Shadow Priest PVP Issues It seems like over the years we have had some ups and downs. At the start we were damned good, but then changes came in that worked against us, especially in BC. We were still doing well, but there were signs of decline. At the start of Wrath we were terrible, and all of us were begging for some more pvp improvements. They finally came in the form of a patch, introducing Psychic Horror and other buffs. Once again, however, it seems like Shadow Priests are having a hard time competing in any real serious pvp situations. Now with our dispel mechanic being nerfed, another problem has arisen involving class synergy, which was already a bit of a problem to begin with. What's funny, is that most of our problems come in the form of issues we've had throughout the class' life and thought to have solved. Mobility Since as long as I can remember, Shadow Priests have always had problems moving away from melee to either get some damage in or to heal themselves. Far too often a class can focus a Shadow Priest and keep him slowed for almost the entire duration of an Arena match. One would argue that it's up to the partner to keep things off of him, but in 3s situations, it seems like we're being "babysat". Where as a mage can blink away, a warlock can teleport, and a shaman or druid can simply shift forms and dash off, Shadow Priests are left soaking up massive amounts of damage while being slowed almost indefinitely. Poisons are re-applied after we use fade, and warriors simply won't let us get more then a few steps. Fear doesn't help much, since all a class needs to do to get rid of it is blow an ability or use their trinket, and and considering the cooldown on our only 2 viable crowd control sources, classes will use any tactic necessary to remove the effects. The same applies to our horror since the recent change to pvp trinkets allows any class to remove disarm effects as well as silence effects. This makes keeping a warrior off us, or stopping a mage, extremely difficult. And the real kicker of the situation is that priests have access to a key mobility solution that gives us immunity to snares for a short time, but it comes in the form of discipline gear. I wonder what goes through Blizzard's head when they see the gear designed specifically for shadow being abandoned for discipline gear. This speaks waves on the state of things. How many Shadow Priests do you know who don't wear the proper set? Mana Troubles While many argue that Mana should NOT be an issue because of all of the mana returning abilities that we have at our disposa. While dispersion is a nice way to gain mana back, blowing it results in a key turning point in a battle. Once dispersion is down, we have even less mobility and survivability options. I believe in key decision making but using dispersion only as a mana return ability seems flawed. There is also Shadow Word Death, which restores a portion of our mana each time we take damage from the spell. Unfortunately, the mana it returned is not enough to really help us when we're incredibly short and casting it while being focused by a melee is probably the last thing you want to do, since you're now killing yourself, as well as that rogue. Then there is Hymn of Hope, a spell meant for holy priests which only calls to be interrupted, does not restore enough mana, and takes us out of shadow form. Finally, there is Dark Archangel, which is a spell that we need to set up properly before hand with a hard cast that roots us in place. So there you have it. Yes we have ways to gain mana back but all of them bring a negative effect, can easily be stopped, or simply just does not restore enough of it. The solution is not to give us another mana returning ability, but rather to adjust some mechanics of how shadow works. Lowering the cost on dots would probably be the most optimal, since soon they will deal less damage, and cost the same amount of mana. In melee situations, which is where the biggest problems arise, this will only serve to not push out enough damage to matter, and drain us even quicker then before. Direshadow17
Aug 14, 2011 Aug 14, 2011 Aug 14, 2011 Aug 14, 2011 Aug 14, 2011
Mind Vision: A Look at Our Community A naming poll is now up! In an attempt to keep threads from being deleted, I propose we follow in the footsteps of the Sentry Totem and Mangle: Bear (for those who don't know, explains what I'm talking about) and strive to keep each thread up and running until it's capped. If you ask what the iconic priest spell is, you'll hear different answers from different priests. I chose Mind Vision out of a few contenders (Levitate, Mind Control and Lifegrip lost out) partially because someone was very quick with that answer and partially because I think it fits what I'm trying to achieve: a true communal discussion -- a look into the minds of other priests through varied discussions and relaxed interaction. I'm going to lay down a few basic rules and ask that they are copied into the first post of every Mind Vision thread: 1. Everyone is welcome. Newbies, oldbies, lowbies, mains, alts, bank alts, non-priest alts. Everyone. As long as you're here to join a priest-based discussion, you're welcome. 2. Keep it civil, if not friendly. If you can't manage that, please stay out of the thread. We don't need or want drama. If you just got out of a heated discussion with someone, leave it at the door. Along the same vein, avoid badmouthing others in this thread. 3. This is as much priests talking to priests as it is priests talking about priests. I firmly believe our community is one of, if not the most welcoming on the forums. I'd like to learn more about the community on an individual level because of this. Both the Mangle: Bear and Sentry Totem series derail after the first few pages of each thread; I think this is fine. 4. In n' Out burgers are the best fast food burgers available. This is not up for discussion. Discussion topics: * Why the priest community is so welcoming * What you consider the most iconic priest spell * Your first experience on the priest forums * Why you started your priest * Your first memory as a priest Snip goes the red ribbon, up goes the thread. Elethia500
Aug 14, 2011 Aug 14, 2011 Aug 14, 2011 Aug 14, 2011 Aug 13, 2011 Aug 13, 2011 Aug 13, 2011 Aug 13, 2011 Aug 13, 2011 Aug 13, 2011
Questioning Disc Dps and Theorycrafting There is a TL;DR at the end. What Happened: I have been Dpsing as Disc for a while and I have made a proper healing Disc (My Secondary Spec), as Holy was not my style, and I have only done heroic dungeons up to ZA/ZG (my guild doesn't raid). Last Night in Heroic Vortex Pinnacle I was a Dps after I got my Darkmoon Card: Volcano and was doing well, wasn't getting in the Healer's way (a Holy Paladin) and on the first boss I crit with Holy Fire for 39K from all my int procs going off (Power Torrent, Lightweave, Volcano, Int potion). I was happy until I saw an Atonement heal for 40k. I now feel like I 'm broken. I checked my recount and I was 3rd overall dps and average 2nd on bosses. But I was healing a lot with Atonement. My average damage from Smite and Holy Fire was doing 20k-30k. I like to dps as Disc but now I feel really broken. The question I have is, should I at this point drop Atonement while dpsing? I feel I don't bring anything if I don't but my Atonement heals are out of control. The more DPS I do the more healing I do and the more broken I get. When people talked about Disc Dps before, the main argument against it that I agree with is that a spec or style that gives good heals and good dps at the same time is broken, but how do you fix that without hurting AA/A healers? I personally have been doing the Disc Dps experiment and I tried out many different armor, weapons (staves vs. Main-hand/off-hand), and talents. So I did some theorycraft over at and made a couple of changes to the Disc tree so that everyone is happy without hurting current play styles, but I wanted input from others to find out what's wrong, what works and what could be done better. I know that is is prideful to think I can fix Disc to my liking, but I like both Disc healing and Disc Dps, but I agree that there should be a clear separation of Dps and Healing. TL;DR: 1. If I am Dpsing as disc, should I drop Atonement? 2. I agree with the argument that good Dps and good healing = broken 3. Can there be a way to allow Disc Dps without affecting Disc Healing? My thoughts on a the Disc Tree: My thoughts on a Disc DPS build: Thuta15
Aug 13, 2011 Aug 13, 2011 Aug 13, 2011 Aug 13, 2011 Aug 13, 2011 Aug 13, 2011 Aug 13, 2011 Aug 13, 2011 Aug 13, 2011 Aug 13, 2011
Silence and Psychic Horror Skimmed through the threads and didn't see this one up so I figured I'd post an idea that may or may not have been mentioned already. This is something that has been nagging me for awhile and wanted to get some feed back from other shadow priests to see what they thought. Currently, our raiding spec leaves us with one extra point left over to place...somewhere. Usually I place this extra point in Inner Sanctum for the extra 2% spell damage reduction to help the healers out a bit, but others sometimes place it in Psychic Horror for its occasional use or in Phantasm for a "maybe" root/slow clearing effect. To get the point, I'd like to see Silence and Psychic Horror's current locations be swapped in the talent tree...for multiple reasons. As it stands, Improved Psychic Scream is a pre-req for Silence, which in itself has always bugged me. Many a time, I have wished I had Silence in a raid for helping with interrupts on Maloriak, or on Chromatic Prototypes on the Nef encounter just to name a couple. However, PvE centric shadow priests can not afford to drop two points into Improved Psychic Scream to make this viable. Having Silence put to the location in the tree where Psychic Horror currently is would allow us to finally have an interrupt in a PvE setting without having to spend points in a pre-req that has little to no usage for us in raiding. Secondly, Improved Psychic Scream justs seems better suited to be the pre-req for Psychic Horror than Silence anyway. There is more synergy between Psychic Scream and Psychic Horror and a tree change like this one would represent that. I understand that this would have an effect on lower level shadow priests, especially in low level BG's, where it would take them longer to obtain Silence than it currently does. However you could look at the flip side, and see that giving them Psychic Horror at a lower level would benefit them more against melee attackers, not to mention, Psychic Horror can still be used as a semi-silence as it often is in max level PvP when Silence is on cooldown. The alternative would be more extreme, giving all shadow priests Silence at level ten when they simply spec into the shadow tree. But seeing as how we already receive Mind Flay when specing into Shadow at level ten, I do not see that happening...but it's worth considering. Just putting this out there for discussion. Constructive feedback much appreciated. Clockwerk10
Aug 13, 2011 Aug 13, 2011 Aug 13, 2011 Aug 13, 2011 Aug 13, 2011 Aug 13, 2011
Shammy, Pally Priest or Druid healer? I have this pally lvl 84, a lvl 85 resto shammy, a lvl 85 PVP resto druid and a lvl 82 Holy priest. My toons rank as the following: 1 – Resto Shammy – I have about 359 gear level on resto. I have successfully ran all reg heroics and ZG/ZA instances but have not raided (at all). I understand the mechanics of healing with a shammy and rarely have to tell the group to wait because I am OOM. I like healing with him, the OS is enh and I tried raiding with this guy a couple of weeks ago and wiped so many times and my dps was about 11k. 2 – Resto Druid – I have mainly pvp and arena (2s) with this guy to the point that I am farily hard to kill. Was running with a hunter but he rerolled pally and I lost my partner. 3 – Holy Paladin – This toon used to be my main for the longest time and really enjoyed it as ret (when ret used to suck) tried my hand at healing back in WOTLK but I got tired of it because everyone rolled a pally when Wrath came out. 4 – Holy priest – I have one sitting at lvl 82 at the moment and will most likely level him soon. I have not healed since TBC instances. Out of all 3 classes which one is the best one to heal with. With my shammy I do not move that much except when I use a spell (cant remember the name) but besides that I am standing on the same spot, with my druid (in bgs) I tend to move a lot and cast at the same time (except the I hate the male worgen casting animation… looks like he attempting to fly away). I am thinking I may like the pally because it has Holy Shock and that cone thing that does AOE heals (instant casts) but I have to deal with holy power. Do not know anything about priest because I roll shadow nowadays. I guess I am looking into advice in a class that can heal good, and has a lot of mobility for those times when you have to move and heal if not your raid group dies (or worse you die). I will post this in every class healing class so I get a good idea. Vaalok6
Aug 13, 2011 Aug 13, 2011 Aug 13, 2011 Aug 13, 2011 Aug 13, 2011 Aug 13, 2011 Aug 12, 2011 Aug 12, 2011 Aug 12, 2011 Aug 12, 2011 Aug 12, 2011 Aug 12, 2011 Aug 12, 2011 Aug 12, 2011 Aug 12, 2011 Aug 12, 2011 Aug 12, 2011 Aug 12, 2011 Aug 12, 2011