Nerfing Crit possibly fixes everything wrong with D3.

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If crit gets nerfed, i am quiting this game
I 100% agree with this post.

People are already raging at the sight of this post and reporting it. Its hilarious.

Itemization is ruined because of critical hitting.
+1

Crit is so overpower. I am sick of trying to find an item that has the most crit.

Thats not Diablo...
I 100% agree with this post.

People are already raging at the sight of this post and reporting it. Its hilarious.

Itemization is ruined because of critical hitting.


It's just a lack of foresight mostly. If half of the people raging over the thread actually stopped and looked at how things could be changed in accordance with crit changes to make them still powerful and retain the positives of their builds which happen to be reliant on crit chance...well we wouldn't have nearly as many people crying about the potential change. If you ask me though, a lot of it comes down to people playing this game exclusively for the last 8 months or so and not being able to stomach the possibility of their relative godliness decreasing as the game is better balanced. And we wonder why it takes so long for the devs to ever implement good balance changes. I think we just whine too much =|
crit dmg = normal dmg * (cd+1)

so what is max cd? 600? 700? 750? 800? Diablo progress shows it is 799% is max
http://www.diabloprogress.com/rating.stat_crit_dmg

so with some buff, i guess it becomes 1000%
It means they can do 10x more dmg when they crit...

this is a bad design... making 10x dmg when it crits... dunno, but crits should be max 2x or 3x not more than that... looks not logical... when cd is max 2.5x, cc cannot be so high in demand... a mempho without cc is 1M, with 6% cc is 1-2b is just plain stupid...

when the core is designed terribad, i guess no point to try to fix it... because, whenever you try to fix one issue, you break many things... bad design is bad...


the max on dual wielding gear is usually 700%.

using a travellers pledge + compass rose gives you set bonus for 50% more. but this gimps your IAS/CC and other jewelry possible stats. (ie: your dps will be lower usually)

barb has a passive for 50%. so max possible crit in game if you decide to gimp yourself on compassrose is 800%

It's just a lack of foresight mostly. If half of the people raging over the thread actually stopped and looked at how things could be changed in accordance with crit changes to make them still powerful and retain the positives of their builds which happen to be reliant on crit chance...well we wouldn't have nearly as many people crying about the potential change. If you ask me though, a lot of it comes down to people playing this game exclusively for the last 8 months or so and not being able to stomach the possibility of their relative godliness decreasing as the game is better balanced. And we wonder why it takes so long for the devs to ever implement good balance changes. I think we just whine too much =|


They're not going to completely redo itemization AND a bunch of builds just to nerf crit. Thinking that's possible is really, really stupid.

That leaves us with them just nerfing crit, and ruining probably half of the viable builds in the game right now.

So yeah, anyone with half a brain doesn't want that.
A cap on crit and crit dmg and then another damage stat added to gear would probably make things better.

If you had to balance IAS, crit, crit dmg and one more offensive stat it would certainly make gear more interesting and require more thought.

If not a hard cap then a soft cap, something like after 30% you only get half effect out of it so you would trend towards other types of +dmg but not be totally wasting stats if your gear did take you over.

Crits make PvP a joke of course, but they knew that from WoW already so I doubt they care.


it doesn't change a thing.

eg: assuming crushing blow exists. and you make it such that gear that have crushing blow cannot roll c.dmg and vice versa.

then people will minmax and still stack optimal amounts of "ias/cc/crushingblow" and optimal amounts of "ias/cc/cdmg". so gear with trifecta stats = STILL expensive and doesn't change a thing.

you are just substituting cblow for cdmg.

--
eg: you soft cap and put diminishing returns, then you end up people will still min max and doesn't change a thing, gear with high rolls of ias/cc/cdmg become even more expensive, simply because a soft cap means you can save affix slots altogether by having a high roll on 1 item.

eg: if the soft cap on crit dmg is 300%. then people only need.
amulet 100%
weapon 100% (os) + eg: 60% crit dmg
gloves: 40% cdmg trifecta.
now you have 2 free slots in your ring to throw in
(eg: hell fire ring 3 random rolls of ias/cc/ (avgdmg/loh) )

(remember, for some classes, higher ehp means you can choose more offensive passives/skills)

things are expensive because of the number of affixes you can stack on an item and you as a character have a total number of affixes you can put on gear. (13 gear x 6 affixs approx)
if you want them all to be good affixes, then it will cost you.
01/22/2013 07:17 PMPosted by Iniquity
How does this stupid thread get so much attention.


because all the bad players feel that lowering the gear ceiling makes them pro
They're not going to completely redo itemization AND a bunch of builds just to nerf crit. Thinking that's possible is really, really stupid.

That leaves us with them just nerfing crit, and ruining probably half of the viable builds in the game right now.

So yeah, anyone with half a brain doesn't want that.


You're assuming too much of the requirements here. Most of the changes are very simple. Crit Chance isn't really a great offender on its own; that burden rests on the shoulders of Crit Damage. Since Crit Chance is what the builds are founded on, lowering the maximum Crit Damage isn't a big problem. You simply lower the hp in corresponding MP levels until it's manageable in much the same way as it is now for people with outstanding gear. The only other change needed would be to have a lesser reduction of LS efficiency in Inferno. Then, almost as if by magic, you get more options for your build. The hardcore DPS fiends would whine about it for a while, and then when they realized the game plays the same way but with more choices, they'd get over it.

Edit: Regarding Crit Chance though, I don't think we need to nerf that to be honest. I do think it would be good for the gearing of all, however, if the rolls on items were altered to have slightly higher max values so that you could get more crit faster, and so that once you reached it ("it" being some kind of high cap, no lower than 50% or so, if they chose to implement one) you could try to improve other gear in different ways. I think this will become much more desirable after the expansion comes around and we get new proc affixes though. This game still has 3 or 4 years before it reaches a point where iteration stops and we just see bug fixes.

Also, it's a discussion man. There's no need to be inflammatory with people that don't share the same opinion. May the best ideas prevail! =)
Most of the changes are very simple.

Do I need to link you to Vaeflare's post about people saying stuff is simple?
01/22/2013 07:58 PMPosted by speedforce
Most of the changes are very simple.

Do I need to link you to Vaeflare's post about people saying stuff is simple?


I've seen it, and depending on what we're talking about, I agree. Things are never as simple as they seem. Fortunately though, we have proof of their ability to alter values on existing equipment from as far back as the IAS nerf, as well as changes to monster hp inside of the MP system. All the changes that I have mentioned, at the very least, are only numbers changes that we already have evidence for the ability of which to be changed. =P

Edit: On a side note speedforce, do you remember about how much you spent on the Andy's for your DH? Or at least have a ballpark figure for it if it was self-found? I just had one drop with damn near identical stats but thanks to the wonders of the AH search parameters, am not really sure what to value it at. Thanks if you can respond! =)
then people will minmax and still stack optimal amounts of "ias/cc/crushingblow" and optimal amounts of "ias/cc/cdmg". so gear with trifecta stats = STILL expensive and doesn't change a thing.
hmm, how about this. So say we get the new affixes. We'll now have ias/cc/cb, ias/cc/arp, ias/cc/ow, ias/cc/cd. Four possible trifectas. Will they ALL be expensive just the same or will they be cheaper?
Edit: On a side note speedforce, do you remember about how much you spent on the Andy's for your DH?
I spent about 8 million each on mine. I also bought another Andy's that has low fire dmg taken, but instead of socket, has 67AR. That was before Andy's blew up thanks to the post about keeping 2 Andy's instead of buying a an expensive Crit Mempo lol
01/22/2013 08:09 PMPosted by speedforce
then people will minmax and still stack optimal amounts of "ias/cc/crushingblow" and optimal amounts of "ias/cc/cdmg". so gear with trifecta stats = STILL expensive and doesn't change a thing.
hmm, how about this. So say we get the new affixes. We'll now have ias/cc/cb, ias/cc/arp, ias/cc/ow, ias/cc/cd. Four possible trifectas. Will they ALL be expensive just the same or will they be cheaper?


I imagine that all still relies on what Blizz does or doesn't do with drops. If they tighten up some rolls a bit and make sure that Inferno gear belongs in Inferno instead of Act I Nightmare, I'd say the price for most things will drop some. If they never do a damned thing about it then gear like that will still be found at a pretty crazy premium. I think what I really want to see happen though is more along the lines of new procs and affixes that are useful to an extent where you can consider having another value be lower. There's still so much the devs must have in development right now, especially seeing as it is already known that there will be two expansions at least. =|

I spent about 8 million each on mine. I also bought another Andy's that has low fire dmg taken, but instead of socket, has 67AR. That was before Andy's blew up thanks to the post about keeping 2 Andy's instead of buying a an expensive Crit Mempo lol


LOL, that's great. Yeah, I'm still waiting on a Mempo's drop, but to no avail. The second Andy's idea doesn't sound bad though, especially not at that price. It's been a rough road though as of late since I'm trying really hard to play self-found for the most part and self-found drops tend to be a little sub-par...
01/22/2013 08:09 PMPosted by speedforce
then people will minmax and still stack optimal amounts of "ias/cc/crushingblow" and optimal amounts of "ias/cc/cdmg". so gear with trifecta stats = STILL expensive and doesn't change a thing.
hmm, how about this. So say we get the new affixes. We'll now have ias/cc/cb, ias/cc/arp, ias/cc/ow, ias/cc/cd. Four possible trifectas. Will they ALL be expensive just the same or will they be cheaper?
Edit: On a side note speedforce, do you remember about how much you spent on the Andy's for your DH?
I spent about 8 million each on mine. I also bought another Andy's that has low fire dmg taken, but instead of socket, has 67AR. That was before Andy's blew up thanks to the post about keeping 2 Andy's instead of buying a an expensive Crit Mempo lol


in your situation with 4 possible trifectas, they will min max and the one with the MOST optimal advantage will be the most expensive. and then we will have yet another stupid thread like this one that says

"trifecta 4 is overpowered, we must nerf it, any gear without trifecta 4 stats are rubbish"

having 4 trifectas of different mods is just the equivalent of eg
9% ias/10%cc/70%cdmg vs
9% ias/10%cc/80%cdmg vs
9% ias/10%cc/90%cdmg vs
9% ias/10%cc/99%cdmg

we already have that and the price of those items reflect accordingly.

if the affixes are competitively equivalent, then its at best a name change and doesn't change anything fundamentally.
if the affixes are complementary, then it becomes yet an additional affix to add, so that quadrafectas become mandatory for high damage.

about the only time you sacrifice one of this dps stats for another is:
there must be too many dps stats that can roll on an item, and they are all functionally competitive and all complementary with each other.

we have trifectas simply because ias/cc/cdmg/(high pri) synergise.

since gear has 6 affixes at most. the way to "fix this" is to have eg: another 3-4 more damage affixes.

eg: lets say trifecta gear can now also roll the following
% elite bonus as a non legendary affix on rings up to 15%
% reflect damage (as opposed to thorns) values up to 80%
% massive bleed as a % of your dps. (eg: 10-50% of your dps is applied as bleed)
% crushing blow
% chain lightning attack (eg: %30% of your damage dealt to any mob chains to other mobs within a 20 yd radius. aoe attack chains multiplicatively)
% disruption chance (eg: monsters hit by your attack suffer 50% more damage on your next attack)

now your trifecta gear and all cannot possibly roll all the best affixes. you will min max
but you cannot possibly max out all affixes above on the gear slots that can roll it.
so there lies the value, different sexfectas will complement people with sexfectas that fill the voids of stats they need to reach the optimal min max value. (ie: the more complexity, the better, the situation is almost similar by limiting trifecta gear to only rolling 2 out of 3 trifecta stats, but that is just too simple and invalidates everyone's gear.)

but then you end up with the situation that gear must be sexfectas before they are considered top tier. you just have different types of sexfectas that can be min maxed.

this is inevitable for all games. it comes down to the phenomenon known as "top tier gear is always expensive"
+1 for a sincere post, but i'll rate it as a 4/10 troll...

uh oh better put your big girl panties on...
Agreed Crit is not worth the 1000x increase in gold it being just one stat however if Blizzard nerfs Crit there is no basis for Monks. They then become the worst class in the game since half of their builds rely on the chance to land a critical hit and the damage they can deal with that. The Monk being a DPS character needs the Crit stats. It's the only thing allowing Monks to be such efficient DPS characters and survive in Inferno or PvP. It's the only thing allowing Monks to be on the same level as the Barbarian. Without Crit then there would need to be a complete change made in the design of the Monks themselves, their gear, their builds, and what would make them useful again. What you're saying by nerfing Crit is to nerf Monks as well and many other builds from other characters.
people still play this game? ><
people still play this game? ><
obviously yes.
D3 revolves around 3 stats, Crit Damage, Crit Chance, and All Resistance.

Remove any one of those from the equation and it pretty much renders all builds useless. Lack of foresight on Blizzard's part? I think so.

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