Diablo® III

Ok. What is up with barbarians?

Seriously.

Get this, I haven't played my barb in nearly a year. Why? I was disgusted with it. Sprint, whirlwind, etc etc. Boring. I had been running a tanky DH and a very squishy (but decent) CM freeze wiz mostly, and even played a WD for a bit.

But the barb.

Ok.

Here is the story. Couple nights ago, I join a friends game. She had another player in the game, (who was playing a barb) and got to talking. Honestly I can't remember his user name, which is really sad, but if you saw how full my list was you would all understand.

Point is, he showed me this build for the barb he was using. He looked at mine, said that I could run the same build, just swap a couple pieces of gear.

Get this. He stressed using slower weaps, less APS. I naturally scratched my head, but figured, what the hell.

SO.

My current barbarian build that is on my profile is what I'm currently using. This was tweaked last night, after I was surprised at how well a ~60k damage Barb could do in an MP8 game! I was like wtf?

So now, I have a base damage of 88k. Wooooo big whup right?

SO WHY THE HELL AM I GETTING 2 million damage on CRIT!???

No seriously! I even have a screen shot of the 1.4 and 1.5's I get fairly often, I see 1.9s occasionally and even saw a 2 (just over). Not sure what the highest possible is, but damn! From an 88k base?????? Ok the barb is WAY over the top or what?

Is the just the way the skills combine? Is it the gear? I had a couple of friends try the build, but they have yet to get anywhere near those numbers.

Yes, I don't crit very often, (not a lot of CC at the moment) and my CD could use more boost, but holy crap. I would be able to one shot monsters in MP10 with 4 players in game if the crit goes higher than it does now. And get this!

I don't even have but maybe 30 or 40 mil in gear and a crap ton of gems. (I usually just buy those off the RMAH, hate screwing around wasting gold on them) So yeah with the gems its probably around what.. few hundred million gold?

SO what is it with this build? Why is this simple level 60 mule that I had sitting in the pool of characters collecting dust now a fun build to play at the moment? lol

Just thought I would throw this out here. I don't really play barb much, so maybe someone else can shed some light on this.

Thanks.

Edit

My profile may say other than 88k but the base IS 88k. With one skill it jumps to 109k, with both it goes up around 286k, or something. Just thought I would add that.
Edited by DTMAce#1687 on 8/28/2013 9:00 PM PDT
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Hmmmmm

No one has any input? =/

I'm just trying to understand how this build can crit so damn high.
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If you replaced Superstition with Brawler passive and stand near at least 3 monsters, you'd crit for maybe 3 million instead of just 2 million.

If you also replaced Ancient Spear with Bash + Punish, you'd crit for maybe 4 million instead of the measly 2 million you're dumbfounded about. :-)

Ohh... One more thing. If you replaced that weapon with a Skorn with similar average damage, you'd crit more often.
Edited by MasterPUA#6728 on 8/28/2013 10:28 PM PDT
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Ahh that's why. Your Boulder Breaker and that weapon in general has huge base damage and damage range. So when you crit with Hammer of the Ancients smash you are doing 420% damage based off that weapon. Yeah...it adds up lol.
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You are using WoTB - insanity

Your high crits only last for 15 secs. I suggest you take a look at some of the guides in the sticky.
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Put crudely, in case it wasn't obvious: DPS != damage. The former is average damage over time, the latter the actual damage produced in game.

Further to this, your sheet DPS is not used to calculate the damage of a single attack in the game. IIRC, it is simply a calculation of the DPS from a basic attack (i.e. no skill equipped).

A full exlpanation of the formula used to calculate the actual damage of any attack in game can be found here: http://www.diablofans.com/topic/65055-diablo3-dps-ehp-calculator-comparison-tool/#entry1081786. Bookmark this if you're really interested in unpacking actual damage.

Apart from this, there are 2 simple explanations why the crit hits might "appear" to be so much higher than your sheet DPS:

1. The skills you are using significantly buff the damage of an attack. For example, if Battle Rage and WotB:Insanity are active that adds 115% to your damage (which, is not the same as DPS).

2. You have very low attack speed, which makes for a very low sheet DPS and you are using a 2h weapon which means each hit seems "bigger". In other words, your setup hits harder but less often, translating to a very low sheet DPS but big damage numbers in game.
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I'm pretty sure I've hit 8 mil crits on my WD with some budget gear before, so it's not like having 2 mil crits is really that overpowered.
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If you replaced Superstition with Brawler passive and stand near at least 3 monsters, you'd crit for maybe 3 million instead of just 2 million.

If you also replaced Ancient Spear with Bash + Punish, you'd crit for maybe 4 million instead of the measly 2 million you're dumbfounded about. :-)

Ohh... One more thing. If you replaced that weapon with a Skorn with similar average damage, you'd crit more often.


Superstition eh? Funny, considering I'm not using that one. lol

The rest of you, thanks. Still, its no wonder the barbs seem more powerful than the other classes. The damage buffs are rather ridiculous!
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If you replaced Superstition with Brawler passive and stand near at least 3 monsters, you'd crit for maybe 3 million instead of just 2 million.

If you also replaced Ancient Spear with Bash + Punish, you'd crit for maybe 4 million instead of the measly 2 million you're dumbfounded about. :-)

Ohh... One more thing. If you replaced that weapon with a Skorn with similar average damage, you'd crit more often.


Superstition eh? Funny, considering I'm not using that one. lol

The rest of you, thanks. Still, its no wonder the barbs seem more powerful than the other classes. The damage buffs are rather ridiculous!


You probably haven't been playing the other classes well.

I'd pick a top end CM wiz anyday over a top end barb.

or a top end monk.

Edit:

Secret IK6 has been disovered. 200% more CD and 50% more elite damage.

*mutter*
Edited by Uberjager#6563 on 8/29/2013 7:24 AM PDT
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Barbs are overpowered just because they get so much for free so you can gear very cheaply, as well as being very survivable. But I agree with Uber, at the top-end I'd take any class other than DH over a barb. If you think you are critting high, you should see what I can do on my Nirvana monk.
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I can do okay too :'(
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Dude, you're using this skill called:

Wrath of the Berserker - Insanity

Read the description - Boosts damage by 100%. And it only lasts for 15 seconds with a cooldown of 120 secs.
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Some people bag on barbs for their excellent dps and damage-related skills.

Others bag on them for their excellent mobility.

And others yet cry for nerfs when they see how durable they are, particularly in the face of crowd control effects.

Barbs aren't strictly the best in any of these areas, but what they are are very good in all of them and bad in none. What makes the barbarian class the best in the game (and lets not beat around the bush, everyone knows it is) is that it is the most well-rounded. There is literally no aspect that a well-geared barb will be weak in. I'd go as far as to say that barb is the only class that has a good answer to any situation in the game. No matter what combination of elite affixes, no matter whether its experience runs, uber runs, essence runs, a barb will handle it effortlessly with practically no shortcomings in a way that none of the other classes can.

That's why there are always calls for nerfs, but the ones calling for nerfs can never precisely pin what it is that needs to be nerfed. There's no single thing, the barbarian class just has the best toolbox of any of the five classes.
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I should make a "why are barbarians so useless" thread just like YORI did with the DH's just to see what happens

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/9753775615
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08/29/2013 09:18 AMPosted by VocaloidNyan
I should make a "why are barbarians so useless" thread just like YORI did with the DH's just to see what happens

I would try to get it to reach popular topics and end up failing.
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I think I should purposely put 1-2b on my barb to be terribly unbalanced first, then post
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Nothing is UP with barbarians, everything is OP. :D
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Superstition eh? Funny, considering I'm not using that one. lol

The rest of you, thanks. Still, its no wonder the barbs seem more powerful than the other classes. The damage buffs are rather ridiculous!


You probably haven't been playing the other classes well.

I'd pick a top end CM wiz anyday over a top end barb.

or a top end monk.

Edit:

Secret IK6 has been disovered. 200% more CD and 50% more elite damage.

*mutter*


LOL That must be it. The secret boost. What did you mean by playing other classes well? I think I play them just fine, with the DH and the Wiz being my two favs. Melee was never my strong suit.

08/29/2013 08:15 AMPosted by Zambash
Barbs are overpowered just because they get so much for free so you can gear very cheaply, as well as being very survivable. But I agree with Uber, at the top-end I'd take any class other than DH over a barb. If you think you are critting high, you should see what I can do on my Nirvana monk.


I will agree that gear is dirt cheap. And for me, I would probably still consider my DH above my barb yet, but I can tell that stuff dies a lot faster with the barb at the moment. I'm sure I could tweak the DH some more and get a more efficient build there, if I put my mind to it.

08/29/2013 08:40 AMPosted by VocaloidNyan
I can do okay too :'(


LOL great!

Dude, you're using this skill called:

Wrath of the Berserker - Insanity

Read the description - Boosts damage by 100%. And it only lasts for 15 seconds with a cooldown of 120 secs.


Yes, I got that. But is it adding that 100 percent before or after other buffs? I mean really. In what order do you add percentages? You have this percentage, that percentage. I would have to think some come before others, right?

Some people bag on barbs for their excellent dps and damage-related skills.

Others bag on them for their excellent mobility.

And others yet cry for nerfs when they see how durable they are, particularly in the face of crowd control effects.

Barbs aren't strictly the best in any of these areas, but what they are are very good in all of them and bad in none. What makes the barbarian class the best in the game (and lets not beat around the bush, everyone knows it is) is that it is the most well-rounded. There is literally no aspect that a well-geared barb will be weak in. I'd go as far as to say that barb is the only class that has a good answer to any situation in the game. No matter what combination of elite affixes, no matter whether its experience runs, uber runs, essence runs, a barb will handle it effortlessly with practically no shortcomings in a way that none of the other classes can.

That's why there are always calls for nerfs, but the ones calling for nerfs can never precisely pin what it is that needs to be nerfed. There's no single thing, the barbarian class just has the best toolbox of any of the five classes.


No, not seeing a reason to make a change here. Just flabbergasted that the difference in dealing death to the demons seems so vastly different from a DH. I mean take a DH, give it 88k base damage and see if THAT kills as fast? It won't. Hell my 180k DH can't kill as fast. MY 150k Wiz kills faster than the DH for crying out loud.

But again, I know that gear and skill choices matter, which is why there are so many.

I should make a "why are barbarians so useless" thread just like YORI did with the DH's just to see what happens



LOL

08/29/2013 09:26 AMPosted by VocaloidNyan
I think I should purposely put 1-2b on my barb to be terribly unbalanced first, then post


Was this meant as a poke in the eye? Or just being funny?

08/29/2013 10:10 AMPosted by Shaman
Nothing is UP with barbarians, everything is OP. :D


LOL that's the truth apparently.

Thanks everyone for you replies, game on.
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Finding unexpected insane stuff is part of the package, I guess...

I won a cheap skorn on a bid before patch, when I decided to gear a 15mi barb. No one cared for double strength skorns, because AH hadn't green numbers yet.

Yesterday I realized I have over 33.7% dodge chance with WotB up (that "useless" 173 dex on Skorn...). It happens...

Maybe it will be useful to get my crusader a Hellfire Ring and some paragon levels, since I'm no mood at all to move gears around and equip the -3 hota soj or use RMAH to buy a decent LS Skorn. He did 2/3 of the walk on a budget and even got ubers EHP (So. Not. Reagearing.)...

(Ok, I kinda sidegrade my gloves to make it happen...)
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Well, in that case, what would be the easiest, simplest and best way to increase the damage on this setup? Lets just go with a single item, what would you suggest be changed?
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