Terran is so OP...Zerg tactics are useless!

Zerg Discussion
Ok...this is the problem I'm having FREQUENTLY:

Terrans are crushing me with their death balls. (lol)

Their ramp blocking prevents early attacks, even with a 6 pool and it takes too much vital gas, and the sacrifice of Banelings to HURT the wall and harass (early Zerg harassment is now very hard to accomplish)...the marines protecting the wall have enough range to vaporize 3 out of 4 Banelings charging to erase the wall...and their sentries repair it to easily...that leaves me with an economy build to get a spire as fast as I can...but 1 base fortress techniques make Mutalisk Harrassment as effective as the Banelings. I send +10 Initial Mutalisks and (just 2--then more) defensive air turrets inflict too much harm. If the Mutalisks survive the anti air barrage, the Marines back up too quickly to harass the mineral line.----And Terran cannot be permitted to build their Tech/marine balls. Zerg an't propagate quickly enough to provide backup main bases. They send their ball, and flatten most armies that attack them on their way to the main base.

IN FACT: if they wish to play more macro, they just send a contingent of marines covered by Tanks...and they have a 80% secure expansion. Zerg cannot defend their bases like that.

If on the offensive, Terrans just make a journey to your base, !!## your Lair level defenses, Attack tech Buildings...and voila the Zerg become hopeless wildlife again.

It's funny that most reviewers say that the Zerg are a reactive race: And the only race that has SO huge vulnerabilities it must be classified differently...and underpowered enough to require massive micro/macro skills and just plain luck to win. Even poor Idra loses games against Terran even when he has harvested HALF THE MAP OR MORE! Its ridiculous to see such Macro masters like him lose to a 3 base Terran army.

Zerg are just too weak, too slow. AND BASIC TERRAN COMBINATIONS PWN THEIR MOST EXPENSIVE ARMIES WITH OFFENSIVE EASE. The other day a block of stimmed Terran pulverized a cloud of endgame Broood lords in seconds! it was so quick, it seemed like a glitch. They just moved in, 1, 2, 3 they are all gone.Thank you Broodlords for being the expensive slow air whales that you are. Is there any sense for them being so slow? Terran has just as effective anti land units that are faster.

Zerg buildings should hatch out faster. That way they can have competitive units faster (like Ultralisks-and even then, they get pwnd so easy : ( ). And the gas cost lower: IF Terran can have ranged units for just minerals...why do Zerg pay extra for less hardy versions?

I'm really frustrated. Zerg are my favorite race (love HR Giger's Aliens and Starship Troopers)...but they are just there to suck up to the other two races.

I'm being defeated to frequently by Terrans. I'm..losing the will to challenge industrial civilization. Mutant super-biology has got nothing on hard steel.

How do I shoot web? Is it even shootable?
maek mor dron
if not trolling... I like map controlling the !@#$ out of terrans and I always 100% of the time go ling bling muta cause otherwise I will be rolled by rine-tank-vac. The premise here is never let the terran do anything outside of his own natural ever. Basic tenants:
1) expand quickly and whenever possible you have to be a base up if not more
2) Mutas do you very little good inside your own base, keep them active worst case scenario terran over counters mutas with thors or missile turrets and your econ advantage just went higher.
3) one ling at every possible expansion (3rd and higher on the list) for countering timings
3a) A lot of my zvt ends with me countering a 3rd expansion multiple times, the terran learns and moves his army up to defend, I intercept with lings and the ball becomes a huge surface area line for my lings to go nuts on
4) speed and upgrades are the two most important aspects, I get bling speed before melee upgrades. Mainly, never fall to behind in upgrades or a bio medivac ball will ruin your day

I only offer this strat because I see you too are in silver and this has been working for me (90% winrate v terran with it). I even am beating gold terrans (notable as I lose to gold anything else). If you dont like long games this is not for you, terran will hang around FOREVER before he finally pulls scvs for last ditch push.
If you want I could upload replays that show this working (again this is silver league only, down here the terrans dont stutterstep or split well)
Idra makes max dron = Lose
What do?
Umad bro?
11/08/2011 12:34 PMPosted by Xenos
maek mor dron

Pretty much this. It doesn't matter if he hits you with 20 marines and a few tanks if you can hit him with 150 zerglings, 20 brood lords, or a crapton of mutas and blings.
Of course you're not supposed to break into a terran's base. Blizzard designed them to be invulnerable early game. Live with it. If all you do is make 8 mutas and expect them to take on 3 turrets and a bunch of marines, you've got another thing coming. Good news is they spent that money on turrets and marines, and you can use banelings to ^&* their army later on.
if not trolling... I like map controlling the !@#$ out of terrans and I always 100% of the time go ling bling muta cause otherwise I will be rolled by rine-tank-vac. The premise here is never let the terran do anything outside of his own natural ever. Basic tenants:
1) expand quickly and whenever possible you have to be a base up if not more
2) Mutas do you very little good inside your own base, keep them active worst case scenario terran over counters mutas with thors or missile turrets and your econ advantage just went higher.
3) one ling at every possible expansion (3rd and higher on the list) for countering timings
3a) A lot of my zvt ends with me countering a 3rd expansion multiple times, the terran learns and moves his army up to defend, I intercept with lings and the ball becomes a huge surface area line for my lings to go nuts on
4) speed and upgrades are the two most important aspects, I get bling speed before melee upgrades. Mainly, never fall to behind in upgrades or a bio medivac ball will ruin your day

I only offer this strat because I see you too are in silver and this has been working for me (90% winrate v terran with it). I even am beating gold terrans (notable as I lose to gold anything else). If you dont like long games this is not for you, terran will hang around FOREVER before he finally pulls scvs for last ditch push.
If you want I could upload replays that show this working (again this is silver league only, down here the terrans dont stutterstep or split well)


Cerebrate please do...and add link. It could offer this fresh out of egg drone new tactical concepts.
lets see a replay and we can help out. and marines had to be a buttload of them to take out broods since they auto target the broodlings and the lords and how did the marines get that close the brood lords shoulda started shooting broodlings and kept the marines back. i mean seriously broodlords wreck terrans in a bad way when u get like 8 or more. And idra loseing to a 3 base terran well thats no big shock i mean they still have mules and marines are good but so are infestors with fungal, and dont say medi out heal fungal thats not the point u fungal and banelings kill the marines that cant run away.The point im making is u have to have more options than just saying my muties got beat by base defense back by marines, then not saying this but your broods got caught with there pants down and took out because they had no support with them and were outta postion. the reason they are slow is the are powerful and they fly if they were as fast as muties you could never lose to a terran ever u would just kite and kill all day long think about it.



edit: tl;dr less qq more pew pew
I will, I am currently at work (yay for having a job were I can be on sc2 forums at least). I will have it up tonight.
lets see a replay and we can help out. and marines had to be a buttload of them to take out broods since they auto target the broodlings and the lords and how did the marines get that close the brood lords shoulda started shooting broodlings and kept the marines back. i mean seriously broodlords wreck terrans in a bad way when u get like 8 or more. And idra loseing to a 3 base terran well thats no big shock i mean they still have mules and marines are good but so are infestors with fungal, and dont say medi out heal fungal thats not the point u fungal and banelings kill the marines that cant run away.The point im making is u have to have more options than just saying my muties got beat by base defense back by marines, then not saying this but your broods got caught with there pants down and took out because they had no support with them and were outta postion. the reason they are slow is the are powerful and they fly if they were as fast as muties you could never lose to a terran ever u would just kite and kill all day long think about it.



edit: tl;dr less qq more pew pew


I think the Terran went micro on my Broodlords. He made them ignore the auto targeting. Attacked the Broodlords straight on, rushed (stimmed) towards them.The broodlings killed a few, but the Terrans ran under and in range to be OP over my Broodlords before they could spawn a mass of broodlings to block their path.It was incredible.

How do you export and upload replays?
Right now you most likely have no multitasking skills and that will improve by practice.

For right now....

You need to learn a basic build order against terran. I suggest 15 hatch 15 pool

Drone to 9
Overload
Drone to 15
Hatch at natural
Send a drone to scout the terran (ZvT is the only matchup I drone scout)
Drone
Spawning pool
drone to 17
Overload
Queen at both hatches
2 sets of zerglings
Spine at your natural
Drone Drone Drone!

Its really important that you scout. If you see no gas expect early marine pressure, if there is a gas expect hellion expand.

This opening is super safe against a terran if you continue to lose send us some replays, and we can figure out what your doing wrong.
make drones, keep map vision, units when he attacks. take your 3rd at 10 mins in. when he's starting to attack, rally your units to outside of your base so that you can flank from behind, you won't attack from where he wants you to. I noticed your silver so not sure what goes on in the lower leagues now, but I believe so long as you keep up on injects and scout for his push, you're safe~.
Sorry to pile on the advice, but if you want something that will help in all aspects of the game day9 daily 360 is excellent. Hotkeys FTW :P

bayul, ignore kaguro: sorry kaguro but most of the high league advice for lowbies is crap. We are trying to do the mechanics stuff better while also trying not to get roflstomped.
Hard microtasking is hard :(
If you want to help, kaguro, keep advice specific to the question, something like mutas behind a rine tank push to pick off tanks while lings and blings roll in the front.
see you just said your broods werent supported thats why they died to marines you need so lings and blings with them so when they stimmed and moved forward even if he was focus fireing your broods then the lings and blings clean them up and now u run them to one of his bases to do some damage since he tried to take out your broods with just marines. Think of it this was siege tanks get owned when its just siege tanks and nothing else right, broodlords are kinda the same way they just fly so they have an advantage you can expolit like cliffs and u stay outta range with terrain being in the way
tbh this is my first upload so I hope it worked
http://www.gamereplays.org/starcraft2/replays.php?game=33&show=details&id=240967
gl man and if you need a practice partner my code is .112 Always open to having someone new to practice with
Right now you most likely have no multitasking skills and that will improve by practice.

For right now....

You need to learn a basic build order against terran. I suggest 15 hatch 15 pool

Drone to 9
Overload
Drone to 15
Hatch at natural
Send a drone to scout the terran (ZvT is the only matchup I drone scout)
Drone
Spawning pool
drone to 17
Overload
Queen at both hatches
2 sets of zerglings
Spine at your natural
Drone Drone Drone!

Its really important that you scout. If you see no gas expect early marine pressure, if there is a gas expect hellion expand.

This opening is super safe against a terran if you continue to lose send us some replays, and we can figure out what your doing wrong.


Where there's no way I can scout if he is gassing up, for Terrans now build a wall in their ramp before I can risk sending out a drone to scout. Their first buildings form the Wall!
How do you link up using the character code? I see no character search bar or anything to help connect with players that are not currently playing with or against me. : /
11/08/2011 01:17 PMPosted by Drhorrible
bayul, ignore kaguro: sorry kaguro but most of the high league advice for lowbies is crap.


lol. Its not crap most of the time. You just have to understand your OPPONENTS ability in your league and play into that.

Most low league players spend more than they need in defense. Most go 1 base for longer than they should. Most are 1 trick ponies.
With zerg being already not-so-viable with early aggression, its silly to think a lowbie zerg is going to have much sucess with a baneling bust, roach rush, etc etc. Expecially when the defending player is probably turtling 1 base bancheese.

So when you hear a higher level player tell you to scout, drone, macro, defend, then kill him in that mid-game sweet spot.. There is a reason for it. If you learn to survive the one base t/p play, you will cruise to plat/low diamond.
At the higher diamond/master level. You can start 1 basing a bit again, you can cheese more effectively, and rushes are more viable. Because players are more refined in their builds, their mechanics are better, execution is better.

You just have to remember you don't need 2 bases worth of drones if hes on 1 base. You just need enough to keep up to him and his 1 base. Like 1.3-1.5 bases worth of saturation at most. There are droning windows you will become comfortable with. But you'll never learn those windows until you drone and die because you went too far, or too little.


Beating Terran is simple as 1, 2, 3:

1)Ling
2)Bling
3)Muta
Don't get broodlords without something to park underneath them, otherwise P or T just run under and thrash them

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