If you are trying to improve...

General Discussion
Play off one base and one base only for a couple days or even a week.

Why does it seem that so many people in the lower leagues insist on playing these 5 base macro games because they are what "improve" their game the most. If you are learning a new sport you don't go straight to practicing the most technical skills you build a good foundation to improve on. Until you can execute 1 base play to 95% effectiveness what's the point of trying something even harder.

And if your response to this is " herp derp 1 base play is cheese thats dumb" then I've got news for ya, you picked the wrong game.
You present no evidence...

but for some reason...I feel like you're right.
I prefer 2-3 base play :P
1 basing stuff is a little harder to do, because of the fact it is almost always all-in. Generally speaking, that is.
I would agree for T and P but for Zerg that just isn't feasible.

But still I agree that for T and P 1 base play is something essential to have mastered and have in your "playbook".
I would agree for T and P but for Zerg that just isn't feasible.

But still I agree that for T and P 1 base play is something essential to have mastered and have in your "playbook".


This.. while it just isn't possible for zerg to one base (especially not lower league) there is no reason why T and P shouldn't.

And besides knowing how to play one base actually helps you hold cheese and how to properly counter and win.
I might do that because i suck at all-ins and 1 base play in general.
hmmm my first reaction was "Nuh huh", but then I thought about it. I did go through a time of cannon rushing, Reaper rushing, and 10 pooling. One base cheese yes, but that might be kinda micro work I guess.

Then worked on the goal of expanding, using units I have ignored, build order etc.

Further up the ladder you kinda have to expand folks have learned to block the ramp, and cannon rushing gets boring. The opponent expanded, eventually you will run out of minerals or will not be able to keep up with the stuff they build due to having more bases. Low league games are won some times by just having MORE stuff. (or just luck on an engagement).
zerg need at least 2 bases to operate, i cant play on 1 base because the income is unbareably low
Disagree, Z and P armies without 2 base income are pretty weak, and Terran 1-base is basically just all-in.
05/31/2012 11:41 PMPosted by Mediocrates
Disagree, Z and P armies without 2 base income are pretty weak, and Terran 1-base is basically just all-in.
This, basically.

1 base is not an option for wither Z or P in PvZ, ZvP, ZvT, and Protoss is actually better off with 1 gate FE in PvT as that offers more flexibility against Terran 1 base all-ins. Playing 1 base is stupidly bad for learning because you tend to learn VERY bad habits that are harder to "unlearn" when you want to play macro games later.
This is a sorta silly idea.

More bases is good. Macro play is good. That's how you get better. Getting really good at one-base rushes is not how you ultimately improve.

The sport analogy is a false comparison. Trying macro play isn't like trying overly technical skills, it's practicing fundamentals. At its very core this is a game of resource management: make money and spend it. Practicing overly advanced skills would be like a player practicing his marine-splits in bronze instead of focusing on economy.
There comes a time in your StarCraft career when being an exclusively 1-base player will cost you. I made diamond largely (not exclusively) on the strength of 1-base timings, and that has ended up meaning that I've needed to play catch up to learn other styles. Not impossible, of course, but I'd advise people who really want to improve at the game to work on all aspects of their game and not get too focused on 1-basing.
Lol at all of us lower league players telling the OP he's wrong. The idea is that you can't macro properly on 2 or more bases if you can't do it on just one base. It's about teaching yourself mechanics. Myself, I like to mix up my play just so I don't get bored.
I can hold 2-3 bases perfectly fine.

It's the cheese that gets me, when I scout it it's too late. Can't wait till season 8.
There's a guy named FILTERSC who's got some good videos for entry-level mechanics.
I have a lot of friends in the bronze/silver range. I think that the first thing a player must learn how to do is execute a one base build down to at least 10 seconds within the perfect timing. (5:45 4gate with pylon ready to go). This helps a player grasp the importance of timings and crisp macro. They will realize quite quickly that when they get supply blocked or hit 15 seconds late it is much harder to win.

Once you have mastered this turn it into a two base timing. (stim/combat shields 1/1 24 marine/maruder medivac push). Too many players will think they want to be all "nice" and play "macro". They then fast expand, make a few units, sit back, and wait around until they are maxed. This type of play teaches you nothing about the importance of timings, map control, or solid build orders. This illusion that getting as many bases as possible and hitting your queen injects will make you the best player you can be is completely wrong. Macro is so much more about effeicently spending your money and attacking when you need to be attacking.

Once you have a two base timing down, start building a third base once you move out.
I can hold 2-3 bases perfectly fine.

It's the cheese that gets me, when I scout it it's too late. Can't wait till season 8.


No offense, but I'm guessing that even if you were given the opportunity to play on 2-3 bases, you would lose 8/10 games to anyone at or above gold. And even if that isn't true, timing pushes are a very important aspect of this game, and to improve, you'll need to master holding and executing them.
06/01/2012 09:26 AMPosted by Pickle
There's a guy named FILTERSC who's got some good videos for entry-level mechanics.


http://www.youtube.com/user/filtersc

this it? neat thanks. :D
People can cheese their way up the ranks and still be completely unable to play any sort of macro game.

Practicing cheese/all-ins gets you good at cheese/all-ins, nothing else.

Taking on macro style play is more difficult, certainly, but it is how you improve at the game.

You'll start off terrible, sure, but you'll improve by doing, and you'll know you're improving by moving up the ranks. And as you move up, you'll be getting better at it.
I have a lot of friends in the bronze/silver range. I think that the first thing a player must learn how to do is execute a one base build down to at least 10 seconds within the perfect timing. (5:45 4gate with pylon ready to go). This helps a player grasp the importance of timings and crisp macro. They will realize quite quickly that when they get supply blocked or hit 15 seconds late it is much harder to win.

Once you have mastered this turn it into a two base timing. (stim/combat shields 1/1 24 marine/maruder medivac push). Too many players will think they want to be all "nice" and play "macro". They then fast expand, make a few units, sit back, and wait around until they are maxed. This type of play teaches you nothing about the importance of timings, map control, or solid build orders. This illusion that getting as many bases as possible and hitting your queen injects will make you the best player you can be is completely wrong. Macro is so much more about effeicently spending your money and attacking when you need to be attacking.

Once you have a two base timing down, start building a third base once you move out.


This is a great explanation .

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