Diablo® III

Self-Found mode: Why do you feel it's necessary?

08/27/2013 08:19 AMPosted by Vresiberba
The whole point of SF is that you only use what you find. That is the limitation.

Actually, the point of self-found is that you make your own rules and play however you like, it's therefore completely counter productive to have the game make these rules up for you.

Don't want to shop on the AH? Don't shop on the AH.
Don't want to utilise a follower? Don't hire a follower.
Don't want to use any Legendary items? Don't pick up Legendary items.

Do whatever you like, ignore whatever everyone else is doing, the world is your oyster.


The solution is called quitting.Are u held hostage?Go to another game that delivers this very very apreciated notion of SF...oh wait...there isn't any...damn i wonder why
08/27/2013 08:21 AMPosted by Z3r05k1ll

Actually, the point of self-found is that you make your own rules and play however you like, it's therefore completely counter productive to have the game make these rules up for you.

Don't want to shop on the AH? Don't shop on the AH.
Don't want to utilise a follower? Don't hire a follower.
Don't want to use any Legendary items? Don't pick up Legendary items.

Do whatever you like, ignore whatever everyone else is doing, the world is your oyster.


The solution is called quitting.Are u held hostage?Go to another game that delivers this very very apreciated notion of SF...oh wait...there isn't any...damn i wonder why

What?!
I don't think that's really enough to justify a complete new mode that segregates the community.

The whole point of SF is that you only use what you find. That is the limitation. It means that you can't have the best possible gear, but for them, that's fine.. it's part of the challenge of the game and that is completely fine.


And we can make our own items, but you hit the nail on the head.

Creating the separate mode with better drops is really them asking Blizzard to fix up itemization.. which is what everyone has been asking for months now.


Actually we don't expect better drops but if Blizzard would treat the new SF Mode the way they do the console then that would be great! Both SF and consoles do not have AHs. SF is a playstyle and not a fix for itemization...just to clarify.

It's unreasonable for any SF player to compare themselves to anyone who uses AH. The difference between AH and Blizzard's itemization for SF players is the difference between chocolate and sh!t.. SF is accepting that. There was a monk who recently cleared MP10 Inferno 100% SF. If he complained and asked for a SF mode, he would never have gotten that far.


Yes we accept that, just as you stated. I applaud this Monk and have given him kudos in two of his threads. He freely admits that he did buy mats and gems though so he isn't 100% SF but he definitely has proven that you don't have to buy items in order to obtain 400k DPS.

I understand that what they want is a level playing field and that AH skews the advantage to those who use it, but if you're forcing a self imposed rule on yourself, you also have no right to complain about AH users. Funnily enough, this has nothing to do with a SF mode at all.


Agree. Some of us get heated with the constant battering from the haters and resort to attacking them back. If you notice, in almost all threads discussing SF, we defend and the haters attack. We supply rational and sound reasons and they use "You can already do that" statements. I think you have an open mind and the wisdom to see the truth; that is all that we really want.
Edited by SirRight#1618 on 8/27/2013 8:55 AM PDT
I don't think that's really enough to justify a complete new mode that segregates the community.

The whole point of SF is that you only use what you find. That is the limitation. It means that you can't have the best possible gear, but for them, that's fine.. it's part of the challenge of the game and that is completely fine.


And we can make our own items, but you hit the nail on the head.

Creating the separate mode with better drops is really them asking Blizzard to fix up itemization.. which is what everyone has been asking for months now.


Actually we don't expect better drops but if Blizzard would treat the new SF Mode the way they do the console then that would be great! Both SF and consoles do not have AHs. SF is a playstyle and not a fix for itemization...just to clarify.

It's unreasonable for any SF player to compare themselves to anyone who uses AH. The difference between AH and Blizzard's itemization for SF players is the difference between chocolate and sh!t.. SF is accepting that. There was a monk who recently cleared MP10 Inferno 100% SF. If he complained and asked for a SF mode, he would never have gotten that far.[quote]

Yes we accept that, just as you stated. I applaud this Monk and have given him kudos in two of his threads. He freely admits that he did buy mats and gems though so he isn't 100% SF but he definitely has proven that you don't have to buy items in order to obtain 400k DPS.

[quote]I understand that what they want is a level playing field and that AH skews the advantage to those who use it, but if you're forcing a self imposed rule on yourself, you also have no right to complain about AH users. Funnily enough, this has nothing to do with a SF mode at all.


Agree. Some of us get heated with the constant battering from the haters and resort to attacking them back. If you notice, in almost all threads discussing SF, we defend and the haters attack. We supply rational and sound reasons and they use "You can already do that" statements. I think you have an open mind and the wisdom to see the truth; that is all that we really want.

You are around 10 people who just try to use the forums as a propaganda tool for a selfish crave that is not supported by the majority.I am glad people are finally getting suffocated by your non-sense and start to act.Quit or get lost...who cares?!? the other 9?
Reading all of the posts just on this page gives me a renewed interest in being one of the beacons for a separate and optional SFcore Mode of play.

You see, I and the other Selfies have devoted countless hours on a huge number of threads to promote the value of a SF Mode. In most cases we are saying the exact same things, over and over, to usually the same haters.

The argument isn't really for them at all; we repeat the same facts over and over for the people on the side lines, the people who have an open mind and can at least see the possibility. The wise ones will see that we present well founded facts and the Trolls just use baseless "You already can do that" statements.

So the show is for you and if it has converted some of you towards our cause, great! If you can at least see that this Mode wouldn't affect anyone else in the game then good. If you think it's a stupid idea and see no reason for incorporating a SF Mode into the game then we either failed to enlighten you or you do not have the mental acuity to understand our premise.


You accomplish exactly the opposite because people are starting to perceive you billion posts on this topic as spam/flood.SF will not happen just because it's number 1 million in game features that need to be fixed ASAP list.YOU want a SF mode...you are too small in numbers my friends and are not the majority.Majority NEEDS other fixes first which take time maybe years.So bb and see you 50 times per day on forum for the next 2 years.


If that is what it takes to get people like you to actually read and understand the real reasons then so be it!

- I don't start SF posts but I do reply to them;
- You see so many posts from me because people like you attack and then you hate me for defending my position;
- I have always maintained that a separate and optional SFcore Mode of play can be worked on after all of the other more important items/expansions are finished but people like you ignore this and continue to state that we want it now;
- We may be small in numbers but history has shown that if a cause is just then sometimes the Majority will enter a paradigm shift in thinking to what the Minority is advocating; and
- And of course you close with an insult but don't worry, I don't need to resort to that tactic to get my point across.
08/27/2013 08:13 AMPosted by Z3r05k1ll

Oh, really?



+1

LOL it's more and more amusing :D


Wow you really had to go back to a very old thread to try to beat me senseless.

For the open minded:
The halo was a half joke but having a different colour name font, like Hardcore employs, would be sufficient. The halo would have gone well with the people who bought the Collector's Edition and have the "wings".

Mr. Hater,

If that is the only point that you can find against my SF argument then I stand happy knowing that all the other tenants of my SF philosophy are firm and just!
08/27/2013 08:36 AMPosted by SirRight
- And of course you close with an insult but don't worry, I don't need to resort to that tactic to get my point across.


Give it a rest, you're fooling exactly no-one.

08/27/2013 08:07 AMPosted by SirRight
If you think it's a stupid idea and see no reason for incorporating a SF Mode into the game then we either failed to enlighten you or you do not have the mental acuity to understand our premise.
Posted by SirRight
Wow you really had to go back to a very old thread to try to beat me senseless.

For the open minded:
The halo was a half joke but having a different colour name font, like Hardcore employs, would be sufficient. The halo would have gone well with the people who bought the Collector's Edition and have the "wings".

Mr. Hater,

If that is the only point that you can find against my SF argument then I stand happy knowing that all the other tenants of my SF philosophy are firm and just!

It was me who wrote that, SirRight, despite you having me on ignore. You are now tainted and must delete yourself.
Edited by Vresiberba#2940 on 8/27/2013 8:47 AM PDT
08/27/2013 08:14 AMPosted by MrDuMa
So the show is for you and if it has converted some of you towards our cause, great! If you can at least see that this Mode wouldn't affect anyone else in the game then good. If you think it's a stupid idea and see no reason for incorporating a SF Mode into the game then we either failed to enlighten you or you do not have the mental acuity to understand our premise.

I took you seriously until you said that last line.

I have skipped a lot of the details that the other SF players have brought forward so if you may, could you repeat them just this one more time?

Just out of interest, what is your reply to the usual "troll" post of "You can already do that"?


Sorry about that. I am human and the constant hatred does wear away on one. It does seem strange though that haters can get away with murder on the forums but Selfies have to be 100% pure and tolerant. Okay, I'll try harder.

"You can already do that" Response:

- Sure we can but how do we play in public games with other like-minded people?
- Do we have to create our own web page and matchmaking service, why isn't this something that the game could do instead, so that we can play public SF games.
- How do you know the person you are playing with is actually legit and plays 100% the same way you do?
- How do you know it isn't a hater who is pretending to be SF and then drops a Best-in-Slot item that you think the game dropped; he then goes on the forums and says "SirRight isn't SF anymore because he is using an item I dropped for him, in game!";
- Why should I have to track all of my mats and gold so I don't use an non-SF character's stuff. Shouldn't the game be able to do that for me as well?
- How do I start a new SF character and reset the Blacksmith, Jeweler, and Mystic to zero, just for that SF character?
- Why would I want to stay with people who don't play the way I and other like minded players do, have to constantly endure their pointing at our scrub gear, calling us names, and booting us from public games (which is why we don't even bother to play public games).

I may have missed a few but this is generally our response. The haters just wait 2 or 3 pages and then use the same attack again, or some random hater does a drive-by flame.
08/27/2013 08:43 AMPosted by Vresiberba
- And of course you close with an insult but don't worry, I don't need to resort to that tactic to get my point across.


Give it a rest, you're fooling exactly no-one.

If you think it's a stupid idea and see no reason for incorporating a SF Mode into the game then we either failed to enlighten you or you do not have the mental acuity to understand our premise.


AHAHAHAH more and more amusing omg.How do theese people survive till the age of 10 even in the real-world?
08/27/2013 08:36 AMPosted by SirRight
We may be small in numbers but history has shown that if a cause is just then sometimes the Majority will enter a paradigm shift in thinking to what the Minority is advocating; and


This guy. I am very worried for him. At first he was annoying. Now, he's just getting a bit scary.

This is a video game. An amusement device. A leisurely way to pass ones time. How, in any way, is a push for a special mode in a video game a "just cause"? Sometimes the majority will enter a paradigm shift in thinking? Really? You think you are going to change peoples opinions by acting like a fanatical, disturbingly odd pain in the behind?

Seriously, you really have to talk to someone. There are people out there who can help you. I'm not trying to be condescending or a jerk. You really are sounding like you are getting close to the edge.
08/27/2013 08:18 AMPosted by Z3r05k1ll

I took you seriously until you said that last line.

I have skipped a lot of the details that the other SF players have brought forward so if you may, could you repeat them just this one more time?

Just out of interest, what is your reply to the usual "troll" post of "You can already do that"?


Actually we failed to enlighten you and make you see what a non-sense you are asking.Or maybe you lack the mental acuity needed to understand the selfish and idiotic nature of your request.Usually people who gather in flocks share this trait i have to admit..


As you provide no argument and just spit out bile, I happily add you to my ignore list, Z3r05k1ll.


Actually we failed to enlighten you and make you see what a non-sense you are asking.Or maybe you lack the mental acuity needed to understand the selfish and idiotic nature of your request.Usually people who gather in flocks share this trait i have to admit..


As you provide no argument and just spit out bile, I happily add you to my ignore list, Z3r05k1ll.


lol, just lol. This guy is crazy. I'm sorry but, he is flat out insane. Probably get banned for saying it but, this guy needs to be removed from the forums. I may flame people when I get a bit heated but, this guy has got serious mental health issues. There is just no other way to explain the way he acts.
[quote]
- And of course you close with an insult but don't worry, I don't need to resort to that tactic to get my point across.


Ha! I see what you did there!

This is coming from a player indifferent to Diablo 2; I was about 8 years old when D2 came out. When Diablo 3 came out, I jumped in with only a rough idea of what to expect.

When I started playing, I noticed and clicked on the "Auction House" button almost immediately. That I could use my in-game earned gold to purchase equips that were useful to me was very satisfying. Whenever I grinded and npc-ed gear to buy that next upgrade, I felt happy because the time I put into killing mobs paid off. This is a different sort of satisfaction to the loot/grind satisfaction I see people posting about; I take pleasure in earning money to buy upgrades and leveling up.

Now, I have some friends who were fans of Diablo 2 and disliked Diablo 3 because of the AH functionality. I wanted them to play with me, but couldn't very well ask them NOT to click on the big glowing "AH" button with the temptation right there. As many people have said, we shouldn't have to resist temptation while playing games to relax. Therefore, most (all but 1) of my friends quit Diablo 3 a week after the game launch, mainly due to the AH functionality.

If an option to introduce SF playing was incorporated, I see only improvements to the Diablo 3 community, and more profits to Blizzard.

1. Most players who enjoy this playing mode are already playing by themselves, separated from the more profitable RMAH/AH-trading community. Therefore, adding an SF option would segregate the community, giving them a place to play and communicate with like-minded players.

2. Without the temptation of the Auction House always there, players who didn't like playing while resisting the allure of the AH might start playing Diablo 3 again. The higher the number of happy players, the higher the number of recommendations made and the higher the number of new players.

3. If a small portion of the SF players become curious and click on the "AH" button, that's another addition to the (long-term) profitable community Blizzard is interested in.

I'd really like to hear Blizzard's take on this, but we're not that symmetric with information, are we? :(
I'd really like to hear Blizzard's take on this, but we're not that symmetric with information, are we? :(


They've already said in so many words that they are working on fixes to the game that will make a SF realm unnecessary. I think maybe that's why SirRight has finally gone over the edge. I think deep down, he's starting to realize a SF realm is very unlikely any time in the foreseeable future and he just can't handle it.

Everything they've said about the fixes and expansion are telling us they are working on ways to make the AH less desirable and necessary. NO, they haven't specifically said "We are not adding a SF realm" but, anyone with a clue understands that a SF realm is highly unlikely.
08/27/2013 09:12 AMPosted by BlayneRTFM
I'd really like to hear Blizzard's take on this, but we're not that symmetric with information, are we? :(


They've already said in so many words that they are working on fixes to the game that will make a SF realm unnecessary. I think maybe that's why SirRight has finally gone over the edge. I think deep down, he's starting to realize a SF realm is very unlikely any time in the foreseeable future and he just can't handle it.

Everything they've said about the fixes and expansion are telling us they are working on ways to make the AH less desirable and necessary. NO, they haven't specifically said "We are not adding a SF realm" but, anyone with a clue understands that a SF realm is highly unlikely.

Yes they are desperate.But still identical in terms of wits(close to zero) :D
08/27/2013 09:18 AMPosted by JaqenHghar
- Why would I want to stay with people who don't play the way I and other like minded players do, have to constantly endure their pointing at our scrub gear, calling us names, and booting us from public games (which is why we don't even bother to play public games).


Wow. that actually happens? that is cold man. some folks just can't afford to use the AH's, they're lucky to have the game and a computer to play it on. Others choose not to spend their discretionary income on a game that is, in their opinion, supposed to provide everything you need to play once you spend the money on it. Maybe they feel they are being scammed? They paid for a game and now they find that to play it to it's maximum potential, they have to spend more money. Then there's guys like me who don't mind dropping a few bucks in order to create the "ultimate warrior".

The point is we are all here to enjoy ourselves and belittling someone for their gear or style of play is rude, ignorant and just plain mean. I don't mind carrying someone through a run or helping them out with gear that I can't use but may help them. I didn't just pop into this game with my skills and gear, someone helped me. Someone carried me at different times. Someone took the time to teach me which skills to use for max effect. Someone gave me gear I didn't have, didn't know about or couldn't afford at the time.

We're a community and like any community we work best when we work together.


Actually, that doesn't happen. Only the people pushing the hardest for SF say it happens. Myself and other people who have played SF quite a bit have NEVER had a problem with other players. A couple of times, someone has offered a piece of gear and tried to give me some advice on gear and, when I tell them I'm just playing SF atm, they are like "Oh, OK cool". That's it. At worst someone might join a game and then leave. Maybe they are being harassed for their attitude rather than their gear. I've never had a problem and I've never seen anyone else get trolled in game so, I think it's just BS.
[quote]
- And of course you close with an insult but don't worry, I don't need to resort to that tactic to get my point across.


Ha! I see what you did there!

This is coming from a player indifferent to Diablo 2; I was about 8 years old when D2 came out. When Diablo 3 came out, I jumped in with only a rough idea of what to expect.

When I started playing, I noticed and clicked on the "Auction House" button almost immediately. That I could use my in-game earned gold to purchase equips that were useful to me was very satisfying. Whenever I grinded and npc-ed gear to buy that next upgrade, I felt happy because the time I put into killing mobs paid off. This is a different sort of satisfaction to the loot/grind satisfaction I see people posting about; I take pleasure in earning money to buy upgrades and leveling up.

Now, I have some friends who were fans of Diablo 2 and disliked Diablo 3 because of the AH functionality. I wanted them to play with me, but couldn't very well ask them NOT to click on the big glowing "AH" button with the temptation right there. As many people have said, we shouldn't have to resist temptation while playing games to relax. Therefore, most (all but 1) of my friends quit Diablo 3 a week after the game launch, mainly due to the AH functionality.

If an option to introduce SF playing was incorporated, I see only improvements to the Diablo 3 community, and more profits to Blizzard.

1. Most players who enjoy this playing mode are already playing by themselves, separated from the more profitable RMAH/AH-trading community. Therefore, adding an SF option would segregate the community, giving them a place to play and communicate with like-minded players.

2. Without the temptation of the Auction House always there, players who didn't like playing while resisting the allure of the AH might start playing Diablo 3 again. The higher the number of happy players, the higher the number of recommendations made and the higher the number of new players.

3. If a small portion of the SF players become curious and click on the "AH" button, that's another addition to the (long-term) profitable community Blizzard is interested in.

I'd really like to hear Blizzard's take on this, but we're not that symmetric with information, are we? :(


Yes, thank you! The more people who come back, the more chance they will buy the expansion, the more chance there will be more future expansions.

A Blue post, before D3 was released, did state that the RMAH 15% fee was not intended as a profit making vehicle but just to subsidize server and other logistical costs. But unless they tell us, we really don't know how much money that feature brings in.

I am not against Auction Houses at all; they provide enjoyment for many players. That is why my thoughts on SF only serve to benefit the whole community by not affecting the game that is presently in place.

It's nice to see someone who understands why we want SF!
I'm a Muslim, I don't eat pork, so I think I need a special place where nobody is allowed to eat it. I demand, that in every town of the world, ther must be at least two restaurants, markets and public places where eating pork is not allowed, in case I might visit said towns, eventually.

I demand this globally, literally in ervery town of the world, just because it's my style.

But please, you all suck with your bacon and your sandwich and I can't just look the other way, because I'm a freakin' selfish brat.
Edited by Eraser#2219 on 8/27/2013 9:39 AM PDT
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