in order to get better gears, but I think blizz has said they don't want people to be forced to level, so I wonder where that leaves ladder items if they decide to do it.
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I feel that they should focus on adding more content to explore than re-exploring content.

If there's a ladder, there must absolutely be NO additional incentive to play it other than personal goal. Same with Self Found if that was to be implemented. No ladder exclusive items. No increased drop-rate. Nothing :/

I would much rather have "PvE challenges" in an Arena... in which I can challenge myself and try to improve my "high-score" than having to regear to get back where I was before the ladder reset... only to have it reset again.


this is absolutely correct. I would much rather have a PvE challenges setup where I can be scored on the output of my current chars. Why should I have to reroll a toon? In D2 there were actual reasons to reroll your toons other than ladder, so it was no big deal to create a new one, especially since it was easy to burn through the acts if you knew how. I also like the idea of the challenges over an actual reset, because if implemented you could reset scores for the season on a monthly or bi-monthly basis. so even if the same people are participating theres no guarantee they will be at the top each ladder season, based on efficiency and skill.

As for ladder only items. What if I don't want to re-roll my toons? Are you telling me that I'm a bad Diablo gamer and should be punished by having a more limited access to gears, top quality gears no less? I always hated this about Ladder in D2, yeah you get nice stuff to drop to reward you for re-rolling and participating, and I even did it, but I eventually got to the point where I didn't care enough about the ladder only loot because I could afford it on non-ladder after like 3 re-sets. So big whoop.

I would personally rather be put in a situation where I felt it was necessary to paragon level, over playing a re-set in order to get better gears, but I think blizz has said they don't want people to be forced to level, so I wonder where that leaves ladder items if they decide to do it.


What do we get in Diablo 3? Level 60? Gratz, now go for Paragon level.

What do we get in Diablo 2? Potential of having a Soj drop in normal. Could get skill charms in nightmare. Could get Shako and HoZ in nightmare. Lots of really good items dropped early on.

Yeah, Forge and Socket quests were rather neat. While it could be "abused", it still gave us a reason to roll a new characters... or if we look the other way, it rewarded us for rolling a new character. We knew that the reward was waiting for us too.
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06/18/2013 02:18 PMPosted by Yukmout
Like give me a break here THERE IS NO DOWNSIDE!


There's always a downside. Typically the big downsides for something like this include the fact that there are other things that resources can better be spent on, and partitioning the player base . That second one is particularly a concern, because of how small the player base is for HC right now. I've opened up a game to the public on MP-5 and gotten no takers before. You'd have to wonder how many fewer people I'd have to play my current character with if a ladder existed.

I don't really have a strong opinion on ladder. Might be interesting. But there are always potential downsides to any large changes to a game.
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The only thing id want out of ladder is MAYBE 1 craft-able item like rings but its not 100% needed.
Of course a reset would have to happen more often.
No one wants different content and exclusive items that DROP.

I still dont understand how anyone can have anything negative to say about ladder. D2 has ladder which also has ladder only runewords like "Insight" for example. Sure they are easy to make for the most part but you can only do this on ladder. So when they reset the season all the ladder Insights have gone to non ladder in turn makes even more of a gold sink because now non-ladder players can use them. Honestly If a ladder came out tomorrow, How could anyone not make a new character and start going hard ? All I see on these forums are omg this game is too easy with the gold i bought with my credit card . Omg theres no end game even though im only lvl 20 paragon cuz i bought all my loots . Like give me a break here THERE IS NO DOWNSIDE! Anyone who says their character and gear will get erased is lacking brain cells .... IMHO! ( which is all im seeing in general discussion )


Maybe if you opened your mind a little, you could understand why people who never intended to play ladder would be upset of having access to less content.

If you can't even acknowledge that point, I'm just going to put you on my ignore list.


You might as well DoomBringer because playing ladder is optional 100% . If you can't realize this then I've already ignored you. Well maybe not just because i like to see what other people have to say . But to say I have to open my mind ? Come on dude you cant be serious. Ladder has been a part of diablo forever. You're telling me that you knew that this game would have no ladder and you were 100% okay with that fact since the beginning ? I can tell you I wasnt aware there wasnt going to be a ladder but at the same time is didnt seem like it mattered because of the fact that inferno was supposed to be so hard no one was gonna beat it in a week or month. But that happened then nerfs happend so why not a ladder? It wouldnt affect ANYONE playing right now whether you made a ladder character or just kept on playing the character you have now .
Edited by Yukmout#1681 on 6/18/2013 2:40 PM PDT
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Maybe if you opened your mind a little, you could understand why people who never intended to play ladder would be upset of having access to less content.

If you can't even acknowledge that point, I'm just going to put you on my ignore list.


You might as well DoomBringer because playing ladder is optional 100% . If you can't realize this then I've already ignored you.


I see. Nice for you to show your true color.
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You have to re-read my post i edited it
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You give no real reason except open your mind. So you do the same and what happens ?
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I don't really get why some people would still worry about the playerbase... it makes me feel like they were forced to stick with their certain "playerbase" While they are at that and with that mindset.

I play both softcore and hardcore and if there's ladder, I would play them all and manage my time to do so.

so what am I belonging to? An all-weather playerbase?
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Who knows anymore. People just want to complain about all their "hard work" they've done in this game. What would have happened if there was ladder right from the beginning ? Would you cry about making another character ? Or just play the same one you've been playing ? Jesus I dont know what I could possibly do in this situation except go on the forums and QQ about everything I dont like .

This is not work nor is it hard by any stretch.
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