thanks :)

Time to Farm then l0l

Time to Farm then l0l

17 APoC / 2.5+ aps is working fine for me.

What is ur Crit Chance 0.0 ?

I would like to extend my thanks to Shandler, Apo and Guybrush. This must have been no easy task.

Standard WW/CM feels pretty smooth with 3.0x ASP, 47% CC and 19 APoC.

Too bad my mitigation and damage are nowhere near what id like them to be. Gotta get rid of placeholder trinkets and gloves first. CD would skyrocket my damage for i have none *sad*.

I've been there @3 APS and the difference between 2.76 APS and 3 APS is definitely noticeable. I'm trying to optimize my build @2.76 APS to see if I can make it better than 3 APS, then choose whether I go for 3 or 2.76 APS.

Thinking about switching the Tal Rasha armor and yellow ring for a Zuni's Marrow and Pox for the set bonus. Then switch my pants and amu for Blackthorne's to get the extra life and loh. With 6 pieces of 9 IAS, I will have exactly 2.75 APS.

10/07/2012 02:37 PMPosted by ShandlarStill trying to figure out the rhyme or reason to these particular numbers but the testing makes it pretty clear these are within a hundreth of an attack per second.

I'm not sure if you ever nailed down the formula for this, but here you go:

`frames_per_attack = floor(30 / attacks_per_second)`

tick_rate = ceil(360 / frames_per_attack)

Here's a table of APS vs Tick Rate breakpoints calculated from the above formula:

` Minimum Tick`

APS rate

-----------------

7.5001 120

6.0001 90

5.0001 72

4.2858 60

3.7501 52

3.3334 45

3.0001 40

2.7273 36

2.5001 33

2.3077 30

2.1429 28

2.0001 26

1.8751 24

1.7648 23

1.6667 22

1.5790 20

1.5001 19

1.3637 18

1.3044 17

1.2501 16

1.1539 15

1.0715 14

1.0001 13

0.9091 12

0.8334 11

0.7501 10

0.6667 9

0.5770 8

0.5001 7

0.4167 6

0.3334 5

0.2501 4

0.1667 3

0.0834 2

0.0001 1

Edit: Changed second "floor" to "ceil", and added 2 additional decimal places of precision to APS numbers.

Wait where did that formula come from?

And finally is it 2.72 or 2.73?

And finally is it 2.72 or 2.73?

Wait where did that formula come from?

And finally is it 2.72 or 2.73?

I derived it from the numbers that Shandlar originally posted.

In my table (which I worked out to 4 decimal places to match Shandlar's table), the breakpoint at 2.7273 APS. Truncating it to 2 decimal places, the breakpoint becomes 2.73, because:

`2.72 < 2.7273 < 2.73`

I've been there @3 APS and the difference between 2.76 APS and 3 APS is definitely noticeable. I'm trying to optimize my build @2.76 APS to see if I can make it better than 3 APS, then choose whether I go for 3 or 2.76 APS.

Thinking about switching the Tal Rasha armor and yellow ring for a Zuni's Marrow and Pox for the set bonus. Then switch my pants and amu for Blackthorne's to get the extra life and loh. With 6 pieces of 9 IAS, I will have exactly 2.75 APS.

Only way to optimze lower ias is high CC.

I am also trying to decide if I should shoot for 55%CC@ 2.76ias or 3 ias @50% CC. ofc both is what we want but either one of those option will already cost hundreds of millions in upgrades. Which we still had ptr so i could borrow stuff and try. :(

55% CC is a lot easier too and won't kill mitigation for most. OTOH 3.0 is EZ for me w/ a 1.77 wand tho so can keep good bracer, good pants and don't have to buy innas or lacuni just helm and little higher gloves.

Shand? What's the math say is best for reseting cooldowns?

55CC @ 2.76 ias

or

50CC @ 3.0 ias

What's the math say is best for reseting cooldowns?

55CC @ 2.76 ias

or

50CC @ 3.0 ias

As far as I can understand the relative effectiveness boils down to:

APS * number of ticks per twister * CC

in this case:

2,76 * 36 * 0,55 = 54,648

3 * 40 * 0,5 = 60

You'd need ~60% CC to reach the same effectiveness with the lower breakpoint.

Please correct me if im wrong.

55CC @ 2.76 ias: 0.55*36*0.125 = 2.475

50CC @ 3.0 ias: 0.50*40*0.125 = 2.500

However, an additional 1%cc on 2.76 ias would be 2.52, instead of 2.475. So if you can squeeze MORE than 5% cc than you're better off than going for 3.0 ias. :)

EDIT: On post 89 of the thread, Shandlar shows the estimate for deriving the benefit is:

"33 ticks = 5.5/s

5.5 hits/s * 0.125 * 1790 = 1231 life per second per twister per target... (ALOT!)

5.5 hits/s * 0.125 * 0.47 * 30 = 9.69 AP per second per twister per target"

So yeah you estimate the tick rate, divide that number by 6s for your effective attacks per second. Then you multiple that number by the proc coefficient and then by your CC.

So I was correct for the "relative" benefit, but you need to divide my numbers by 6 to get the effective benefit per second. Though I have no idea what the CM proc coefficient is, but that's just a scaling factor.

55CC @ 2.76 ias: 0.55*36*0.125 = 2.475

50CC @ 3.0 ias: 0.50*40*0.125 = 2.500

However, an additional 1%cc on 2.76 ias would be 2.52, instead of 2.475. So if you can squeeze MORE than 5% cc than you're better off than going for 3.0 ias. :)

Yeah but...

I can get 2 if i upgrade stormcrow to a 6% (100m)

3 if i upgrade my trifecta to a 6% (lolz that will be cheap 1b?)

2 if I find a 900 loh 9 ias 10 CC ammy (300m?)

1.5 if i upgrade my other ring to a 6 CC (50m top)

= 6.5 CC for cool price of 1.5B

10/19/2012 01:54 PMPosted by TekkZero@Shibii: I thought that attacks per second were only relevant for estimating the tick rate.

Attack speed comes into play twice because on top of getting more ticks from every twister you'll have more twisters out before the older ones start dying out.

I've attempted to build an excel sheet for this, its not as easy as most are.

If you just use 'perm freeze' as a baseline and then increase nova cast at the rate of tick improvment it would look like this....

55cc and 2.76 aps

2.76 - 0.95 = 1.81 aps * 6 = 10.86 twisters * 6 * 0.125 * 0.55 = 4.48 CM procs

50cc and 3.00 aps

3.00 - 1.05 = 1.95 aps * 6 = 11.70 twisters * 6.67 * 0.125 * 0.50 = 4.88 CM procs

IAS is king. Pretty much certain of this. I just cannot justify an IAS chants, so I'm dealing with the reality that 2.74 is what i'm gonna max at, and move on. Stack crit to the hilt cause theres no other way to improve CM.

You guys make me weak in the knees with all this talk! I love it.