Any Barb Who *doesn't* use the NATS SET is a fool!

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@FunGun

LOL -- yeah, trading some crit dmg from your Nat in order to get 7% CC is a fairly even trade.

If you can find some ring out there with +32 AVG DMG / 6%CC / 50% CD / 150 STR / 9% IAS, then by all means gobble it up.

Rings like that don't roll. Usually a ring with 4 outstanding dmg attributes is just as strong.

Within the confines of feasible math, a ring with 4 great attributes (like the Nat I bought) is probably about as high as you will get the DPS... I found a couple rings on the AH that gave me +3-4k DPS (not counting the Nat bonus).

As for the Ice Climbers... on the entire AH, I did not find one that was anywhere near a max roll... maybe 2 bil will get you one...

With a GG Ice Climbers, you will get +230 STR vs. the 7% CC from Nat's. Using my DPS calculator, the 7% is stronger... not to mention all of the other bonuses of having CC vs. STR.

Finally, as I've pointed out a bunch of times, you will gimp your VIT a little bit with this setup, but all of the Dodge + Dmg Reduction will surely make up for it. In most cases, it will do an even better job of keeping you alive. Better not to get hit at all then to get hit with a few thousand more EHP.
03/30/2013 07:29 PMPosted by Brygo
Better not to get hit at all then to get hit with a few thousand more EHP.

Yeah, works pretty well by enemies runing around you with plague, molten and other types of damage where dodge doesnt work. And kiting an mob costs time. Time which you lose on your DPS.
Yes, yes, we know that it won't help you against molten and plague, etc...

Am I the only one here who just doesn't really die in this game since they nerfed it about eight months ago?

I'd gladly take an extra 5k DPS at the expense of some life...
Well, how do you not die with so low AR and EHP while some of us play MP10 ?
op i believe that you get 1 shot with magdas flies, rakanoths charge and zoltuns meteor on 4 ppl mp10 ubers. i also believe that that you wouldnt live 20 secs against any respectable molten arcane elite pack. so no forget nata set and get iceclimbers and good rare ring!
@hir0

What about the part where I ditch Lacunis and replace them with crafted bracers that have close to +300 STR / +200 VIT / +70 AR / +6% CC...

That gives me a big DPS, EHP, and AR edge over any Lacunis... and the MS loss is negated by the Nat's boots (without which I would be stuck with Lacunis).

*All this assumes keeping break points in order.
03/30/2013 07:41 PMPosted by Brygo
Am I the only one here who just doesn't really die in this game since they nerfed it about eight months ago?


A barb not dying in mp0 really isn't much to brag about...

The fact you think 32 min dmg = 32 avg dmg says you don't know what you're talking about. The fact that you think your 86 dex + 92 dex = almost 300 dex tells us you don't know how to do math.
Those bracers are going to be really hard to craft. And you lose 9% attack speed. That's too much right now when you're at just 48% (including dual wield bonus). I know you'll get a mempo and probably a hellfire ring replacement, but then you run into more strength problems. Just something to think about.

After thinking about it, the nat's set is pretty good I suppose. Really good ice climbers are indeed hard to roll. But I have a feeling that nat's ring cost a truck load, when similar rare rings can beat it at 50mil easy.
@Brygo

all your problems would be solved with 12% ms iceclimbers :) no really i would keep lacunis and do following changes: IK gloves - crafted trifecta, both rings - rare with avg dmg and cc/cd/ias/@res what you can afford, iceclimbers and craft vitality shoulders!
I thin it will take about 200 crafts to really get it right... but once I do, it will come together nicely.

This GG amulet took me 150 crafts to get. I will probably do another couple hundred to see if I can get a true trifecta to get me the IAS.

There is still a lot more STR for me to get on shoulders.

GG Ring + GG Ice Climbers + GG Lacunis < GG Nats Reflection + 100/100 Nats Footprint + GG Crafted Bracers...

Not only that, but you save about 4 billion gold and give yourself high Dodge + dmg reduction + the benefits of CC for WotB et al (yes, I get that you prob won't need it that much, but still good to have).

I think it's a winner. Obviously the headline was me trying to get clicks :)

The whole build depends upon 7% CC, and this can easily get you near 80% CC (w the WotB bonus).


I dunno what garbage gear your running. But I have over 85 cc when I have wotb up. I could use more ias, but im to poor to afford trifecta stuff. But putting nats ring and boots on what crash my cc and str bonus.

I wont be doing this and I advise other ppl to steer clear
he has 36% MS atm which he doesnt need, also by swapping to ice climbers you would have enough EHP to be able to drop war cry and pick up OP:KS which is 10 cc. by your own logic 10cc is better than 7cc so you are gimping yourself by using nats.
ALSO -- FWIW...

I can't find any Ice Climbers on the entire AH that are anywhere *near* this mythical 300 STR / 200 VIT roll that people are using to counter my build suggestions...

I'm seeing a couple of Climbers with 240 STR / 150 VIT that are selling for a billion gold or so... but they don't go anywhere near the Str levels that you would need to beat my combo.

Realistically, a GG rare ring + GG Ice Climbers that can beat my Nat Ring + Boots is not gonna happen for less than 3 bil gold. If at all.
@Gulgoth

Everything you said has been addressed in this thread.

The Lacunis are gonna be gone in favor of crafted bracers once I roll a high-str/high-vit/cc/ar one, which will take about 100 rolls is my guess.

That's one of the benefits of this build is that you get to ditch Lacunis for a higher-dps crafted.

I do use OP:KS, not sure why it says otherwise in my profile. You'll just have to take my word.
This 7% CC gain is being said by a barb who doesn't have his EF in his mainhand, and instead uses a sword? You just lost 10 precious CC there alone.

Aside from that, your numbers are based solely on your build. I agree nats boots + ring is awesome, but the ring gets expensive like that. Not every barb can shell out 200M+ for a 5.5% CC nat ring. You can get a 3-4% crit for like 40-50M, and that's what I usually roll with though.

You said some rather silly things though, like dodge > EHP (Dodge IS EHP, it's factored in there.)
and also that it's 6% dodge, then later said 10% dodge, but that's only if the barb has very minimal dex already. I've always tried to keep a few hundred dex on my barb, becasue the dim returns don't kick in hard until like 15-20% dodge chance.

However you might find, if you switched your weapons around, or got an axe/mace in your mainhand, that it's simply not that hard to get CC on a barb. Just by wearing an axe/mace, a barb gets 15% CC from passives, and 5% base. Add on that 10% on gloves, and 10% on ammy, and you already have 40 CC, followed by 6% on bracers, and more available on rings/helm and such, which easily hits 46-64 CC. Losing the 300-400+ STR really hurts at that point IMO.

Also, the only thing that is letting you ditch lacuni's is that you wear inn'a pants, another bad STR investment. It's not hard to get movement speed on boots, most of them have it, an all can roll it.

Edit: And you talk about EHP, but have +216 All Res?
I'm a sucker for "looks" not efficiency ;)
Those bracers are going to be really hard to craft. And you lose 9% attack speed. That's too much right now when you're at just 48% (including dual wield bonus). I know you'll get a mempo and probably a hellfire ring replacement, but then you run into more strength problems. Just something to think about.

After thinking about it, the nat's set is pretty good I suppose. Really good ice climbers are indeed hard to roll. But I have a feeling that nat's ring cost a truck load, when similar rare rings can beat it at 50mil easy.

Just have looked for some, the cheapest with crit (and you really want one with CC, or well why have it all then? For the Dex? As barb?) starts with around 30 m buyout.

The "good" ones start with 100m. And for that you can get as well an Litany, with decent str. which gives you also + damage to elites. Or any ring that has CC, CD, IAS and Str. which is also an huge DPS bonus.

An really good nats ring can be way out of anyones reach.

@Gulgoth

Everything you said has been addressed in this thread.

The Lacunis are gonna be gone in favor of crafted bracers once I roll a high-str/high-vit/cc/ar one, which will take about 100 rolls is my guess.

The chance for trifectat stats (CC, CD, IAS) is around 1 in 200 tries for gloves. You are looking for bracers with 4 HIGH(!) stats.

Good luck finding those in 100 tries ...
If you can get a nats set barb into the top 10 then i will consider it
@ Dellusions,

I get +3k DPS from sword in mainhand, though I may switch back to get the crits.

Plenty of barbs put EF in their MH and many do it in their OH... there is no standard. Even when their MH is a sword. Lots of factors to consider.
OK, using a drawr EHP calculator... here is what the Dex and Melee Reduction does for you...

4 Dex = 1 VIT according to the EHP calculator..

1% Melee Reduction = 14 VIT according to the EHP calculator...

So the approx +200 Dex / + 6% melee reduction you get from this set equates to 50 + 84 VIT = 134 VIT... not bad, really bridges the Ice Climbers gap.

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