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01/09/2013 09:07 PMPosted by Violentine
no you havent


I'm out.

Enjoy your trolling.
i dont mind discussion i just dont wanna see flaming which is where it seems ur discussion is heading b/c
1. each side has argued their points
2. there has been no agreement b/w either side
3. continued discussion based on this being an internet forum will most likely lead to flaming
^^ See above.
I play games at night, long hours at work. maybe tomorrow or something.

why so mad though? it's just a discussion
Umadbro?
@Violentine

Relax. No need to insult people, that does not go over well in this forum.
^ It doesn't go over well at all, but yeah I like my Duncraig. I think it's severely underrated.
No you havent, there is no "we" here. its all you.

My point was:
1. tal rasha should be on the list because its better than that !@#$ cross
2. IK is better than T&T over all.
you have not contributed anything useful in this thread, and you have not proven anything other than sucking *@%#*%#@


1. I believe the biggest difference between Tal Rasha and Duncraig's is the LoH from the Duncraig. This can be hard to quantify and is not as simple as saying, "Well I get more dps from mine, ergo it is better."

Your Tal Rasha's is definitely nice. The 6% elemental damage is roughly equivalent to a 30-56 dmg roll.

2. I'm not sure I understand what the argument for IK is. According to D3up, your IK gloves are providing 36,011.42 (8.2%) of your dps and 32,812.27 (3.2%) of your EH.

Looking at T&T in the AH, the cheapest trifecta pair would actually cost you ~970 dps, but you'd gain 31,227 EH. Yes, T&T is double the EH of your IK gloves. Swapping to that pair of T&T would cost you less than 1% of your overall DPS but would gain you 6% EH.

That pair of T&T would provide 35,040.89 (8%) dps and 64,039.72 (5.7%) EH.
RE: The discussion/argument/whatever that has been going on since I posted last...

1. Violentine is right, Tal's necklace should be considered since it's chest option is one of the best and the 2pc bonus is useful (not very, but still IS) to monks. I'll check the max rolls and update the list accordingly.

2. Violentine is wrong about IK's gloves comparing to T&T. Remember, the Endgame section is more than just which item does better in the 4 (pdps, edps, mitigation, and ehp) categories I weigh item's potential. Each category is separate of the others too, and I use different rolls for each category to see which max rolls are better than others. The Endgame section is basically which items I think cover enough bases, and the simple truth is that IK's gloves NEED IK's 2pc to be useful because they only have 2 random rolls and NO all res. Its that simple. Whereas T&T inherently come with str, int, vit and armor all of which provide additional mitigation/ehp compared to the low/high random roll of str and mdr IK's rolls with.
--

edit: as far as all the other comments, thank you all for posting and hopefully like Demi and Nameless said, this can be a useful tool AND conversation starter :)
So.

Lets talk echoing furies. I

I have a:
1360+ (can't remember exact figure right now, at a different computer)
(656-1196dmg)
38% dmg
+.25 APS
157 Dexterity
14.4% Chance to fear on hit.
OS

Should I migrate from my skorn to this? and a LS offhand? What stats should I look for on EFs? It's listed in your opinion as BiS and i'm curious as I never touch these.

Hrmmm Musing.
I had a question about end-game actually. If we were to put max possible rolls on all the gear listed is that what the end game analysis is about? i'll come back with details of what I talk about.
Pros
+.2x APS, equivalent to 3x9ias items.
Fear - fear yourself out of hallways of arcanes, desecrator, single out reflect minions,
Faster leech
Turns a slow 1.2 weapon into a 1.4 weapon = much high damage range for SW
+.2 aps for cyclone tycoon

Cons:
Fear
people hate playing with you

@cayzer
Only stat to look for in a EF at the game's current state is LS. Reflect hurts and thats about it.
It's going to be hard pressed to find a OS/CD EF that is affordable, even then it won't give you a great dps booost as most EF /w OS/CD are in the 1100's range.

I'll take a DW over skorn anyday, even without a EF.

...and the simple truth is that IK's gloves NEED IK's 2pc to be useful because they only have 2 random rolls and NO all res.


This, I was going to mention this earlier.
Lol the cons is my issue.

I hate playing in a group with an EF lol. Hence why this is sitting in my stash. But i really would like to switch to DW lol.

I wonder what I could sell the thing for. Maybe downgrade some dps to LS.
Thats a nice EF. You'd need at least 3 LS on an offhand for sustain to make it work, maybe a little LOH too. Not sure whether having to find that on the same weapon or on jewelry is really worth it to you. If you don't mind then, the switch probably would be noticeable in the very least, in attack speed.
That was my thought - now I am regretting selling my 3% LS WKL.

It's going to take a lot of money to pick up an amulet equivalent to mine with LoH. But same goes with the OH.

Thanks for the insight by the way guys.
Using the following resource
http://www.d3rmt.com/guides/diablo-3-item-stat-maximum-values/#damage-modifiers

I wonder what you've done to actually calculate your BiS lists since I think certain items aren't lined up perfectly.

What I typically do to identify the BiS(I just started to notice with your thread) is take the best possible unique rolls of each slot and try to find that. With amulets the unique rolls would be Mains, MF%, Life%, CHC, Min/MaxDMG, and Blind on hit. All the other stats can roll elsewhere or aren't a big enough difference imo.
You don't think CD or IaS are worth it on amulets?
01/10/2013 07:16 PMPosted by Cayzer
You don't think CD or IaS are worth it on amulets?


That's not what I said, but CHD can roll on weapons and so does IAS. IAS at a higher value too. What I'm saying is it's not that unique to ammy's. You could easily get a rare without BoH and MF% and do a better ammy I think.

It would look like

Min/Max dmg
Dex
Vit
Life%/LoH
CHC
Your choice of CHD or IAS

...and you'd find a better amulet I think.

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