Please Decrease Drops and Improve Rolls instead.

General Discussion
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We all feel "Rares" are not rare anymore. So please make them rare again.

Just without this stupidly huge range of RNG scale for each ilvl.

Lower drop rates and lower RNG roll ranges and the item hunt is fixed. (Itemization on the other hand is another issue all together)

Edit- This from another post I made which go hand in hand at making the item hunt more exciting and giving more hope, as well as giving more applications for gem use/builds.

And some great ideas for gems in this thread-
I'm at the point where I ignore most of the rares.
Longevity reduced?

How so, if the chance of actually getting something equivalent to 'godly gear' now is the same?

Just without the clutter of having to ID a million rares in the off chance one is worth 100 mil.

Still don't agree?
02/05/2013 03:40 AMPosted by Ricstar
I'm at the point where I ignore most of the rares.

99.999% rare items are useless
I don't bother with a lot of common rares (oxymoron!) anymore in softcore. I wouldn't mind a drop rate decrease and corresponding quality increase, but actually I don't think it will help as much as one might think it would.

People will still find far more loot than they can actually use, so the bar is continually set higher for what constitutes a "good" item. By improving quality of loot, there will come a corresponding increase in the bar anyway.

What will help more is an item sink. Account-bound crafting is a good step in that direction. :) The more gear taken out of the AH, the better. :)
I couldn't agree more. The rares don't feel rare at all, and knowing in advance the bulk will be worthless just kills the anticipation you should feel before identifying them. I think they should drop about 10-20 times more often than a legendary.
I'm sure I'm not unique in this.

but lets just use the example of Mon 1h Fist weapons.

Over the course of time I find many of the Heaven Hands (lvl 63) roll far worse dps rolls than the lvl 62 or 61 fists.

This seems the same for many/most rares. The rares are turning into the new "white" weapons where feelings are very similar amongst the community here of not even worth picking up.

I can't tell you how many darkblade (lvl 63 dagger) weapons I've picked up rolling < 200 dps and the same for so many other 63 weapons.

anyone pick up 2h rares anymore? Virtually nobody does because of the amount of skorn's out there and virtually nothing can compete with them.

Well Occasionally I pick up some 2h weapons and it is typical they roll in the 500dps to 800dps range. it is "super rare" to get a rare 2h weapon that is lvl 62/63 to even roll over 1k much less 1100 dps.

This is a bigger problem I think with regards to item affixes and the absolutely poor affixes being rolled specifically on weapons. There is virtually no way to get weapons to even compete with legendaries out there unless it is deemed as an OH weapon or you are forced to use a rare due to the fact you can't run 2 of the same EF weapons.. lol.

Some of the axes and demolishers seem to roll OK with some level of consistancy as 1h weapons but the 2h weapons are totally worthless 99.99999999% of the time. Can't tell you how many hellion 2h xbows I've picked up over the last 2months rolling DPS in the 300-600 range. Really... best 2h xbow as a 2h rolling that low of dps most of the time?

Affixes definitely need an recalibration overhall especially when it comes to weapons otherwise we all will run skorns or EF or Calamities, or Chanto or Manticore or whatever WD use... LoL... sorry WD... don't play the class really but most seem to use a zuni knife of some sort.
Bubba, lol, I think WD (I barely play mine nowadays) like Majuma's (sp?) Carving Knife, among others. I also agree with the 2H weapons. I mean, come on. Most of them roll the same DPS as 1H. Why would anyone use that trash? I mostly pick up the odd one now and again just for kicks. Usually 2H axes, because I've just always loved them in every game I play.

I've also thought about the most common counter-argument to the totally wacked-out range of damage on rares, "Well, if they raised it, you'd just want higher, because what makes for good DPS is all subjective." Only it's not. What makes for great DPS are top-end legendaries like Skorn, Echoing Fury, Calamity, Manticore, and the like. For instance, say a boss Skorn is sitting at about 1450 damage. Then I expect the average 2H rare to roll between 900 and 1200. A good 2H should roll between 1250-1400. An EXCEPTIONAL 2h rare should roll between 1450-1550. That's right, the point is that rares should, in rare cases, SURPASS legendaries, thus giving us a reason to pick up and ID the oceans of yellow loot.

To me, this just makes good, common sense.
Totally agree.

I'd go so far as to say decrease rare drops 50-75% and get rid of the bottom 25-40% of rolls (not very scientific, I know, but you get the idea).

Right now it is more of a chore than anything, even when just picking up lvl 62/63 boots, shoulders, gloves, bracers.

Hell I am more likely to I'll pick up a blue worth 1,500+ over a rare that I know will be garbage and will take time to identify. At least I can sell the blue trash nearly instantly.

If I continue playing very shortly I'll be skipping rares altogether.

In other news: IDENTIFY ALL would be a step in the right direction, at least then you could bother picking up some trash for mats.
02/05/2013 03:40 AMPosted by Ricstar
I'm at the point where I ignore most of the rares.

I'm pretty much there. Not only is the chance to find a decent rare (as in, one that can sell for a million or more on the GAH) tiny but trying to actually sell it.

In the past 4-5 days I've sold a total of 4 items, all ridiculously good deals vs. other comparable items. 3 of the items were legendary/set, the other a rare.

Apparently, most players fit into 1 of 2 camps: Very geared and the only want upgrades on their Mempo/Zunis, etc. or very undergeared and very poor in which case they're in luck as it's a buyer's market. They can drop a few million on the GAH and be geared enough to leech act 3 inferno in public games.

So as someone (me) who is clearly undergeared but slowly working my way up, how can I make money? Unless, of course, I win the lottery and get a great roll Mempo/Witches/Chants,etc. to drop. Everything else is pretty much vendor trash.

OK lets look at it like you are:
At what point do you hit dps/cd saturation, is it when you get the best dps roll and crit dmg with mainstat and vit/LS? Then what? Then you are done looking for a weapon?
There needs to be more stats that compete with these (cd,ls, mainstat, vit, ar, cc), interesting stats that help create new viable builds.

I agree, but the two are not mutually exclusive. I've been saying forever that the majority of the rares/legs you find should not be insta-trash. This argument is not constructed to reflect the top 1% of players to whom almost all gear is garbage. I'm talking about your average player in decent gear.

The thing about my argument is I'm not even expecting an upgrade. I just don't need to see crap like a 70 dps bleed at level 60. That's absurd and a total waste of my time. I'd love to see more creative loot as you're suggesting. The problem is, they'd need to do a WoW style overhaul of the way gear works, because right now, it's so focused on the damage of the weapon that even if you get totally sweet incidentals like chance to freeze or whatnot, unless you also rolled, at a minimum, high damage, a socket and/or crit hit damage, and possibly life steal, the weapon is garbage.

As to the "gear saturation," many people jump to that conclusion, but I don't see it. The top players would still chase the near-perfect rolls that are exceedingly rare, and they'd still command top dollar on the AH. The only appreciable change would be that beginning/mid-tier players might actually find an upgrade, or at least not feel totally ripped off when they find that sweet legendary/rare, except it rolled 600 dps.
affix rolls should roll a bit higher per level.

It is insane to get low end rolls on 63 that almost always are lower rolls than what a 61 has. This makes no sense at all (this is weapon based not other gear).

This is most noticeable with "black weapons". The only affix you might see which would be weapon damage related might be +8% attack speed or something like that. As I said above can't even count the number of weapons I've found ilvl 62/63 which have < 200 dps on them much less anything competitive.

Sure I've found a few 1h weapons that have been sellable for dirt cheap. Not saying they can't roll but the min is really bad on 62/63 rares. and I know we have all see that like Black Demolisher with 600 Loh and 62% CD and an OS running 250 DPS ... simply crazy to not have a min damage range on 62/63 weapons that at least gives them a minimum of 500 ... and then if you roll elemental or %dmg or min/max damage it will boost that weapon dps up.

this goes back to topic at hand... .I'm of the opinion and I think most of the community in agreement with OP to reduce number of drops and make the rolls more viable.

Sad to be in Inferno mp1+ where you are all hitting lvl 63 mobs and keep gettin dropped such low 1h and pathetically low 2h weapons from a dps standpoint.
With enough support this can easily be carried out as new patch. It's just lowering the hell out of drop rates and increase the base min affix rolls on high ilvls.

As for now the other stats ARE enough with the new idea of gems having different bonuses. That spans a whole new range and accessability to weapons. Let alone if they introduced new gear able to roll sockets (e.g. bracers and shoulders etc.) which can have their own unique gem bonus.

There are some good ideas in this post.

So therefore if all they did was decrease rare drops by say 70% and made it so ilvl 63s could not be as bad as a ilvl 61 etc. it would make farming more interesting because you would be waiting for a drop instead of a stash full to ID.

Best thing about this idea is it brings light back to the guaranteed 5 NV stack elite rare drop.

Makes this mechanic a WHOOOOOOLE lot more appealing now. :D
i see it the other way around. assuming we're talking about good rares. how rare is it to find a rare item you can actually use or sell.

but yes. i'd prefer less drops better rolls.
It not about actually finding more good things. It's just tied to the emotion of finding things.

Rares aren't rare there for don't give you any feeling of finding anything at all.
And there's nothing between rares and legendarys so it's always a million piles of crap to one piece of crap that they have the nerve to call legendary. lol

Just make legendarys usefull and good. (Not rolling such low crap stats for their ilvl) (decrease drops for them too if you have to) And make rares rare and up to the standard you would expect a RARE to be at highest level ilvl63.....
Agree Completely. Would also love the option to hide sub rare quality drops. I want less clutter on screen and would like to feel there's some better than .001% chance that a rare I ID won't be junk. I don't mean it has to be great, that's always going to be relative to other drops, but I'd like to have rares with the opportunity to roll 7 affixes with the 7th affix being a class related one (more fury generation, more spirit regen, reduced cooldown of a random skill, increased damage of a random skill). Affixes like that can turn an item that'd otherwise be a dud into something worth considering. Also, reduce or get rid of the affixes Life on Kill and Ignore Durability loss and transform thorns damage into reflect damage based on % damage received rather than a flat number that scales horribly with monster power
Stay on track. Nice idea though but this isn't about itemization. That's another topic. This is just the solution to drop rates to make the hunt fun. Not emotionally cripiling. lol

I swear some legendary affixes have been popping up on rares like "Increase damage against elites" and such. I though that was only for Legendarys?

They should stop doing things like that and fix the drops and RNG roll ranges.
Perhaps have mandatory min/max/damage% rolls on all weapon drops. Still have to roll the dice on what numbers come up, but it'd help avoid the absolute garbage 200 dps ilvl 63 that only rolled life on kill, %damage to elites, 45 strength, and 45 intelligence.

The armor stuff isn't as bad as the weapons, but eliminating just 1 or 2 affixes for ilvl 63 armor (like ignores durability loss and life on kill) would go a long way towards making things better. Allowing main stats to have more than a double roll could also be great and increase the chance for a drop to be good. Right now you could get like 200 strength and 200 dex on gloves, but you can't get 400 strength. If there was a chance you could, there's more potential for the drop to be useful for a barb (or int and dex for their respective classes).

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