May 10, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011
Paladins and Auras. I wanted to talk about and see opinions on the different auras available to paladins. This is coming from a PVP ret and PVE prot. Devotion Aura: Provides about 4% physical damage reduction for a Ret pally it will differ on depending on armor for other classes. I think this is fine how it is has its uses for PVP and PVE great for tanking and those melee heavy arena teams. Retribution Aura: Hits for around 250 holy damage depending on gear. PVE it slightly increases damage done by the tank or whoever is being hit. I think this needs to be buffed or at least changed 250 isn't that much damage even with a relatively fast attacking melee opponent. Maybe an increase in damage, a different mechanic and maybe adding so it effects all attacks ranged and spells. Concentration Aura: Haven't used this aura much. Holy Paladins like this for the Aura Mastery use but other than that in a PVP situation I can't say its that great. From what I have witnessed most healers don't cast heals with a cast time with someone right on them unless they really have to. Maybe some type of change is needed? Resistance Aura: I really like this aura for both PVE and PVP. Its great for PVE encounters where there is a lot of shadow/fire/frost damage going out can prevent quite a bit of damage. As for in PVP I used to like it when lvling and pvping because it would help against the casters with those spell damage types but since 85 it really hasn't had much use in arena or BGs since most casters are spell pen capped. The only use it has is for the few that are not capped and the holy/disc priest who did not get any. I would like to see a flat 3-4% spell damage reduction from those schools that cannot be penetrated(only reduction not resists). It would be one reason to bring a paladin to rated BGs and arenas. I would like to be able to use this outside of PVE. Crusader Aura: This one is fine as is. It brings nothing to combat but that is how its intended. I am not a master at the paladin class these are just opinions and observations of myself. Any comments or ideas on the auras? Lysandër4
May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011
Inquisition Change Suggestion If you think from the thread title this will be a QQ post, please hit your back button. If you are open to ideas, please read on. ___________________________________________________________________________ Salutations, I have been a World of Warcraft player since early Vanilla, I have played many classes, but have always felt the most in-line with the Paladin. After becoming familiar and at ease with the Cataclysm adjustments to the Paladin class, Retribution in particular, something at odds with the feel of the class donned on me. That thing at odds would be the ability Inquisition. The reason for this is somewhat twofold. Firstly, Inquisitions implementation seems like it does not fit previously established paladin mechanics, it's a new ability that must be constantly managed. Secondly, it seems to me Inquisitions sole purpose is to boost Retribution damage enough so as it can be comparable to other classes, and competitive. I ask, would it be a bad thing to adjust Inquisition into a persistent aura, much like Righteous Fury is for Protection? Doing so would align Inquisition more with established Paladin mechanics (Righteous Fury), instead of a buff we must constantly watch and reapply every 30 seconds. As it is, it feels like Retribution must ask the game every thirty seconds if it can have the ability to do competitive damage. Whereas the other hybrid classes have their full damage potential at the beginning of a fight, Retribution must go above and beyond in order to be on even ground, which means they are already steps behind. It seems to me that this ability is at odds with the feel of the class, because of the above mentioned reasoning. I mean for this suggestion to the Blizzard Developers to be a constructive and mature one, and I have not talked about any other class in a negative way. I ask that in your replies, you continue the constructive and mature theme. My thanks for your time in reading this, One of your humble Paladins, Wayside – Sisters of Elune Wayside11
May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011
My Status Report. This was a triumph. I'm making a note here: Cataclysm Fails! It's hard to overstate my dissatisfaction. Blizzard Entertainment, We nerf all that we hate because we can. For the good of all of us. Except the ones who are nerfed. But there's no sense QQ-ing over every single change. You just keep on paying till you run out of days. And the raids gets done. And you get some gear fun. For the raid that'll revamp next year. I'm not even MAD BRO!! I'm not secretly trolling right now. Even though you broke my class. And nerfed me. And showered me with cooldowns. And stole and dispelled each spell I have. As I Pvp-ed it hurt because my Word of Glory…! Now these points of Arena make a downhill line. And we're out of abilities. We're bubbling on time. So I'm Glad. I got nerfed. Think of all the things I've heard From the FoTMS that you've kept'em buffed. Go ahead and nerf me! I think I prefer to go outside. Maybe you'll find someone else to pay you. Maybe Holy Paladins THAT WAS A JOKE. HAHA. FAT CHANCE. Anyway, this game is “great”. It's so repetitive and dull. Look at me still typing When there's canceling to do. When I post this out, Yes! you can haz my stuff, too! I had battlegrounds to run. There were dungeons to be done. For the people who were still not gone. And believe me now I am being gone. I'm quitting this game and I’m being gone. I feel FANTASTIC while I'm being gone. While you're nerfin‘n’buffin I’ll still be gone. And when you're revamping content I’ll still be gone. will be gone… Oh I'm already gone! /salute fellow paladins Sylvanaz1
May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011
I feel sad I was pvping random BGs at the end of the battle I did about 250k in healing I used Seal of Insight, Lay on Hands on CD, Holy Radiance on CD, WoG on CD and actually used Flash of Light and Divine Light since I was able to recoup mana with insight fast. I thought the nerf to wog was to force non holy pallies to stop healing so much but before this patch I have never gone out of my way so much to stay alive. But at the end of the battle; My healing: 250k Warrior healing: 500k Lock healing: 850k Needless to say, they both did significant more dmg than me; I was unaware warriors and locks had a healing spec. As I pvp in cata it becomes painfully obvious that paladins main weakness continues to be exploited rather easily by every single class, being kited to death. while is true that we can become invulnerable for 8 seconds every 5 minutes, our kiting enemies can be come invulnerable indefinitely, plus they do not get a 50% dmg reduction penalty. Our only reliable range ability is judgement, sadly judgement hits like a wet noodle. Our four set pvp bonus is a reduction to judgements cooldown by one second, this used to be a good thing considering that judgement used to hit like a truck and had actual utility. But now does one second less actually make a difference? I guess it does because that is the only thing we can use when we are kited about. the only thing we had to survive the kiting was our healing, but we do not have that anymore. Every class has its strengths and weaknesses, unfortunately paladin strengths are easily circumvented and we are left with nothing but weaknesses. Mîkey2
May 9, 2011
New Pally healer Ok, so I am not a hardcore raider or pvp'er for that matter, just someone who likes the game alot and loves leveling characters and professions. I do like to see content, I just really don't have the time to dedicate to raiding right now with real life activities taking precidence. I really want to level a healer but I had some requirements, this healer had to have a viable spec to quest in, I do not like classes that take forever to down mobs. I do have a level 85 Shaman that was my first 85 in Cata, I started healing with him full time once I reached 85 and used my Elemental off-spec to quest/do dailies. I got burnt out with him fast, I did complete all of the heroics as a healer, but it was not fun. I have not healed since probably the 5th or 6th week after Cata launch. I have since leveled a Hunter and Warrior to 85 and a Rogue to 83. I decided I really wanted to give healing another shot but I wanted to try 1 of the other 3 healing classes. I have leveled a Druid to 55 and a Pally to 27 and a Disc Priest to mid 20's. I have full heirlooms for every class and I am having a hard time deciding between the 3. I love the offensive capabilities of Disc Priest's in the lower levels. In battlegrounds I can definitely hold my own, assisting the flag carrier and even offensively with pennance killing Ally. I have had BG's as Disc where I have not died once and had 7 or 8 kills. The Druid I feel is the weakest of the 3, it seems at this level the hot's cannot outheal the burst damage that the classes can put out now and they lack the defensive cooldowns of the Pally/Priest. I have to admit too that I am not the best at rapid shapeshifting changes to fit the situation I am in. The Druid interests me though because as a casual dungeon/raider, they seem to fair very well on the healing meeters and that is important to me because I am not the greatest wow player. I understand the mechanics and what not to stand in and when to move, good awareness, but not the best reactions. The lvl 27 Holy Pally is a beast at soloing. There is now a 5 boss chain in Durnhold Keep and the last 3 bosses are lvl 25 elites and are considered 3+ group quests. At lvl 24 I soloed all of them. I was healing Shadowfang Keep at like lvl 20 and I think it's the third boss, the guy that walks left to right on that little stage, a military like guy with a room full of military like people that look just like him. Im not sure what happened but he has a mechanic that ended up causing everyone in the group to die except me. (could be my fault, happened fast and I wasn't sure) But anyway, with that boss at %50 health I soloed him and ended the fight with almost full health and about 10% mana left. I did pop 1 mana pot. But my point here is not how good I am, but the fact that I have had people die on me while healing on my Pally a few times now. I am not sure if it was me or just the lack of healing options as a Pally. Any opinion's on which of the 3 you think I might enjoy more and be able to succeed with at end game? Keep in mind my idea of success could be different than yours, I am not hard core by any means. Thanks and sorry for the long winded post. Klaymore6
May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011
State of Ret paladins - For Devs to read Honestly unless you like having the devs play Russian roulette with ret pallies like this guy I quoted states Just reroll to a pvp class thats actually competitive. To those saying that I am angry that ret is not faceroll. I dont care about faceroll I want to be competitive in rated bgs and arenas and I will list this classes downfall that never get looked at. 1. Dispels - only class that that gets royally screwed over offensive dispels and sadly offensive dispel spamming is here to stay. 2. Gap closer- Yah what can i say putting in long arm of the law with spamming cleanse on yourself. Not fun at all. The fact that you have to run to your target at quick speeds and then get slowed is negated. The fact that you have to sit there and spam cleanse on yourself and waste GCD just to reach your target is rediculous. What more can i say about this other than it was just a band aid fix to keep ret rolling along. 3. WoG- Problem here? Well good god that fact that you have to build up 3 holy power to use it and then it only heals for 10k to 18k non crit is disheartening to say the least. Tack on that 20 sec cd and it looks like blizzard spread your cheeks on this one. 4. Pursuit of justice- good god for a talent ability that every other class can get what the heck is going on. At least let pursuit of justice stack with the speed enchant on boots. The fact that every other class can get the same thing without having to talent it make it useless. 5. Snare- What can I say here that its quite obvious from my point of view and other rets point of view. Rets want a snare to have utility they want to be competitive and taken by healers. Right now in arenas and group pvp people dont take ret because all we bring is nice burst damage when wings is up every 2min. 6. Unique utility- WoG is what seperated ret from the rest of the classes. The other classes have their peels to save their healers, they have snares, they have defensive cds. Now that WoG is gone what does ret bring to the table that makes it unique. Now I know many will come in here and claim freedom and bop etc. but guess what in 1 to 2 sec with a monkey behind the keyboard your bop or freedom will be gone thanks to offensive dispel spamming. 7. Outlook- unless you want to break your home's windows and nerd rage on your keyboard I suggest you stay away from this class for pvp until blizzard stops being stubborn. Thats just my 2 cents on it. Zareik21
May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011
Is there any appeal to Retribution paladins? This paladin was my first character and I've always been MS ret. But lately I just don't see the point, in PvE I usually burst for about 25k to 30k dps just to have it fall all the way to 15k and then I have to work my ass off to keep it level at around 14-15k, meanwhile a mage is spamming 2 or 3 spells and pulling 25k dps easy. Ret paladins used to be pretty fun to play in pvp because you could actually put up a fight against other classes, one of the main things that kept me alive in arenas was WoG procing at just the right time or a few times in a row. But now with the 20 sec *#%@tarded CD its almost worthless. I though that paladins were suppose to be a hybrid class that didn't do as much damage as other but made up for it in having moderate self heals, or at least self heals that were better than most other melee DPS. But now we have almost nothing DK's can heal themselves for insane amounts (i've seen them in arenas go from 70k to around 120k in a few seconds) and rogues can recuperate while stealthed to heal themselves for about the same amount, while paladins, losing their only heal spell that was useful, either have to bubble, spam flash of light 4 times making us go oom immediately, or die. They need to either give us a mana sufficient heal spell, take the CD of WoG, or completely change this class to make it even half way effective in a pve or arena setting. The only thing keeping me on it is how much time i've put into my character, I just got my 2nd piece of tier gear and am pretty well geared as far as pve goes, I'm also well geared in pvp with 3.4k resil, I really don't want to start all the way over with another character but I feel I might have to. So is there any hope for Retribution Paladins or am I better of just getting a heal spec or starting all the way over on a mage or DK? Xh28
May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011
Ret PvP problems that need to be encountered For a couple months now I have sat back, quietly, accepting these nerfs to ret, but from the birth of 4.1, my level of aggravation over not only the inconsistencies that Blizzard has placed upon the paladin, but also the fact that despite our many protests of which I have read over, there is yet to be a single employee who even confronts such issues. Based on everything that has happened since Cataclysm, Blizzard appears to be focusing paladins not only specifically to ret, but as a whole towards PvE. With the several levels of problems paladins have among PvP, I will list them, confronting them one at a time. 1. Mobility - The only trace of mobility that ret paladins have to even give them a chance to catch up to other classes is the Judgment speed bonus, that of which requires you to be at least 15 yards away in the first place, many a times have I been in that wonderful groove where I am past the 15 yard mark, but clearly too far to make any substantial gain towards them. Sure Hand of Freedom helps with slows and snare removals, but to no avail, it can be dispelled or spellstolen. 2. Crowd Control - Repentance and Hammer of Justice, that is all we have, an incapacitate, that of which we cant even do damage to while it remains on the target, additionally it can also be dispelled. Hammer of Justice, I conclude to be one of if not THE best stuns in the game, but taken into consideration that the paladin only has Hammer of Justice and Repentance, the common train of thought is "Oh, he repentanced me, ok?" or "Well I got Hammered, guess I should trinket." and bam, all cc is made null and void. Oh and did I also forget to mention you don't even need to trinket Hammer of Justice? No worries to the other classes, it can be dispelled also. 3. Survivability - Well now, with the current patch 4.1 in place, we lost one of our only 2 redeeming values, and even among that our survivability still summed up to only be on par with the current metagame, due to the fact that our only form of counteracting enemy players are Sacred Shield and Blessing of Protection, which can be removed or spellstolen leaves us with just Sacred Shield, the ~20k bubble which gave us some aspect of damage management, but now that 4.1 has hit, we lost half of what our Sacred Shield used to be, increasing the cooldown timer on it from 30 to 60 seconds. Secondly in the same patch, nerfing our Word of Glory, which amounted to being on par for self-healing has now accepted the wonderful 20 second cooldown, because of selfless healing being overspeculated to being an out of control heal. With this 20 second cooldown now, half of what the paladin was made of for PvP during 4.0.6 was wiped from the field, Blizzard claiming they wanted paladins to be more damage focused in ret spec. 4. Damage inconsistencies - As just stated, Blizzard, who wants us to be more geared towards a damage based class than a healing damager in the ret spec leaves us with several problems that hinder our damage. Avenging Wrath, a key spell in increasing our damage drastically due to the hammer of wrath proc can also be dispelled or spellstolen, one of our 4 key cooldowns that is best used incongruence with one another (Zealotry, Inquisition, Avenging Wrath, Guardian of the Ancient Kings). Additionally, with Templars Verdict being our main source of damage is generated from holy power, the fact that Crusader Strike, being dodged, blocked, or parried denies us holy power, the key to setting up our damage entirely (miss is not included because you should not be missing >.>). Overall though, this is one of the least of my worries, because as a whole, our damage output is still nice if we can actually get to our target. Since all of these factors make paladins one of the most hindered metagame PvPers as of now, the class is essentially a liability to the team if your enemy knows how to manage you and focuses you first (which is basically everyone). Not being managed does in fact leave us as a very powerful class, but when you hit higher rated arenas, skilled players are not naive and have basic understanding of almost every class, and know that paladins are by far the easiest class to focus down and the easiest to CC. With how things are now, the damage aspect of ret paladins is fine, even nerfing our damage slightly overall wouldn't really affect us much and in some situations is probably needed, because all our class now is damage, 100% damage, but whenever 90% of the time we can't even reach our target to touch them let alone make any advance in the health gap, what do we have? A ~120k sac of meat that just runs around Word of glorying now every 20 seconds hoping that they might one day be viable again. Séphiroth2
May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011 May 9, 2011