Diablo® III

tried the tri-build, and loved it....

My 2 cents:

If you're having FUN playing, it doesn't matter what build, items, kill time, drops... etc

The first priority I think is that you have fun, second is maybe to challenge yourself with different varities of playstyle (which is hopefully fun for most)

BTW, I love tri-gen build. I can survive quite well and kill fairly quickly.
But I also love Bells. Just when Nirvana cycle starts, it's so cool when all you hear is "!@#$ %^-* !@#$ %^-*" and everything dissappears. But I die much quicker - I guess I'm much more squishier with this build.

TBH, I can't pick one of the two. Both are incredibly fun to play with.

I wish I could use more skills... and passives lol.

Trigen nirvana EP/TR build FTW! :)
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BTW, i wasn't cursing...

just trying to make bell sounds... dunno why it's been censored
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07/10/2013 04:30 PMPosted by Fitz
I use single target dps stats because that build is a single target build. Seriously?


Fitz, I honestly understand you dislike the build, nobody blames you for that, but why are you spreading such obviously false information? Yes, the build works at close range only, you can't hurl damage across the screen, the same way you do with a Bell, but how exactly does this make it a single-target build?! In my experience, the speed of killing actually scales with the monster density, single targets are slower to take down.

I have nothing but the deepest respect for you and I have no idea what has provoked your animosity towards this build. Nobody is trying to claim it out-DPSes your precious Bells, so if it is top DPS efficiency you seek - more power to you! Please let other people enjoy other builds, without spreading false information or passing the results of a Ghom kill-speed test as applicable to large mob fights as well.
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Posts: 2,220
btw Fitz, keep this in mind,
there are 2 frames of approach when it comes to a build.

- from an "efficient" perspective.
- or from an "effective" point of view.

A build may not be efficient, but let's see if it's "effective" for its purpose. >:)
Whether that purpose be simply entertainment, or experiment in an area of spec.
Edited by CountFury#1192 on 7/10/2013 5:29 PM PDT
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07/10/2013 05:20 PMPosted by Fitz
They see a GG geared player post a build and/or video. They then think that the build is a "good" build (in terms of efficiency). They then try to gear for it thinking they are getting something they are not. I had 3 people message me in-game asking about this build already because of this post. It also has nothing to do with Kim. He is just one of many that have done this type of thing for a long time now.

I think just about anyone that posts a video about any given build is guilty of that, including yourself. My personal beef with any DW bell spec is the simple fact that if you can't one-shot monsters with your bell, then your bells are doing a lot of damage on the first strike, but on the ensuing strikes, the DPS of the bells would decrease due to the scatter effect and that on average, each subsequent bell will hit fewer enemies after the first bell drop. The only time this doesn't apply would be against champions and ubers, I think.

If you are playing in a group, this can be extremely annoying if some undergeared monk decided to run Nirvana bells thinking he is OP. Meanwhile, all he is doing is scattering enemies everywhere, making it less effective for the group. I recognize that I have little experience in playing alongside Nirvana monks, but from what little I have experienced, it has been more annoyance than fun as a group member.

This could be mitigated if you use PotA rune, but the problem with that is that if you aren't able to kill your enemies during your Nirvana phase, then any effort to build up spirit during the downtime will incur tonnes of knockback from your primary attack. This is annoying for any group member who is trying to also do their attacks. So in a group setting, Nirvana is most effective for people who are GG geared. Anything less, and it's more annoyance than effective.

The thing with a tri-gen build like this is that it is probably more group-friendly in that it does not scatter enemies since there is little if any use of any skill that has knockback. As far as group builds go, I think this could have potential as far as it's contributive factor to group play than a nirvana-bell build for an "undergeared" monk. As a second monk (where the first monk is the CS monk), I speculate this could be good for a group... especially if you are well geared.

Solo-wise, I think I would tend to agree with Fitz - it's hard to argue against the potential effectiveness of bells in the amount of DPS it can incur on a per-spam basis. But mathematics is not the be-all and end-all of calculating efficiency and effectiveness. And beyond that, the better geared you are, the more exponentially effective the bell builds will be.

That's my 2c on the whole bells vs. tri-gen debate. Take it as you will... it is only 2 pennies worth of thoughts. It ain't worth a whole lot. :)
Edited by Nameless#1537 on 7/10/2013 6:07 PM PDT
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@ Fitz

Peace out and point taken! I agree with pretty much everything you said, just wanted to point out that Cyclones should count as AoE skill as well - each tornado only affects a single target, but with decent AS/CC, it stands to reason you're going to have way more than one at a time, affecting multiple targets. The build is actually semi-centered around Cyclones and will not work well, if at all, without them.

I still just have a minor objection to your wording, though - "Not as good as Bells" does not necessarily equal "This build sucks". A bit more DPS inefficient - certainly, but it offers other advantages which may compensate in different areas, depending on the needs of the player. Its main advantage being the permanent sustain, whereas Bells tend to leave some vulnerability gaps.

The build IS good. Not as good as Bells, for DPS, but well balanced and still offering quite a lot of damage, with the additional advantage of being suitable for under-geared characters, allowing them to jump up a MP difficulty or two - compared to what they would be able to handle with Bells.

@ Nameless

The thing with a tri-gen build like this is that it is probably more group-friendly in that it does not scatter enemies since there is little if any use of any skill that has knockback. As far as group builds go, I think this could have potential as far as it's contributive factor to group play. As a second monk (where the first monk is the CS monk), I think this could be good for a group... especially if you are well geared.


This is only correct whereas the Tri-Gen Monk is the one with the Overawe. The main issue I've encountered in group play with this build is my inability to change the Mantra - Overawe spam being the only available spirit spender. On the up side - having a Tri-Gen Monk in the party guarantees a permanent 3-sec Overawe buff, because the build never runs out of Spirit.
Edited by Laurelynd#1459 on 7/10/2013 6:00 PM PDT
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07/10/2013 10:28 AMPosted by Fitz
The build is crap


I like massively empowered Sweeping Wind Cyclones because they are effective against a group, even if they are far less effective against a single target. They do provide a lot of continued DPS when a monk is otherwise controlled, which contributes to sustain.

I also love how they blow up chicken coops and the like. Mother Nature uncontrolled.
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sorry idk if you went over this, I'm kind of noob when it comes to mechanics :/, anyway do i need to use all three generators every three seconds for the combo strike to keep up the 24% buff (only talking combo strike buff)
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07/10/2013 07:52 PMPosted by SirNick
sorry idk if you went over this, I'm kind of noob when it comes to mechanics :/, anyway do i need to use all three generators every three seconds for the combo strike to keep up the 24% buff (only talking combo strike buff)


Combo strike buff on Foresight doesn't have to be refreshed every 3 seconds unlike FoT and WofHF.
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no, you need to use ANY generator every three seconds to keep the buff. Obviously you'll have to have used different generators per 8% of the buff, but to keep the 24% buff up, you'll only need to FoT:TC at least every 3 seconds.
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To be precise, the buff stays as long you use a spirit generator, but since FoT pawns everything else, that will be our primary generator.

Anyway, I just want to jump in on the Bell v 3 gen and say, I'll take the 3 gen any day. Like laurelynd said.. it offers a balance and consistent eDPS output and I have issues of a monk being a range hero..dropping bells from afar.
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Yey! more trigen monks :)
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Ive been using a dashing strike variant of the tri build and have been loving it.

The best part for me is using the attack that best fits the situation I am in. This is by far the most Kung Fu feeling build Ive used.

The most effective tactic is when I use Dashing Strike to herd my mob up, dash to the far end of the mob, activate Blazing Fists bonus, Overawe, then use Deadly Reach to finish them off.

This tactic definitely hits more than a single target and takes groups down incredibly fast.
Edited by Segomo#1790 on 7/11/2013 4:54 AM PDT
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I tried very briefly with my dual LS swords last night and maybe I just need to get the hang of things and get all of the buffs in place. But even trash mobs were taking a lot longer than I'm used to. Maybe it's because I'm used to running with a 2H skorn, which makes my SW a lot stronger and that kills monsters faster? Or maybe I'm too used to dropping bells (or using PotA rune to reduce knockback)?

For some reason, I was hoping that the SW/C would be a long stronger than it was. So in a tri-gen build, what's the main source of damage - your primary attacks? Or SW/C?

Maybe I need to use bells in place of FitL buff, as that doesn't seem to have a huge impact either.
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I tried very briefly with my dual LS swords last night and maybe I just need to get the hang of things and get all of the buffs in place. But even trash mobs were taking a lot longer than I'm used to. Maybe it's because I'm used to running with a 2H skorn, which makes my SW a lot stronger and that kills monsters faster? Or maybe I'm too used to dropping bells (or using PotA rune to reduce knockback)?

For some reason, I was hoping that the SW/C would be a long stronger than it was. So in a tri-gen build, what's the main source of damage - your primary attacks? Or SW/C?

Maybe I need to use bells in place of FitL buff, as that doesn't seem to have a huge impact either.


http://www.d3rawr.com/d-c06y0

You need be a little more high aps focused and have WKL as a OH to make this build work the best. And it should definitely feel slower than the bell build especially against the skorn bell since it doesn’t pack the instant dmg. The dmg builds up as you get your cyclones up with all the buffs up.

For FitL variant, EF(Low Fear)+WKL is usually the best combo to boost the aps to make the FitL. But I do prefer Sword+WKL as I’m sick and tired of running EF with fear for cookie builds earlier stage of D3.

But the best dmg output will come from the set up of +2.7aps / EF+WKL. I should really pick up one of my old CD EF to make some vids or something. It takes the dmg output to another level. All my cookie variants builds are with Dual LS set up. Decent CD EF takes my dmg up to 300k unbuffed with +2.55aps, that’s the set up I used to run before I ditched EF couple months ago. That’s like the best set up for these builds.

I do have different gear set up for bell builds and do runs with cookie builds/bell builds alternatively usually for fun, and the Tri Gen builds are definitely very viable for monks.

My stats for cookie builds.
http://www.d3rawr.com/d-289v5
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I tried very briefly with my dual LS swords last night and maybe I just need to get the hang of things and get all of the buffs in place. But even trash mobs were taking a lot longer than I'm used to. Maybe it's because I'm used to running with a 2H skorn, which makes my SW a lot stronger and that kills monsters faster? Or maybe I'm too used to dropping bells (or using PotA rune to reduce knockback)?

For some reason, I was hoping that the SW/C would be a long stronger than it was. So in a tri-gen build, what's the main source of damage - your primary attacks? Or SW/C?

Maybe I need to use bells in place of FitL buff, as that doesn't seem to have a huge impact either.


At your level of gear, you are going to notice a slow down in the speed of killing, if switching from Bells to Tri-Gen. It's more of an intermediate type of build, for people who can't make it through MP 10 on Bells. If you can do that effortlessly - Tri-Gen is a fun thing to experiment with, but probably not the most efficient option you can choose, if killing speed is your #1 objective.

I'd say about 60% of the damage output comes from Generator attacks and the remaining 40% is Cyclones, although my observations are probably somewhat distorted by the FoT bonus from my Radiance. WKL is a big part of this build - you should try it with one of those, if you have a spare one rolling around in your stash - it will speed up things quite noticeably. DW rares is for low-grade gear novices, fresh from Hell - it's doable, but very inefficient and WKL should be their first upgrade, if sticking with the build.

You could also experiment around with the Skorn (see Flattylol's guide, the link is on 1st page of this thread). I believe there is some breakpoint requirement for AS, though, if using the Skorn and I guess you'll have to get the knack of timing your Generator refreshes correctly, as with the slower mode of attack you'll have to see when one is about to expire couple of seconds in advance, in order to have enough time to reactivate it, before it drops down. I'm not a big believer in the Skorn thing, but if Flatty says it's good - I have no reason to mistrust him.

If you want to fool around with some crossbreeds, you can try something similar to Weegee, who has married Nirvana to Duo-Gen and says it's a happy relationship. I've seen him play it and it looks pretty good - http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Weegee-6520/hero/18207212
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^ nice write up.

This is one of the stuff that I had in my guide over at jsp. Hopefully it's not outdated as I didn't update my guide there for 2 month i think.

But yeah, Nameless, try this sometimes. You might like it. It's fun.

2B) Infused Bell Build

Ideal weapon set up : Slow weapon MH + Crit EF (Can be swapped with LS WKL or LS EF)

Passive Variation:
Exalted Soul or Beacon or Guiding Light
STI or NDE

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/monk#aUSXek!gbX!abcYaa

This utilizes the same Nirvana mechanic but with Bell instead of Cyclone Strike.

You can literally drop as many as 12 WALL OF LIGHTS within 5 seconds. Insane burst dmg. Best to spam these when the elites are against the wall since Bell knockbacks the mobs.
Edited by KimSulki84#1308 on 7/11/2013 9:58 AM PDT
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