Diablo® III

Diablo 3 needs "power-up" quests like Diablo 2 did

07/26/2013 04:45 PMPosted by Haltemi
adding quests like this would be cool but i dont see how it really adds to the longevity of the game...


+1

People are crazy if they think those minor changes will make millions of quitters come back or people that thinking to quit , stay instead.

Cool itemization / LADDER / PvP / Paragons to give manually to put attributes / Bosses to drop special items you cant find from annoying Elites and so many more things... Who cares about quests.

Personally in D2 i didnt care AT ALL for example if i did the quest in ACT3 for extra attributes or not , i did though for extra skill points. Something that D3 missing , skill trees that is.
Edited by Azatis#2345 on 7/27/2013 3:38 AM PDT
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07/27/2013 03:37 AMPosted by Azatis
Personally in D2 i didnt care AT ALL for example if i did the quest in ACT3 for extra attributes or not , i did though for extra skill points. Something that D3 missing , skill trees that is.


I'm really tired of hearing this. D2's skill trees were utter rubbish. Sure they might have made you reroll your 1st guy because you screwed him up but the last thing this game needs is to copy the garbage parts of D2. Some sort of skill customization is fine but not anything like the awful system D2 had. You almost never put less than 20 pts in a skill in D2, it is no different than what we have no with D3 as you basically pick the skills you want to use and that is all the skill system is. D2 was absolutely no different, you picked your main skills and put 20 pts (or slightly less if you could get enough gear mods) into it. Stop talking about D2's skill system like it was a good part of the game because it was awful.
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07/27/2013 03:37 AMPosted by Azatis
adding quests like this would be cool but i dont see how it really adds to the longevity of the game...


+1

People are crazy if they think those minor changes will make millions of quitters come back or people that thinking to quit , stay instead.

Cool itemization / LADDER / PvP / Paragons to give manually to put attributes / Bosses to drop special items you cant find from annoying Elites and so many more things... Who cares about quests.

Personally in D2 i didnt care AT ALL for example if i did the quest in ACT3 for extra attributes or not , i did though for extra skill points. Something that D3 missing , skill trees that is.


Yes...

The reason level 1-60 is so boring is because of the preset skill system...

+ It would add 1000 of hours of gameplay to each class since there would be so many builds per class to explore
And the items will be much easier to spread out because of all the specialized builds..

This game need proper character builds, not an endless grindfest with paragon
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Personally in D2 i didnt care AT ALL for example if i did the quest in ACT3 for extra attributes or not , i did though for extra skill points. Something that D3 missing , skill trees that is.


I'm really tired of hearing this. D2's skill trees were utter rubbish. Sure they might have made you reroll your 1st guy because you screwed him up but the last thing this game needs is to copy the garbage parts of D2. Some sort of skill customization is fine but not anything like the awful system D2 had. You almost never put less than 20 pts in a skill in D2, it is no different than what we have no with D3 as you basically pick the skills you want to use and that is all the skill system is. D2 was absolutely no different, you picked your main skills and put 20 pts (or slightly less if you could get enough gear mods) into it. Stop talking about D2's skill system like it was a good part of the game because it was awful.


Its doesn't have to be a tree... Just some proper character builds.. It's a big gap they have left in the Diablo formula since they removed it, but didn't replace it with anything

You only mention reroll as the reason for not doing it...

But if you had made a perfect Zealer lvl 95 and you got bored of him you had the option to start a new pala and make him Smite...
This way one class has MANY hours of fun gameplay since it is way more fun to build a hero than just to "progress" it...

Was so dissapointed when I leveled my Baba from lvl 1 to 2... Nothing to do... Just watch some stats automatically assaign themselves and some random skill unlock.. It's just boring
Edited by Psychonaut#2909 on 7/27/2013 5:24 AM PDT
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Nope. Leveling is still frustrating at this range even with those weapons. I played through Hell and was still 59 after I beat diablo. It's the only diffculty where I have this issue and need to backtrack.

I can surprisingly still die because my defense is crap even with good dps. It's just not fun doing it at all.


loL I think there is a message there for the poster he is missing. So the problem is he went over on dps under on defense and this is Blizzards fault. He needs to ltp. This is the way it is meant to be and should be.

Ogee how sad he can't D2 his way through D3.
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07/27/2013 05:15 AMPosted by Psychonaut
The reason level 1-60 is so boring is because of the preset skill system...


100% false as well. Level in D3 is so much more fun than D2 because you can swap your skills around and try new things. In D2 your character is more or less finished at lvl 18, 24 or 30 and at that point all you did was put fluff points into your main skill to basically level them up with you. D2s skill system was worse in almost every way than D3s is. Fewer options by far and a lot less fun while leveling.

The only good thing about D2 is that you couldn't respec so it sort of forced you into rerolling and even that is questionable whether it was a good thing or not. D2s skill system was really awful, anyone saying it was good is stuck in nostalgia mode.

This is for anyone who did not play D2. Anyone who says you had more freedom in how to spec while leveling in D2 is a bold face liar. You picked your spec at the start and were locked into it with no deviation and you played the exact same way from the time you got your primary attack until the time you quit your character or respeced once they added it. To make matters worse you had synergies which were more or less skills you didn't want to use but made your primary skill stronger and they sucked up viable options. The reality of D2 is you usually picked 2 or maybe if you were lucky 3 skills and that is where your points went and then you were stuck taking the synergies. One or the most restrictive skill systems ever made.
Edited by Ender#1738 on 7/27/2013 5:31 AM PDT
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So...

They added Inferno to provide a crazy difficulty for the top players.

Then they nerfed it to the ground when no one could beat it cause of their poor itemization / loot.

Now they want to remove Hell because they have too many pointless difficulties.

Why not just have 1 sodding difficulty then, not even name it, and instead include more Monster Power?
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07/27/2013 05:27 AMPosted by Ender
The reason level 1-60 is so boring is because of the preset skill system...


100% false as well. Level in D3 is so much more fun than D2 because you can swap your skills around and try new things. In D2 your character is more or less finished at lvl 18, 24 or 30 and at that point all you did was put fluff points into your main skill to basically level them up with you. D2s skill system was worse in almost every way than D3s is. Fewer options by far and a lot less fun while leveling.

The only good thing about D2 is that you couldn't respec so it sort of forced you into rerolling and even that is questionable whether it was a good thing or not. D2s skill system was really awful, anyone saying it was good is stuck in nostalgia mode.

This is for anyone who did not play D2. Anyone who says you had more freedom in how to spec while leveling in D2 is a bold face liar. You picked your spec at the start and were locked into it with no deviation and you played the exact same way from the time you got your primary attack until the time you quit your character or respeced once they added it. To make matters worse you had synergies which were more or less skills you didn't want to use but made your primary skill stronger and they sucked up viable options. The reality of D2 is you usually picked 2 or maybe if you were lucky 3 skills and that is where your points went and then you were stuck taking the synergies. One or the most restrictive skill systems ever made.


I didn't say that it gave us more freedom.. Quite the opposite infact...
But by limiting each build per class there is just a ton more playhours, with different builds instead of the same grind with paragon...

And I personally thought it was fun to build a class in D2...
Its just more fun to build a character if I have control over the outcome...
To implement a preset skill system where we are all the same and 100% gear dependent is the biggest mistake they made in this game imo...
Every class just feels like a dress up dull, when all we can optimize is the gear
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Like it or hate it the reality is the days of rerolling to fix a character are over. There hasn't been a major title that hasn't included some sort of skill respec in quite some time now. TL2 is probably the highest quality game I've seen that didn't offer full respecs in the past 7 years and there are ways to work around it. Someone will bring up PoE but I don't really count niche independent games that will never have a large player base, they get a lot more freedom in their choices since they don't have to appeal to a mass audience.

I can't tell you the number of times I rerolled in an old game like say Asheron's Call just to swap some skills around and yeah it can certainly be fun, but the player base at large hates it and it is a thing of the past. It isn't reasonable to expect it in D3. The best we can get is a ladder system so there are reasons to start over fresh.
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Reward achievements! Achievement awards should drop gear, provide bonus stats or something. Maybe having a random mini boss appear with each achievement or something.

Stop giving us stupid banners for getting achievements!
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Ender
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Like it or hate it the reality is the days of rerolling to fix a character are over. There hasn't been a major title that hasn't included some sort of skill respec in quite some time now. TL2 is probably the highest quality game I've seen that didn't offer full respecs in the past 7 years and there are ways to work around it. Someone will bring up PoE but I don't really count niche independent games that will never have a large player base, they get a lot more freedom in their choices since they don't have to appeal to a mass audience.

I can't tell you the number of times I rerolled in an old game like say Asheron's Call just to swap some skills around and yeah it can certainly be fun, but the player base at large hates it and it is a thing of the past. It isn't reasonable to expect it in D3. The best we can get is a ladder system so there are reasons to start over fresh.


Respecs are one thing, D3 has a completely preset system...
Like I said it's just much more fun to make a class if I acually have control over the build...
As D3 stands it doesn't have builds, just all options at all time...

Agree a ladder would help, but why keep making a Baba over and over with every reset, if the Babas will all be the same? If the experience through the levels are the same?

This progress system is just doing much more harm than good
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07/27/2013 03:23 AMPosted by TheTias
Right now, the road that lines the journey to the endgame is flat and devoid of feeling or reward, and full of potholes. Fix the road and make it so we can feel its presence beneath our feet as we run toward our destination and suddenly it goes from being a seemingly endless march and climbing out of holes after we've fallen down to a solid and well built path to glory.


I like everything that you have said, but I would like to add in a few things that might also help. That is adding in guest monsters that would show up in Act one of nightmare, but their frequency would be lower than hell and inferno.

Also create different events that you do not see in normal. Having some that are special that will only spawn in nightmare. Others that are special and will only spawn in hell and the same for inferno.
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07/26/2013 01:32 PMPosted by Capo
The story line and quest line in D3 is terrible.

d2 with d3 gfx.. iw ould be happy as.
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07/26/2013 01:32 PMPosted by Capo
The story line and quest line in D3 is terrible.


This.
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Posts: 332
I know this isn't a popular opinion, but for me personally, the greatest thing about D2 was how intricately tied together the story and the progression of character power was. I mean, that made D2 for me. I was majorly, drastically, epically let down by how in all of D3, there's only one quest that ties to the story. (When you get the ability to town portal after killing Haedrig's grandfather.) Playing D3, you hardly notice there's a story at all. It's all just run around and kill things. It seems almost counter intuitive when you have to even click on the NPCs to advance the story. Just LOOK at how closely tied D2 character progression was to the story:

Act 1:
Quest 1: Cleanse the den of evil: Your reward +1 skill points.
Quest 2: Kill Blood Raven: Your reward A merc.
Quest 3: Rescue Cain: Your reward A Rare Ring. (Something rare to find at that point in the game)
Quest 4: Kill the Countess: Your reward A pile of gold, gems, and runes. (And this was technically a sidequest, since you could finish the act/game without even doing this quest!)
Quest 5: Get the Horadric Hammer. Your reward is the enchanting of an item into a rare.
Quest 6: Kill Andariel. Your reward is... Nothing! Other than moving onto the next act.

JUST LOOK AT THIS. Look at how closely tied the story in D2 is to character progression/power. D3 is entirely like Quest 6, with the exception of the one quest that gives you the town portal. You never get anything (gold+XP is such a terrible solution I'd rather not mention it.) ever again for completeing a quest. It's all just hack/slash then click NPC. Huge letdown. D2 literally had me glued to it with how well tied the story and character development were tied together. I remember how I used to always play longer than I planned after finishing a difficulty level so I could do the den of evil and collect that 'free' skill point on the higher difficulty level. I remmeber spending so much time thinking about how I could have better used free skill points, and planning out entire builds based on quest rewards. With D3 you just never have this personal attachment or drive to play. Right now it's like the entire game is just one big Act/Quest and the only reward is Paragon 100 for +300 Gold and Magic Find.


Damn, I just realized the quests in Diablo 2 were more rewarding than I thought when I made this thread.

Lets not forget about how in Act V there was a godly quest that would give one free socket to an item of your choice. Right when you thought that your Wind Force bow couldn't get any stronger.
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0-60 is a pain.
Ideally, I'd like to create a DH that is level 60 and inferno capable so I'd just gear him thorugh gah and start paragon leveling and testing different builds.
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I know this isn't a popular opinion, but for me personally, the greatest thing about D2 was how intricately tied together the story and the progression of character power was. I mean, that made D2 for me. I was majorly, drastically, epically let down by how in all of D3, there's only one quest that ties to the story. (When you get the ability to town portal after killing Haedrig's grandfather.) Playing D3, you hardly notice there's a story at all. It's all just run around and kill things. It seems almost counter intuitive when you have to even click on the NPCs to advance the story. Just LOOK at how closely tied D2 character progression was to the story:

Act 1:
Quest 1: Cleanse the den of evil: Your reward +1 skill points.
Quest 2: Kill Blood Raven: Your reward A merc.
Quest 3: Rescue Cain: Your reward A Rare Ring. (Something rare to find at that point in the game)
Quest 4: Kill the Countess: Your reward A pile of gold, gems, and runes. (And this was technically a sidequest, since you could finish the act/game without even doing this quest!)
Quest 5: Get the Horadric Hammer. Your reward is the enchanting of an item into a rare.
Quest 6: Kill Andariel. Your reward is... Nothing! Other than moving onto the next act.

JUST LOOK AT THIS. Look at how closely tied the story in D2 is to character progression/power. D3 is entirely like Quest 6, with the exception of the one quest that gives you the town portal. You never get anything (gold+XP is such a terrible solution I'd rather not mention it.) ever again for completeing a quest. It's all just hack/slash then click NPC. Huge letdown. D2 literally had me glued to it with how well tied the story and character development were tied together. I remember how I used to always play longer than I planned after finishing a difficulty level so I could do the den of evil and collect that 'free' skill point on the higher difficulty level. I remmeber spending so much time thinking about how I could have better used free skill points, and planning out entire builds based on quest rewards. With D3 you just never have this personal attachment or drive to play. Right now it's like the entire game is just one big Act/Quest and the only reward is Paragon 100 for +300 Gold and Magic Find.


None of those things actually mattered though, It was all just spice on your way to get to hell act 4
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
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Posts: 883
The only way to add longevity to the endgame would be to make it so that your character can always keep improving in ways besides paragon levels. My Monk has hit a wall where I can't really get any better without spending on the RMAH, just to have better gear to do ....nothing.
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Respecs are one thing, D3 has a completely preset system...
Like I said it's just much more fun to make a class if I acually have control over the build...
As D3 stands it doesn't have builds, just all options at all time...


D2 has basically the same skill system. You pick 4 main skills and a secondary skill and then put the rest of the points in the skills that lead up to them. You give D2 way too much credit here. Nobody built D2 characters without max skills so in D2 you picked 4 main skills, in D3 you pick 8. That is more or less the difference in the two character systems. D3s system adds way more depth than D2 ever had. I just don't get people who think D2 was deep. The difference in characters had more to do with gear choices than skill choices even in D2.
Edited by Ender#1738 on 7/27/2013 11:30 AM PDT
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