Diablo® III

DIABLO 2 FANS

D2 was just a better ARPG experience. Forget all the end game crap or PvP nonsense. I liked the music, the art styling, the classes, the monsters, the itemization, the atmosphere, the creativity.


If D3 went the in depth skill tree route, with a stronger loot system core, it would easily smoke diablo 2 for breakfest.

D3 did a lot of things amazing, but some key things like the loot it was way off. They are addressing in the expac and blizzard has my money.


Better skill system, much better itemization system, an art direction in a more Diablo style, a better music score, better classes and if the game actually had some heart and atmosphere then maybe it would beat D2.

Only improvements I have seen in D3 is the combat and gfx quality down to it being made on a much more modern engine and some other little things like auto gold pick up and shared stash. I actually feel like D3 has devolved to a hack n slash pre Diablo more akin to Gauntlet.
Edited by KrO#2349 on 9/7/2013 4:29 PM PDT
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D2 was a hit on release. The game was improved through expo + patches but the base of the game was already set in place from the get go.

Also 60k+ elite kills in D3 and you thought D2 was terrible at release? Oh dear.


lol my 60k+ kills on elites come from i played diablo 3 from launch up until march or february of this year? i check in now and then to see whats going on in the diablo 3 world when i consider playing again. as it sits right now i think i will just wait until the 2.0 kicks in.

do not make assumptions about peoples numbers unless you find out where they come from :)

when i stopped playing not many people had that many elite kills :)


My point wasn't that your elite kills was low. I will leave you to try and work it out..
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09/07/2013 04:24 PMPosted by KrO


If D3 went the in depth skill tree route, with a stronger loot system core, it would easily smoke diablo 2 for breakfest.

D3 did a lot of things amazing, but some key things like the loot it was way off. They are addressing in the expac and blizzard has my money.


Better skill system, much better itemization system, an art direction in a more Diablo style, a better music score, better classes and if the game actually had some heart and atmosphere then maybe it would beat D2.

Only improvements I have seen in D3 is the combat and gfx quality down to it being made on a much more modern engine and some other little things like auto gold pick up and shared stash. I actually feel like D3 has devolved to a hack n slash pre Diablo more akin to Gauntlet.


Well in reality this is 2013 and diablo 3 smokes out diablo 2.

Dont believe me? Go play D2, servers are still up.

Okay your not going to. Thats what I thought.
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09/07/2013 04:24 PMPosted by KrO


If D3 went the in depth skill tree route, with a stronger loot system core, it would easily smoke diablo 2 for breakfest.

D3 did a lot of things amazing, but some key things like the loot it was way off. They are addressing in the expac and blizzard has my money.


Better skill system, much better itemization system, an art direction in a more Diablo style, a better music score, better classes and if the game actually had some heart and atmosphere then maybe it would beat D2.

Only improvements I have seen in D3 is the combat and gfx quality down to it being made on a much more modern engine and some other little things like auto gold pick up and shared stash. I actually feel like D3 has devolved to a hack n slash pre Diablo more akin to Gauntlet.


Also dude pay attention to the sound effects on the demons. Just every little detail that gos unnoticed about D3.

it is actually very dark with a decent soundtrack. Dont know what your talking about. Monsters getting cut in half and flung across the room.

Complaining just to complain it seems.
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09/07/2013 04:20 PMPosted by Diablo2PVPER
Training the wrong skills, like in any roleplaying game, will make you weak.


Why have the skill there then if it is just a "noob trap" skill? The only point is to get to the next skill???????

With that logic they should just delete all the "wrong skills" because it is just noob trap bait and shame on you if you put points into it.

D2 had dead skills, but you could take diablo 2 skill tree and make everything viable in the end game with diablo 3's % weapon damage innovation.
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Better skill system, much better itemization system, an art direction in a more Diablo style, a better music score, better classes and if the game actually had some heart and atmosphere then maybe it would beat D2.

Only improvements I have seen in D3 is the combat and gfx quality down to it being made on a much more modern engine and some other little things like auto gold pick up and shared stash. I actually feel like D3 has devolved to a hack n slash pre Diablo more akin to Gauntlet.


Well in reality this is 2013 and diablo 3 smokes out diablo 2.

Dont believe me? Go play D2, servers are still up.

Okay your not going to. Thats what I thought.


Was playing D2 a bit offline last week actually, really enjoyed it more so than my recent D3 playtime which I also think is a decent game. I am not even a particular fan of the Diablo series, Baldur's Gate, Final Fantasy, Starcraft - those are the games I consider myself a fan of, so I am just giving it like it is. Get butthurt by all means.

Maybe you should go and play some brawling, oh wait that sucks even harder than that trash PvP from D2.
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Yeah... and people don't seem to realize we've already played the hell out of Diablo 2. Easily the most hours /played of any game I own. I still play it from time to time.

Those saying "Well if D2 was so great, then go play it"... we have. We want to play the sequel now, and would have preferred if it were as good as the previous installment.
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Training the wrong skills, like in any roleplaying game, will make you weak.


This makes no sense. How can
there ever be "wrong skills"?
If i wanted to use ravens, ought not
they be decent and usable, else
why are they there at all...
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Diablo 2 was not blessed with an auction house, so players had to put on a magnifier glass and sort through flooded trade spam chat for hours instead..

Also diablo 2 had horrible skill trees, nothing was viable for the endgame except a few build paths. It had no way of respec, so if you misclicked once, you would have to reroll character if you wanted to be efficient.

Diablo 2 was all about power rush into power runs. Could get rushed and become lvl 70 area in a few days. Everyones endgame gear was identical as well.

But what was amazing for diablo 2, was the PvP. Could spend hours dueling outside of town.


you are spreading lies. you CAN reset your stats and you could actually find your own gear in Diablo 2 because the drop raters were 1000x's higher. in diablo 3, drop rates are low to help not flood the ah
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For someone with the name Diablo2PVPER, you sure are uneducated about Diablo 2 mechanics.

The skill trees actually gave way more build diversity than Diablo 3 could even fathom at this moment.

Have you never heard of the Token of Absolution which allows a full respec in Diablo 2?

It literally took about 3-4 hours to get rushed to level 80 and doing end game content.


Okay please, play diablo 2 pre synergy bonus patch.

Max out firebolt.

Tell me how the endgame is.

As a matter of fact, max out anything on the elemental tree for druid.

You cant even kill cows.

now make a trap assassin>

once again you cant kill a cow.

Now make a palladin.

Your completely useless no matter what you went, dont worry. Though I did have a badass zeal pally with B-Star. But I got a complete letdown everytime I saw a barb just WW goblin up every cow while I had to unload 2 full zeals to kill 1.

Okay now make a necro and piss everyone off with 20 skellyton lag, which also sucked.

Years later they added the synergy bonus, but even then it was filled with nonviable skills.


hammerdin is the best class in the game
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The best part of D2 was probably the skill tree and the variety of different builds that interacted with different items.

I had one cookie cutter build (Sorc), but I had I think 38 other builds across all classes using mediocre gear capable of easily beating hell. Can this be done in D3, not a chance.

D2 is was mainly skills reliant in such a way that a naked class could take out a fully geared class if played correctly. Again, imagine in D3's brawling if a naked WD attempted to take out a geared barb.. not going to happen.
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Nah, D2's drop rates were still ridiculous. Ever found a Zod rune? Griffon's? Death's Web?

Items drop in D3, but people are too focused on the perfect near-impossible rolls, which isn't realistic.

The monster power levels are a gift and a curse. They are great for customizing gameplay exactly how you want it (as opposed to pre-mp forced brick wall style), but there is the psychological effect that if mp10 exists, players feel entitled to be allowed to play it. If perfect quadfecta amulets are in the game, they must be found.

Playing up to and through Inferno as self-found is not hard at all. I'd even say beating D2 Hell is more difficult. Getting BiS gear, sure, then the drop rates are ridiculous.
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Now make a palladin.

Your completely useless no matter what you went, dont worry.


...what? O.o
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Diablo 2 had great atmosphere, great soundtrack + voice acting (only good voice actor who actually put effort into what he did in diablo 3 was the voice actor for the Scoundrel, rest sounded like "ok i will underact and overact and get my money bye bye"), lots of fantastic memorable acts and zones (from catacombs in act 1, to the deserts and caves in act 2, to the jungle and swamps in act 3), not to mention much better interaction with characters in town, a really nice and story (I mean diablo 3 plot is EXACTLY like that of a B movie: have a boss who goes "you can never defeat this", you defeat it "you will NEVER defeath THIS", you defeat it, "you will NEVER defeat MEEE", you defeat him, not to mention Cain getting killed by butterflies).

But it all boils down to the gameplay: you could play up to 8 players there, do baal runs, cow level runs, rune runs, socket runs, whatever the hell you felt like! Itemization was great, you had runewards, unique items which you kept from lvl 49 to lvl 99 in some cases, set items which were actually GOOD. Not to mention the community felt like an actual gaming community (unlike here which good luck trying to have a good party in public games).

Yeah sure it had bots and duped items, but you know what? So does this pathetic excuse of a game have them, but the "point" of always being online was to "eliminate" any sort of boting and duping. And we all know how well that worked out.
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Well in reality this is 2013 and diablo 3 smokes out diablo 2.

Dont believe me? Go play D2, servers are still up.

Okay your not going to. Thats what I thought.


You did not adress me, but I want to answer anyway:
What do you think I've been playing the past year instead of Diablo 3?
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09/07/2013 05:00 PMPosted by Crocodilius
Training the wrong skills, like in any roleplaying game, will make you weak.


This makes no sense. How can
there ever be "wrong skills"?
If i wanted to use ravens, ought not
they be decent and usable, else
why are they there at all...


They blind enemies.

Like the skill sais it does.
Equip only defensive skills on your wizard in Diablo 3.

How do you fare?
Unequip your weapon.
How well do your wizard farm inferno without his or her hammer / axe / sword?

Raven is not meant to deal damage.
It is meant to blind.

Investing 20 skills into raven is like investing all your D3 gold in armor, and not getting a weapon.
Except you could still melee quite well, even with all your points invested towards a skill level 20 raven -- and all your enemies would be blind while you club them to death.

It would not be effective, but it would be doable.

I think skills like Raven should be capped at 5 points, as I said in another post, and that skills should have "runes" add power in addition to / on top of their skill level, especially past level 30.

Level 30 upgrade rune: Ravens may cause bleeding wounds
Level 50 upgrade rune: Ravens permanently blind
Level 70 upgrade rune: Hex: Blinded enemies take 50% more damage

And once again, the fact that the static "20 points limit" was in Diablo II does not mean the developers cannot improve and repair the system.

You IMPROVE an existing framework -- you do not throw away the frame for your car just because you're changing the engine.
Edited by Frostraven#1952 on 9/7/2013 5:55 PM PDT
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well.. first thing is first. get in your delorean gun it to 88 and go back ten years in the past when the game was still relevant and experience it for yourself.
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Raven is not meant to deal damage.
It is meant to blind.


You still didn't explain how it's a "wrong skill",
but rather, how an inexperienced player
would skill dump into it.
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While I agree that blizzard dropped the ball on the loot system, they are addressing the much needed changes in the xpac.

Theres a lot of things D3 got right, particularly the combat system and the graphics. I would have preferred in depth skill trees as well. And they could have done it while avoiding useless endgame skills like diablo 2 had all over the place.


How do you figure pvper? Gear is the same thing still.. "Smart drops" isn't going to help really. I've explained this before..If you want the items like Diablo 2 and be fun to farm up then you for example would make a mempo do this..

+100-200 Main Stat
+Life $
+All Res
+6-9 APS
Has Socket

instead of this..

+100-200 Main Stat
+ Random
+ Random
+ 8-9 APS
+RANDOM

RANDOM RANDOM RANDOM.. PURE LAZINESS! Though I do enjoy playing the game.. But yea.. It's in the end just pure laziness to have all that randomization in the game.

Only rares + blues + whites should have random stats. Your legendaries.. Not so much..

AND LOWER THAT DAM DROP RATE OF LEGS AT THE SAME TIME! THEN YOU GOT A GAME WORTH FARMING LEGENDARIES IN!!
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09/07/2013 03:47 PMPosted by Diablo2PVPER
Rune combos honestly ruined my d2 experience. I tried to get them they would never drop for me. I looked up where to find them and grinded for hours with magic find, not 1 HR drop. Like I said ended up switching to classic because dual rooms became complete bull. I wasnt going to shell out 20+ dollars just to get the HR drops which were apparently easy to find if you were already God mode.


Magic find had nothing to do with finding runes. You apparently know nothing about the PvE aspect of Diablo 2, so please do not discuss it.

http://diablo2.diablowiki.net/Rune_hunting

Stay with what you seem to have some knowledge of, PvP.

P.S. I found runes for my very own enigma, twice.
Edited by Adrenaline#1529 on 9/7/2013 6:14 PM PDT
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