1d Vanguards Retribution Paladin PvP Guide 7.1 Retribution Paladin Guide This guide is written mainly for players new to playing retribution in arena / PvP. Guide is also posted in a different format on: What changed about Rets in 7.1? 1.) Relentless has been nerfed from 25% to 20%. 2.) Holy Wrath has been nerfed from 50% to 35% of your lost health dealt as damage in PvP. 3.) Blade of Wrath has been reworked, it now has a chance to proc a Blade of Justice CD reset on auto attacks. *FAQ* Blade of Wrath is still the superior talent for almost all PvP situations. Reasons are almost identical to the old Blade of Wrath. 4.) Vengeance Aura only affects targets who has Blessings. Talents In the talent picture I selected talents that I use as default in arena. Talents should be changed every arena match depending on what composition you're playing, what you're up against, and what strategy you and your opponent might execute. Read below for a more detailed explanation on talent choices. Level 15: Highly Recommended: Final Verdict This increases your Final Verdict damage by 20%. Currently the other 2 talents just don't beat out the damage you can gain from Final Verdict in a PvP scenario. Level 30 Recommended: Zeal Crusader strike is rarely used on CD in PvP, this makes Fires of Justice a bit more lackluster. Rarely do Rets run out of globals for things to do in PvP, making the longer CD on Zeal not much of a problem allowing it to buff our Crusader Strike damage significantly without a big cost. Due to this, Zeal will almost always do more damage than the other talents on this tier other than extremely specific situations. Greater Judgment is useful in fast games but keep in mind Crits have reduced effect in PvP. Over a long-game unless the other team was above 50% HP the entire game and you were getting kited a lot Zeal will be superior. Level 45 Recommended: Fist of Justice Logic here for Fist is very similar to WoD, the other 2 talents are mostly used if you want to strategize around them. Repentance is somewhat improved in the fact that it doesn't use the CD if you cast it on a Beast, but you'll require a lot of effort to land it especially on Druids. Blind is essentially the same as before, not very useful unless you want to rush a game. Level 60 Recommended: Blade of Wrath Blade of Wrath provides the best consistent damage and also good holy power generation. Crits are also 150% in PvP, making Virtue's Blade much worse than it would be in PvE. Level 75 Recommended: Any Justicar's Vengeance has a lot of synergy with Divine Purpose. Basically, you use it with the proc or when the target is stunned. This talent is excellent especially in 2v2, when you hit healers a lot during stuns. Eye for an Eye should be picked against any kind of physical damage team that will focus you. Word of Glory is a good choice against DOT cleaves that has a low physical damage component to it. Level 90 Recommended: Divine Intervention and Any Divine Intervention helps our survivablity a ton in longer games. Not having to press Bubble when we get low is like a large indirect increase to our health-pool pre-bubble. This is generally my default talent. However, our Mobility in this pre-patch is horrible, and having at least one talent to help it is nice. If you plan to for example, chase a Mistweaver Monk in 2v2 you should use the mobility talents instead. Divine Steed should be used for chasing cooldown based mobility targets such as Holy Paladins. Seal of Light is better for targets with consistently strong mobility such as Mages and Mistweaver Monks. Level 100 Recommended: Divine Purpose Holy Wrath now does 35% of your missing HP as damage. This is still decent burst, but with the long CD mixed in Divine Purpose will almost always be superior outside of 2v2 Skirmishes or Duels. Crusade requires a ramp up time and is generally not as useful in PvP compared to how strong it is in PvE. Glyphs Removed Artifact Traits 1. Wake of Ashes 2. Blade of Light 3. Righteous Blade x3 4. Unbreakable Will 5. Protector of the Ashen Blade 6. Ashes to Ashes 7. Deliver the Justice x3 8. Sharpened Edge x3 9. Deflection x3 10. Echo of the Highlord 11. Wrath of the Ashbringer x3 12. Highlord's Judgment x3 13. Embrace the Light x3 14. Might of the Templar x3 15. Divine Tempest 16. Endless Resolve 17. Healing StormVanguardy553 1d
Oct 20 [Legion] Protection Paladin Guide Welcome to Prot Paladin Guide for Legion. Full guide in proper formatting available here : Mini TL;DR ...To Skip to Discussion : ... Abilities Offensive Shield of the Righteous Charges: Somewhat reskinned Holy Power since we can still consume it with seraphim (if talented) and it’s still the only ~resource~ we actively generate. Shield of the Righteous: 16 sec CD, reduced by haste and Judgment. Active Mitigation (AM) of protection paladins. Starting with legion it also works in reducing magical damage so it somewhat makes up for loss of of divine protection. SotR also interacts with level 100 Seraphim talent, which consumes charges (including partial) for short term buff. Avenger’s Shield: 15 sec CD, reduced by haste and reset by Grand Crusader procs. One of the key dps abilities we have, going to Legion from WoD we lose the 2 extra bounces (until we obtain legendary for it), but with an artifact trait, it can also do a small aoe pulse around each target hit; therefore we can safely pick up adds from range. Furthermore it interrupts initial target, making caster npcs come to us. Hammer of the Righteous: 4.5 sec CD, reduced by haste. Our filler ability; does extra aoe when we’re standing in consecration and has a chance to trigger Grand Crusader to reset Avenger’s Shield cooldown. When talented into Consecrated Hammer it always AoEs and when talented into Blessed Hammer, it always summons a hammer which does two full spins around us, being able to hit targets multiple times. Judgment: 6 sec CD, reduced by haste. Each cast reduces cooldown on SotR, thus making Judgment our “resource generator”. Critical hits reduce the CD by twice as much. Consecration: 9 sec CD, reduced by haste. AoE pulse ability which does not follow us, furthermore increases our SotR and Light of the Protector by 20% when we are standing in it. It’s important to note that this is multiplicative x1.2 not flat 20% increase, so 35% healing will go to 42% instead of 55%. Avenging Wrath: 2 min CD - 20 sec duration, increases damage and healing by 35%. Blessings Blessing of Protection: 5 min CD. Prevents all physical damage for 10 seconds, while also dropping threat from the target. Does not prevent target from attacking. Blessing of Sacrifice: 2.5 min CD. Redirects 30% of the damage taken by target to you for 12 seconds. Blessing of Spellwarding: (Talent) 3 min CD. Replaces Blessing of Protection, prevents all magical dmg to the target for 10 seconds, does not drop threat from target. Defensive Light of the Protector: 15 sec cd, reduced by haste. Key defensive ability along with SotR. Heals us for 25% of Missing health. Further buffed by standing in consecration and artifact abilities. Ardent Defender: 2 min CD. Reduces all damage by 20% for 8 sec. If you are to die during it’s duration it prevents the killing blow and brings you up to 12% health. Cooldown further reduced by artifact traits, making it one of more frequently used defensives. Guardian of Ancient Kings: 5 min CD. Reduces all damage by 50% for 8 sec. Due to increased CD one of the more tactical cooldowns, yet still one of the strongest. Lay on Hands: 10 min CD. Heals for your maximum health. Longest cooldown of all defensive abilities, making it generally a last resort spell. Can also be cast on allies to prevent death. Eye of Tyr: 1 min CD. Artifact ability, causes damage around you, and reduces damage taken from those enemies by 25% for 9 seconds. Important to make sure that the dmg you want to reduce is cast by the target being affected and it’s not too far away. Divine Shield: 5 min CD. Prevents all damage for 8 seconds, but removes all threat for the duration. Important to taunt the target right before casting in order to get 3 sec of aggro on the boss in single target situations, dangerous to use in AoE without final stand. Flash of Light: 16% max mana, 1.5 sec cast time no cd. Heal to top yourself off while questing, has little use while in combat outside of possibly healing yourself when out of range of healers or sitting in Divine Shield. Talents Level 15 - Tier 1 Holy Shield: (Passive) Increases your block chance, allows you to block spells, and your successful blocks deal Holy damage to your attacker. Mostly used for defensive reasons, especially against dots. Problematic to use against magic nuke’s as you can not rely on it activating. Blessed Hammer: Throws a Blessed Hammer that spirals outward, dealing Holy damage to enemies that it hits, and causing them to deal 15% less damage to you on their next auto attack. Highest DPS talent in the row, and the best one for survival vs physical damage. Can hit same target multiple times, applying damage reduction each time. Spins Clockwise. Consecrated Hammer: (Passive) Hammer of the Righteous has no cooldown. Hammer of the Righteous, Shield of the Righteous, and Light of the Protector now always gain the benefit of Consecration. Not particularly useful unless you want a faster rotation, or experience issues picking up mobs with baseline abilities. Level 30 - Tier 2 First Avenger: (Passive) Increases the damage of Avenger's Shield by 50%, and increases the chance for its remaining cooldown to be reset by abilities and talents by 50%, but it now hits only 1 target. Possibly useful on single target fight if you need extra constant survival, but fairly weak on anything else. Bastion Of Light: 3 min CD - Immediately grants 3 charges of Shield of the Righteous. Good synergy for burst set up, especially if used with Seraphim. General go-to talent in multi-target (AoE) and single target. Crusader’s Judgment: (Passive) Judgment can also trigger Grand Crusader. Can be a dps gain in large scale AoE situations, where those enemies aren’t attacking you. Not very useful. Level 45 - Tier 3 Fist of Justice: (Passive) Judgment reduces the remaining cooldown on Hammer of Justice by 10 sec. Can be useful if encounter has stunnable adds. Repentance: Forces an enemy target to meditate, incapacitating the target and dealing up to a maximum of 25% of the target's health in damage over 1 min. Soft Crowd Control (CC) that slowly deals damage. Doesn’t have a lot of use. Blinding Light: Emits dazzling light in all directions, blinding enemies within 10 yards, dealing Holy damage and causing them to wander disoriented for 6 sec. Non-Holy damage will break the disorient effect. Instant damage and AoE CC. Due to most abilities (Except Auto Attacks and primary target HotR) dealing holy damage, can keep mobs CCed for the entire duration, while you continue to do damage. Level 60 - Tier 4 Blessing of Spellwarding: Places a blessing on a party or raid member, protecting them from all magical attacks for 10 sec. Similar to Hand of Protection, which it replaces, except instead of Physical damage it prevents Magical damage. Cavalier: (Passive) Divine Steed has 2 charges. Fairly good for mobility. Retribution Aura: (Passive) You deal Holy damage to any enemy whose melee attack strikes a non-tank party or raid member within 60 yards. Due to only reacting to AAs, has very limited usage outside of specific cases - mobs fixating on targets and AAing them. Level 75 - Tier 5 Hand of the Protector: Calls down the Light to heal a friendly target for 25% of the target's missing health. Reduces CD and allows you to cast LotP on other players. Knight Templar: (Passive) Reduces the cooldown of Divine Steed by 50% and reduces all damage taken while mounted on your Divine Steed by 20%. Good if you require extra mobility, or if you need a 20% DR cooldown with frequent access. Final Stand: (Passive) When you use Divine Shield, you also taunt all targets within 15 yards for 8 sec. Questionably usable talent, which is likely only to be needed if you need AoE taunt. Level 90 - Tier 6 Aegis of Light: 5 Min CD - Channels an Aegis of Light that protects you and all allies standing within 10 yards behind you for 6 sec, reducing all damage taken by 20%. Awkward placement and long CD, but can be useful in some fights. Judgment of Light: (Passive) Judgment now applies Judgment of Light to the target, causing the next 40 successful attacks against the target to heal the attacker. Low healing, but can help people not tick down from weakest dmg. Generally the go to talent in tier. Consecrated Ground: (Passive) Up to 6 allies standing within your Consecration receive healing every sec, and enemies within your Consecration have 50% reduced movement speed. Even lower healing than JoL, and only works on melee, but can be useful if you need to kite adds on a fight. Level 100 - Tier 7 Righteous Protector: (Passive) Shield of the Righteous reduces the remaining cooldown on Light of the Protector and Avenging Wrath by 3 sec. Default talent on ST fights, or anything with adds not lasting a long time. Also works with HotP, which allows you to use it very frequently. Seraphim:The Light temporarily magnifies your power, increasing your Haste, Critical Strike, Mastery, and Versatility. Consumes up to 2 charges of Shield of the Righteous, and lasts 8 sec per charge. Extremely useful for dps, but not that effective for survival. Can be used with partial SotR charges. Last Defender: (Passive) Each enemy within 8 yards reduces the damage that you take and increases the damage that you deal by 3%. Good on multi-target fights, or anything with large packs of adds that are clumped together.Liminara179 Oct 20
Oct 14 Retribution (7.0.3) - Updated 8/4/16 ____________________________________________________________________ Retribution, an In-Depth Guide for PvE (7.0.3) Most recent update: 8/4/2016 ____________________________________________________________________ NOTICE - 8/11/16: I will not be supporting this guide throughout the Legion expansion due to time-consuming developments in school & career requiring most of my focus. After maintaining this thread for so long, it's difficult to just stop, but I will not have time to stay on top of everything that happens in the Retribution community for a while. I will continue to lurk on the forums and be around in-game (and in the Paladin Discord!) to answer questions, but perhaps not quite as often. Thankfully, this is far from the only Retribution Paladin resource! I greatly suggest following Rebdull's Retribution guide on Wowhead, which is updated for level 110 ( Thete's video guides are also a good source of information for those who prefer that format ( Furthermore, you should make use of the Paladin Discord. All of the information you'll need for that can be located here: Fight on, my beautiful /hairflipping Paladin brothers and sisters. (╯°□°)╯ ____________________________________________________________________ ... This is a Retribution Paladin DPS guide focused on providing a thorough understanding of the spec. This guide is a constant WIP and is being edited regularly. Check back often for updates. This guide is made possible by the collective efforts of the Paladin theorycrafting community, especially Solsacra and mserrano. While generally accepted as correct, much of the information provided here is ultimately theoretical and should be taken as suggestion, not gospel. Changes are noted in the change log (post 11). Thank you and have a nice day. :) ____________________________________________________________________ Author Information I am currently playing as Chrissinger (formerly: Svayne, Qris) @ US-Area 52. Paladin since Wrath, Retribution since Cataclysm. I maintained this guide since March 2011, but am not currently supporting it for Legion. The easiest way to get my attention is via Twitter @mfwchris. ____________________________________________________________________ Table of Contents ____________________________________________________________________ • X ... Glossary • 1 ... What's new in Legion? • 2 ... Talents • 3 ... Rotation - 3.1 ... Single Target - 3.2 ... Multiple Target - 3.3 ... Cooldown Usage • 4 ... Greater Blessings • 5 ... Utility - 5.1 ... Defensive - 5.2 ... Healing Spells - 5.3 ... Blessings - 5.4 ... Miscellaneous • 6 ... Tier Set Bonuses • 7 ... Gearing - 7.1 ... Stat Priority - 7.2 ... Gems - 7.3 ... Enchants • 8 ... Consumables • 9 ... Races - 9.1 ... Alliance - 9.2 ... Horde • 10 .. Mechanics • 11 .. Addons & Macros - 11.1 .. Addons - 11.2 .. WeakAuras • 12 .. Frequently Asked ?s • 13 .. Other Resources • 14 .. Change Log ____________________________________________________________________ Glossary ____________________________________________________________________ AtA .... Ashes to Ashes AW .... Avenging Wrath BoF .... Blessing of Freedom BoJ .... Blade of Justice BoP .... Blessing of Protection BoW .... Blade of Wrath CD .... Cooldown CS .... Crusader Strike DI .... Divine Intervention DP .... Divine Purpose DS .... Divine Storm (or Divine Shield) EfaE .... Eye for an Eye EotH .... Echo of the Highlord ES .... Execution Sentence FoJ .... Fist of Justice FoL .... Flash of Light FV .... Final Verdict GBoK .... Greater Blessing of Kings GBoM .... Greater Blessing of Might GBoW .... Greater Blessing of Wisdom GCD .... Global Cooldown GJ .... Greater Judgment HoJ .... Hammer of Justice HoPo .... Holy Power HW .... Holy Wrath JV .... Justicar's Vengeance LoH .... Lay on Hands SoL .... Seal of Light SoV .... Shield of Vengeance TFoJ .... The Fires of Justice TV .... Templar's Verdict WoA .... Wake of Ashes WoG .... Word of Glory ____________________________________________________________________Svayne778 Oct 14
Sep 22 Complete Paladin Transmogrifier Gear Guide <><><><><><> <><><><><><> <><><><><><> What is Transmogrification? "The Ethereals, emerging from the nether, will bring with them a new technology they call Transmogrification. They’re heading to the capital cities of Azeroth to set up shop and to offer adventurers a unique service -- copying the appearance of one magical item onto another. They only ask for a modest gold donation to recoup their costs." From what we have been told, an item can be re-skinned into an older, maybe cooler looking, piece of equipment. Example: "Tier 12 to look like Tier 2" What can be Transmogrified? "Placing an item into the Transmogrifier interface will offer a preview of how the item will appear once the change is applied. However, not all item pairings are compatible with Transmogrification. In general, only items that have stats can be used in the transmogrification process. You must also be able to wear both items when using this service. Ethereals don’t have much in the way of ethics, but allowing someone to appear as if they’re equipping unusable items crosses the line." Example: Plate to Plate; Mace to Mace; Staff to Staff; etc, etc. Wait! We can not modify Immolation Faceguard to Crown of Destruction? No. It is a safe assumption that the designers do not want cloth casters to appear as plate wearers or vice versa. This also includes set items such as "Warlock," "Hunter," "Mage," and "Shaman." Example: As a Paladin we can not wear Death Knight armor sets, but we can find same model items to transmogrify to. That is why this thread is being created - after all. A Short Note: Items will be required to have stats as well, Ethereals will not waste their time on Frost-Rimed Cloth Hat or Weather Beaten Buckler. This could be changed down the road, if business looks promising. A Short Note: Thunderfury, Blessed Blade of the Windseeker, Shadowmourne, or Sulfuras, Hand of Ragnaros will not be able to be transmogrified at initial launch. The complexity of these magical items currently surpass the knowledge held by the Ethereals. A Short Note: Tired of leveling in that old dusty Bind on Account gear? Well do not worry, BoA gear can be transmogrified! It is important to understand that transmogrified gear is character side only. You can not transmogrify your gear, mail it to an alt and look like you're in Tier 12 at level 10. But you are more than welcome to collect quest items, build an outfit, and transmogrify at your hearts content! A Short Note: Weapon art will be the only thing that is transmogrified. If you have a weapon with Power Torrent and transmogrify it to another weapon with, say crusader, the transmogrified weapon will show up with Power Torrent. <><><><><><> <><><><><><> <><><><><><> ... <><><><><><> <><><><><><> <><><><><><> All ideas, armor sets, and unique weapons are welcome! Start bragging about your favorite armor configurations! A Short Note: The Dark Moon will be bringing back some novelty items in 4.3; so get ready for some skee ball and collect those tickets! PvP Gear and Tier 3 is likely returning.[/i] Duplicate skins shared on two or more items will be listed in order of ease to acquire. <><><><><><> <><><><><><> <><><><><><> Ðj323 Sep 22
Oct 26, 2010 Welcome Paladins: Please Read! Welcome to the Paladin forum! This forum is here to provide you with a friendly environment where you can discuss the paladin class with your fellow World of Warcraft players. Community forums work best when participants treat their fellow posters with respect and courtesy, so we ask that you take the time to read through the forum Code of Conduct ( and guidelines ( before posting. Important Reminders: Search The search function at the top of the World of Warcraft community site is extremely effective and robust. Before you create a new forum topic, please be use it to search for similar topics, blog posts, or web pages that may contain the answer for which you are looking. Making a new thread on an existing subject can result in your thread being deleted or, if you continue to re-post the same content, the loss of your forum privileges for spamming. Rating The forum rating system can be used to promote positive discussion, demote unhelpful comments, and even report posts that violate the forum Code of Conduct. By hovering over a post you'll be presented with several options, including a "thumbs up" (Like) and a "thumbs down" (Dislike) icon. Clicking the "thumbs up" icon will rate the post up. If enough people like a post, it will gain a Highly Rated status and appear at the top of related search results. Highly Rated posts will also have a highlighted background. Clicking the "thumbs down" icon will expand a drop-down menu which will include "Dislike," "Trolling, "Spam" and "Report" options. "Dislike" will rate the post down. If enough people dislike a post, it will be darkened, and with a lot of dislikes it will be hidden completely. You can also quickly report a post as trolling or spam, or use the report function to fill out a more comprehensive description of a violation. Please note that you can only rate each post once. Use your power wisely to help foster a positive and helpful forum community. Have fun posting on these forums, and good luck with your adventures in Azeroth!Lylirra1 Oct 26, 2010
3m Ret Talent Builds with Legendary Cloak So, I'm looking at most builds, and they are saying that once you get Wrath of the Ashbringer unlocked on your Artifact we want to use Crusade as the 110 Talent Point choice. However I am fortunate enough to have the Legendary Cloak Wrath of the Nathrezim. So is there anyone out there who has done the Sims, and is keeping Diving Purpose for more Templar's Verdict or Divine Storm procs more DPS with the cloak. Or should I be taking crusade? Second Question: Does this mean now with the cloak I should be staying away from Justicars Vengeance, the lvl 75 Talent, and using Eye for an Eye or Word of Glory. Seeing as how the tooltip on the cloak or the buff says nothing of increasing Justicars Vengeance damage as well.Keionys0 3m
11m Paladins! Rate Thy Transmog! +5 We capped another one! Keep it going.Gordrakus234 11m
21m Tips on Defeating WW Monks Hey all, I am looking for some tips on how to defeat WW monks. What talents and PvP talents work best and also what abilities to use for counters? I know do not attack through karma but I have a hard time surviving the burst they have. They leg sweep stun me and then first of fury stuns and the artifcact ability hits like a truck and then just run away and reset and repeat lol, I just cannot seem to winSouthadin2 21m
38m How is Versatility viewed? I was wondering, and I might as well ask you all this. I was thinking of a haste>Vers> crit based armor build. The idea is to focus more on Vers to have a more sustained damage output while still keeping some crit for a little burst. I'm not an RNG fan , so I wanted to ask. Also if this is not optimal please explain why. Last I read on here that Vers was about even to crit as far as secondary stats go. Your input is much appreciated.Davvald10 38m
52m First RBGs after my faction change All my friends moved over to horde and i decided to join them. This is my first rbg as horde.Trebabe2 52m
59m Better Ret Talent Changes So after a long hiatus I have returned to my friends and guild. Legion honestly gives me that same good feeling I had when I played in WotLK. But I have a few ideas that I would share as to reinforce the "Sword of the Light" theme of the class. Tier 15 Talents - so I REALLY liked the idea of Execution Sentence but it doesn't truly feel like what it is called. To make it competitive with the other talents, have the ability have a multiplier to damage done during the sentence which adds to the ability's damage when it hits(i.e. ES does # damage +Damage done during proc×holy power spent to cast). -Change consecration into Exorcism because it is sorely missed and conseccration is for tanks. Honestly this ability was SO iconic to the class and I loved it. I would also change it a bit to be used as more of an execute(i.e. more damage done to weak targets). It wouldn't work or "Activate" until that condition is met(exceptions later). *these changes would make us the players agonize over which ability to take.(because now we have a sustain, a burst, and an execute) Tier 30 Talents- are good, no changes (the design team nailed this tier) Tier 45 Talents-also no changes Tier 60 Talents -Virtues Blade needs a slight change albeit a simple one to bring it in line with the other two talents. If the ability misses it's critical proc it places a holy damage DOT called Ire. *now each talent in the tier arguably has it's own strength. Tier 75 Talents- are good and each has it's own utility to help groups. Tier 90 Talents -I really dislike Seal of Light and it doesn't add anything that anyone wants in it's current iteration. Increase the buff to like 40% movement speed and just require 1 holy power for the full 2 minute effect. OR you could also change it to buff your buffs and give your paladin a speed boost(i.e. spend 5 holy power and share your greater blessings with the group for 5 minutes [must spend 3 or more holy power to activate and cannot happen more than once. Inflicts "Drained" 5 minute debuff that starts after Seal of Light wears off]) *doing this just adds to the class over all. Now my HUGE change Tier 100 Talents -Divine Purpose you now know your purpose in life, walking with confidence only the most devout to the Light posess. Now increases all chance based proc abilities to happen more frequently. Also allows for Exorcism to proc outside of it's target's low health condition. Word of Glory now can also proc with no incurred penalty and no holy power spent. -Crusade is fine as it is, do not change it. -Holy Wrath Fills the Paladin with Visions of Greatness and Power{you become the Hammerdin}. Replaces Avenging Wrath. Judgements now have a 75% reduced cooldown and stack a debuff called "Repent". Every hammer does more damage than the last as your enemies feel the weight of their sins as Judgements are cast upon them. Repent also rewards "Vindication" if you are able to cast X number of hammers during Holy Wrath. This Buff increases damage done and healing done by and received by the Paladin for X Minutes. *my goal/idea with this tier is that they should be signature keystones to the class and it's playstyle. And they add much to the class's fantasy of being a Zealot, a Devout, and a Crusader. I sincerely hope people find this a good read(or at least thought provoking). I am just SUPER passionate about Retribution Paladins.Holywarden0 59m
1h 7.1 Blade of Wrath Assessment There's no point in complaining about it, it's here and not leaving for a bit. So might as well mess with it and see where the chips have fallen right? Right. In that vein, I did a little preliminary testing. Let's skip simulation and theory craft and go straight to the training dummy! The results are, well...weird at a glance. (TL;DR at bottom) First I did a control test with Virtue's blade. Usual method I use for testing things, I built up 5 Holy Power, dove at the target dummy in the Order Hall and proceeded to give it Hell for the span of 2 Crusades from use until the end of the second Crusade's cool down (Roughly 4 minutes), then stopped. I logged: 25 Blade of Justice strikes 92 TV strikes 46 Judgments 62 Crusader Strikes 219,172 DPS 54,444,482 total damage dealt Felt like a pretty good control run, nothing too wonky happened so I figure it's good enough for comparison. With the old BoW you would in theory log %33 more Blade of Just strikes, or 32-33. Which would be 14-16 Holy Power and 4 to 5 more TV uses. So now we flip over to Blade of Wrath and see what happens. First run felt pretty solid, but it dragged on a little long. The numbers looked like: 34 Blade of Justice 90 TV (Dunno wtf happened here...) 46 Judgment 58 Crusader Strikes 235,106 DPS 57,264,713 total damage dealt Maybe I was a little too focused on hitting BoJ on CD and missed some TV opportunities? The second run felt wrong. There were a few times where TV just would not go off due to lag or something and I got a bit sidetracked so it dragged on a few seconds longer than I wanted. I think I also hit the second Crusade any rate, the results were: 34 Blade of Justice 107 TV (That's more like it!) 48 Judgment 62 Crusader Strike 218,559 DPS 58,202,295 total damage done Still, I didn't like how that test ran, so I went for a third string. No late Crusades or weird lag delays on this run: 36 Blade of Justice 105 TV 46 Judgment 62 Crusader Strike 218,660 DPS 58,495,803 Total Damage done So let's do a little assessment. First total damage - Some of those ran on longer than they should've by around 10 seconds. The widest gap is 5 mil and came out to around 18 seconds if you divide by 220K, smaller gaps came out to 12 seconds, so I don't think that's a worthwhile value to look at. But it was interesting and in the interest of full disclosure I included it. So, Approximately 9 more Blade of Justice casts, 18 Holy Power, or 6 more Templar's Verdicts. But we're seeing a difference of 10. Well, 10 seconds 2-3 TV in and of itself, plus getting warmed up and more into the groove and maybe a little sloppy and using it between judgment windows...yeah, the extra 4 can easily be explained away. I think the fact that with Virtue's Blade Blade of Justice was critting for 625K compared to TV Critting at 520K (+52K Echo of the Highlord) covers the DPS gap that would be made by simply doing more TV strikes. Which would explain the lack of DPS difference in 2/3 runs. I think the first go with the new Blade of Wrath was just an outlier with a few lucky crits or something. Everything else is inline with the control run right down to the number of auto attacks. I don't much care for the way it plays. Very much feast or famine, like DP. There were strings during Crusade where I would be hitting TV > BoJ > TV > BoJ > TV BoJ > TV it would proc so much. Then there were droughts where you'd be waiting 8 or 9 seconds for the button to light up, sometimes in succession - defeats the entire purpose. But at the very least it doesn't seem to be a nerf to the amount of Holy Power the ability generated over time. On another note, using VB with the slowed down rotation obviously leaves you with time where CS, Judgment, and BoW are all on CD with no Holy Power for TV. This makes it easier to work in things like consecration (I know, I know...lolconsecration) without it getting in the way of building and spending holy Power. Interestingly enough, the same can be said for BoW, but to a lesser degree. *Unfortunately most of this was in my prot gear because I forgot to change it out. Which means my haste rating is low for the test. I've been flirting with high Versatility and other things that are simply not optimal for Ret. The good news is, this means offense oriented trinkets with procs weren't a factor in the results. And the results of the 1 run each I did in my actual Ret gear pretty much mirrored what I saw in my Prot set anyway, just with higher values. And 10K lower DPS for Blade of Wrath, but I don't really know how much damage it dealt on the dummy before the patch, nor how much it dealt in comparison to VB since I never used it. TL;DR - Blade of Wrath is different, but not objectively worse unless A: you miss it doing Holy Damage or B: Hate it being RNG off your auto attacks. It's also not really better than it was before, unless procs from auto attacks are happy fun time for you. It builds roughly the same amount of Holy Power as it used to. And it isn't a large difference plus or minus from VB. At least not with my gear, talents, and skill (personally assessed average at best). YMMV. Some restrictions may apply.Vafarre24 1h
1h Justice Gaze. Is there any use for this "legendary". The damage and cooldown portions only apply at above 75%, and it doesn't work in PvP. Someone help me find a silver lining!Càpz5 1h
1h Holy wrath bugged? Holy wrath 35% dmg to player seem abit bugged. I test dmg on my friend which I had 2100k hp ,he drop my hp down to 250k,I cast hw to him and he only get 44xk dmg. 1850k x 35% = 647.5k and I only get 44xk dmg ,I wonder its tooltips bugged or wat?Shinrrai0 1h
1h Prot opinion on Tier 7 (last talent choice) Righteous Protector: causes your Shield of the Righteous Icon Shield of the Righteous casts to reduce the remaining cooldown of Light of the Protector Icon Light of the Protector and Avenging Wrath Icon Avenging Wrath by 3 seconds. Seraphim: Active ability with a 30-second cooldown. It increases your Haste, Critical Strike, Mastery, and Versatility by 4881, and it lasts 8 seconds per charge of Shield of the Righteous Icon Shield of the Righteous available when using it, consuming the charges in the process. It can consume up to 2 charges. Last Defender: Causes you to take 3% reduced damage and deal 3% increased damage for each enemy within an 8-yard radius around you. For me, it comes down to Last Defender (LD) or Righteous Protector (RP). Seraphim is neat for burst damage, but that's not my job. So ultimately does it come down to if I'm tanking a lot of enemies (LD) or the boss (RP)? What do you think, random internet people whom I share a class with?Fyddy11 1h
1h Holy Relics It doesn't seem to matter what my loot spec is set to. I am getting tons of arcane and iron relics, but haven't seen a holy relic for many weeks. It's odd that 5 of our 9 relic slots are holy, but yet, the odds are severely Against me in getting a holy relic, let alone one that would be decent for my level. When it hit 110, hell, I had to buy a holy relic because none would drop for me. Is this consistent for everyone else? How are more than half our slots holy, but it's the rarest of relic to drop?Wingnut4 1h
1h Tips for Endless Damage Proving Grounds? So I'm trying to get "The Proven Assailant" title. I have been making attempts for weeks and sometimes hours at a time and the best I could ever do was wave 20. Am I missing something? Is their some trick to it that I don't know? I have wasted so many flasks and food buffs. Its not like my damage is bad either. I am extremely competitive with other DPS classes some of which have much higher ilevels than me. None of the guides I find seem to help either since they are all pre-legion and things were a lot different then. WHAT AM I DOING WRONG?! WHY IS THIS SO IMPOSSIBLE?! I'M RIPPING MY HAIR OUT OVER IT! Any tips will be appreciated!Exaria2 1h
1h Divine hammer might be bugged? Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Divine Hammer's CD lowered by haste before? It no longer seems to be with 7.1.. It's duration is still sped up by haste, but the cooldown itself is stuck at 12s.Divenity6 1h
1h Holly pally gearing question So I understand the stat priority for Holly Pally is Int>Crit>Vers>Mast>Haste. Is this correct? Every piece of gear I am getting all has massive amounts of haste on it. At what point should I replace a piece of gear if it has a higher ilvl or int but no crit rate? What should I be aiming for in matters of crit and vers?Hemeroids3 1h
2h Best Ret Legendaries? The best legendaries for ret?Flyessbacker8 2h
3h Blade of Wrath Aura Can blade of wrath get an aura pop up for when it procs thank youLucarìo8 3h
3h Ret Trinkets (BIS)? I just got Ursoc's paw Heroic and Natures Call Heroic, after looking over the logs from our heroic raid last night it seems that Ursoc's equip is seriously broken 1.85M damage on Xavius doesn't seem strong at all when my neck enchant does 2.85M.. With that said, what do y'all think our BIS trinkets are?Nerdstomper82 3h
3h Old judgement of justice I was in a bg and a pally hit me with what looked like, and felt like the old judgement of justice. Can anyone enlighten me on what this is? I don't think it was hinderance as it seemed as though it was re applied every judgement?Shadowkick1 3h
4h Speccing Artifact RET Ok so i have enough points spent that if I do it right I can get to my second gold trait on my artifact. Question here is this. Is the extra swing and 10% one or the buff to DS one better overall? I am pretty much losing out of my healing spot in guild runs in mythical and I want to perform well in those so that being said you Mythic+ runners how are you setting up your ash bringer?Ahndariel2 4h
4h Class Hall set bonuses worth it? I just unlocked my 8th piece of the class hall set and I'm wondering if it's worth keeping the set together for the 6 and 8 piece bonuses (+500 str and chance of CS to get a 12 sec 2000 haste buff respectively) vs replacing the poorly itemized pieces for better ones. Any suggestions? I'm sitting at 20.5% crit and 28% haste as is.Valshaw9 4h
4h Paladin Third Arifact Slot Questline - stuck! Hi, I cannot work out how to progress. I only have 2 followers so I must have missed the 103 questline but nothing showing up at Lights Hope nor Dalaran, nor my incomplete quests re Paladin. Can someone help me find out where I have got wrong? thxArcheal5 4h
4h Greater Blessings need to change. 9+% of Ret's DPS being reliant on 3 people who's actions are beyond our control, and may die or underperform resulting in a DPS loss for the paladin is just awful... It's nothing more than an annoyance for the sake of "class fantasy", when that fantasy doesn't even make sense for the spec they gave it to (makes 1,000% more sense for Holy)... Buffs were removed from every other class and spec for a good reason, that reason being ability bloat, they should be gone from Ret too. At the very least GBoM needs to be removed, as a zero sum buff that brings nothing to the group it is the very definition of ability bloat. 1 hour fire and forget buffs that by design mean we are less powerful personally do not build engaging or compelling gameplay, they are not fun, and most importantly belong in a support spec, not a DPS spec like Retribution... Get rid of them, please. I would really, really like to see people continue to voice their dislike of this system, we were vocal about it in Alpha and Beta, but we need to continue to tell them that we don't like this junk... I know it's disheartening when we voice our concerns and are met with silence, but that doesn't mean we stop speaking, it means we need to speak louder. Edit: Update: I am currently most in favor of removing only Might and buff our personal damage 10%, Kings and Wisdom stay in the game, maybe with some slight buffs to make them not feel so weak. This accomplishes three things: 1.people who like the buffing aspect can continue to buff people. 2. now it's purely utility and doesn't tax our personal DPS which allows us to actually use Kings and Wisdom. 3. Maintains Blizzard's buffing "class fantasy", so they don't have to feel like they are scrapping the whole system, which should make it easier for them to remove the one blessing that is the most problematic by far, Might. This is not what I want the most personally, I would prefer all Greater Blessings be removed from the game entirely, but since BoM is by far the biggest problem and this IS the most likely to succeed way to get BoM removed if pushed at blizzard, I favor pushing this idea at Blizzard instead of something they would likely never agree to.Divenity222 4h
4h Can someone teach me the basic? (tank) Can someone teach me to tank? like what skills to use when luring an enemy in a dungeon with a group. and what stats should i go for equips? By the way i'm level 22 paladin. And thanks in advance :) Sorry for my bad english.Linkcage10 4h
4h Can't seem to decide So I'm really stuck between enhancement shaman and ret pally. They both seem extremely fun and seem to scale well. What are your guys opinionsIñfamous4 4h
4h Racial Mount for Dwarf Paladins Hello everyone, I'll make this short and sweet. As a Dwarf and a proud member of the Paladin order I find it odd that no Rams have yet to be blessed into the Holy army. I've seen Horses, Elleks and I could have sworn I even saw a Holy Kodo! Me and the lads would really appreciate a holy charger that we have more experience with...and the Warrior clans have been mocking us for ages! They say we want to be humans! Thanks for your time.Magnus61 4h
4h Retribution Paladin Rotation and Talents 7.1 What is your average DPS and what is your rotation? A couple of weeks ago, many of you helped me in perfecting my retribution paladin rotation to make up for supposed lost DPS. With your help, you were able to help me increase my DPS by 30k. For the old thread, see: Now that 7.1 has come out and retribution paladins have seen some changes in how certain talents and skills function, I think we need to revisit the rotation and also look at the talents. Talents I have selected as of 7.1 Edit October 27, 2016: Berith's combat log ( shows that Blade of Justice can be cast almost double the amount of time when Blade of Wrath is selected. Therefore, it looks like the 7.03 meta of only choosing Virtue's Blade when critical strike breaks 30% still exists despite the Blade of Wrath changes. Tier 1: Final Verdict Tier 2: The Fires of Justice Tier 3: Blinding Light Tier 4: Blade of Wrath Tier 5: Eye for an Eye Tier 6: Divine Intervention Tier 7: Crusade My Current Rotation Edit October 26, 2016: Changed the prefight to recognize that you can in fact cast Blessing of Might on up to 3 different players, rather than only being able to cast one of each Greater Blessing total. Prefight: Flask of Countless Armies, Defiled Augment Rune, The Hungry Magister, and 3 Greater Blessing of Might buffed onto the top 3 DPS. During countdown: Potion of the Old War 1. Ashes to Ashes 2. Judgment 3. Crusade, Ravaged Seed Pod 4. Templar's Verdict 5. a.) If no interrupts really needed in the fight, then Arcane Torrent 5. b.) If interrupts are anticipated, Crusader Strike 6. Templar's Verdict 7. Blade of Justice 8. Crusader Strike 9. Crusader Strike If Judgment not quite off cooldown and the debuff is gone from the mob, I sneak in another Templar's Verdict. 10. Repeat After the fight has already started, I try to time Potion of the Old War and Ravaged Seed Pod for whenever I use crusade, which may be whenever it is ready or when we are expecting to lust. Use Shield of Vengeance when expecting any kind of damage that needs absorbed. Use Eye for an Eye when expecting physical damage (e.g. Ursoc charge). If those are on cool down (or the damage is a great deal greater than what will be absorbed) then use Blessing of Protection. Use rebuke or arcane torrent as interrupts on an as needed basis. Combat log from 7.1 Heroic Emerald Nightmare and mythic 7.1 Halls of Valor The problem I'm running into right now is cooldowns. In the old rotation, it was very rare when I was in a situation where All of my abilities are on cooldown and I am below 3 Holy Power. Since 7.1, I've noticed that there are several occasions where I am waiting for Ashes to Ashes, Crusader Strike, or Blade of Justice to go off cool down and be not have enough Holy Power to use Templar's Verdict or Divine Storm. That being said, I'm not really seeing much of a DPS difference from before, yet I feel overall the rotation feels wrong having those periods of being unable to use an attack.Rennis27 4h
4h Holy Paladin Belts So, with 7.1, has anyone else noticed that Blizz has 'fixed' our belt issue? Instead of moving the libram, when transmogging, key features of belts simply DON'T LOAD IN. Clipping? Not a problem. Libram? Still awkwardly stuck to our chest/belly I feel as though this is a 'monkey's paw' type wish fulfilment.Kelorillian0 4h
5h Holy paladin Mythic +6 help So as the topic says i need a little insight to make myself better. Raids are not an issue, my guild is looking to push high-end 6+ mythic content and i seem to cap out at like 6-7. I know what stats i need. i know what gear to get. Im 22 points into my weapon. but even in mythic 6 i struggle. i recently started using BoV (which i hate) to help with aoe heals. not reallly sure what else i need to be doing. i dont have any logs to show. i need to get on that. but like...ive done my research. i feel i know my class very well. using all of my abilities on cd (that need to be). im frusterated that i cant progress like i want to. averaging anywhere from 200-300k hps depending on fight.Coehabamba6 5h
5h Ret DPS Nerfs Why? Were we crushing the meters too hard, or what? This seems bizarre.Towely264 5h
5h Corrupted rememberance bug. I have access to the "kill 1000 players" skin... Problem is I have not unlocked the base skin. I have completed the kill 1000 players for the Prot hidden skin, but it seems to have carried over to the other specs for some reason. I did not have access to it before 7.1. Can anyone else who has NOT unlocked corrupted rememberence via the "quest", but has the prot or holy hidden apperance and has done the 1000 player kills task please check if this has happened for you as well? Need to figure out if this is isolated to me or not.Divenity1 5h
5h Open Libram CLV: "Sweet Winter's Veil" ... Previous Libram: Libram Archive: Paladin Social Networking: My Little Ponydins by Lobster: Vanilla Ret Pally "Melgibsmash": ____________________________________________________ Title theme: Kind of glad world quest objectives pile up over time, I've been binging the hell out of Luke Cage this weekend.Snozberries144 5h
6h Do multiple GBoM stack? If two Paladins put Greater Blessing of Might on one target that target will have two GBoM buffs. Do they both function? Is there some kind of ICD to its proc?Exaria12 6h
6h Ret help - pitiful low damage Hi there In only able to do around 175k single target on the raid dummy. I have stup if high crit and stupid low haste, because I just hit 110 last week and haven't had good luck with drops. Will increasing my haste to 20%+ help me, or is it just an ilevel thing? For reference, my frost dk before 7.1 buffs at 855 could already sustain 245k st. I can't even get to 200k. Or am I just doing it wrong? I am saving spenders for judgement windows.Salhezar6 6h
6h Holy Paladin Mastery = not fun The holy paladin mastery is not fun. No other healer is forced to be in close proximity to the target they are healing in order to be effective. Can we get a rework of our mastery into something that isn't retarded and limiting?Apothus70 6h
6h Trying to find an alt to play Hey guys, I've been trying to decide what to level to 110 to play as an alt. I have it down to monk and pally because I want to be able to do some tanking and healing. How are you guys liking paladins atm? Used to be my main back in cata so I'm guessing a whole lot has changed.Gríz9 6h
7h Prot Pally Stat Weights So I'm finding myself at a point now where I feel like gear wise i'm in the middle of where I should be filling more dps gear in for surv gear. That being said I've been seeing a lot of varying opinions on how stats are being weighted. Anyone have any input so I can better plan upgrades and pieces to seek out? TL;DR: Planning upgrades. Opinions on which types of pieces should I look for? Last Nights Logs: 7h
7h Anyone else play DP? Hey, wanted to see if there was anyone else out there playing DP main for Raid and Dungeon content. Current Build: - Emp Judge or Fires of Justice Note: Emp judge is out of raid content, for all raid content I always divert to fires of justice to kill gaps in rotation. - Blade of Wrath or Virtues Blade Note: I combine each one with a specific talent listed above, I only use Virtues Blade if I'm running Fires of Justice and Blade of Wrath with Emp Judgment. Trinkets: 860 Arcano Crystal 860 Flat primary Stat w/ Versatility on use ( 1 min ) socketed Stat distribution: Haste - 15% Crit - 30% Mastery - 27% Versa - 11% Note: so the 860 flat stat is really nice, the passive strength alone is really good and the 1 min cd synergy is unreal with it. So my overall experience with these build mixes seems to be very enjoyable, I really enjoy the gameplay and overall my damage has been really well off. Average damages between content isn't bad either I'm usually around a solid 300-330k in terms of DPS and spike upwards of 600k during burst. During extremely lucky RNG fests I get over 370k, but my low point for bad RNG sits at 300k. Anyone else been working on DP builds and testing? Would love to hear from other folksKained11 7h
7h paladin is better than enhancement I made enhancement for the procs of storm strikes! now that paladin has a proc with blade of wrath I am addicted to the gameplay thank youJaeronni6 7h
8h Holy - Versatility vs Mastery Good morning everyone, I am currently sitting at around 44% Crit in combat (Hellfire trinket). I am going to keep pushing that as close to 50% as I can. I noticed yesterday I have 0 Versatility, as I have been trying to get mostly Mastery as a secondary stat (Crit/Vers items never seem to drop for me). Could this be an issue? Will making an effort to get SOME versatility help my healing even though it's tied with mastery in our priority behind crit?Faiinxx8 8h
8h Drape of Shame- Holy **** So I just wrapped up my kara attunement and was scrolling through the loot tables for holy when i saw Drape of Shame ( Am I missing something here, or is that effect absolutely bonkers for holy paladins? A flat 10% increase to all critical healing seems on par or better than most of the hpali legendaries. Is there a caveat? If not I assume this is automatic BiS, even at the baseline ilvl.Crabgill15 8h
8h Withered Training Bug So if you spec into auto bubble and actually let it work as intended it will end your withered training scenario... GG blizz.Wetrobrute0 8h
9h Love the changes I love how the changes feel with both ret and prot paladins. More buttons to hit is exactly what I felt this class needed. I'm even thinking of focusing more on the paladin than my mage now. While I often have a ton of complaints about blizzard, I have to give them credit here. Good work guys and gals.Sanctûm1 9h
9h BIS - Heroic and LFR Hello Guys, I'm a casual player, so I don't think I will be ever stepping into Mythic content... so a question... Is there a place that I can see my BIS items for these difficulties? I just can find M+ and Raids on the mainstream sites... Do you have any gearing tips? Thanks a lot!Sunbro10 9h
10h Divine Hammer bugged? Anyone notice how divine hammer is now at a standard 12 second CD? Is this intended or is this a bug? It was originally affected by haste in 7.0, now it is not.Arkantion5 10h
10h Looking for competative prot pally advice Hello So I like to try for competative dps parses as prot while doing farm content. I'm looking for a highly skilled prot pally to give me some dips to push my dps even higher. I am already breaking the 96th percentile (for my ilvl bracket) but I want to push that to 99th or even 100th. I want to be very competative in this aspect of wow. Add me if you have tips Dynatrix#1292 *please don't respond with "you're a freaking tank, learn to mitigate damage scrub". Because this is for EN farm content onlyZôp3 10h