Warlords of Garrisons

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It just doesn't seem like the next expansion will progress the Azeroth story at all unlike all the other expansions. While piddling around in an unblown up version of Dreanor may be fun but other than stopping the Iron Horde from invading what will it's effect be on Azoroth? Will we learn anything new about Azeroth?


Another fair point. For all the faults of Cataclysm and MoP, there was a definite sensation of progress. With WoD, there is a very strong sense of "nothing you do actually matters" at least with the story and world of Azeroth as we know it.

Again, this just another reason why it feels like a filler expansion. Something to stall for time and keep cash coming in in the short term rather then a product with the same quality of older expansions like WotLK.
11/11/2013 07:24 AMPosted by Undeadburger
Cata and pandaland were fillers.


Cataclysm was chock full of major lore players and the main bad guy has played a critical role in Warcraft lore for years. It was all about the dragonflights and their role - past, present, AND future - on Azeroth.

Beyond that, the expansion added a lot of community requests including Gilneas, an Underwater zone (that turned out badly), flying in Azeroth, new classes, and expanded race/class combinations.

It wasn't the best but it was hardly "filler" content. Pandaria, on the other hand, barely ties into the rest of Azeroth with a contrived Old God connection, so I can understand why someone would feel like Pandaria was filler.
This was a very Old God/Titan heavy expansion


Maybe I'm forgetting something, but the only Old God lore shown was the heart of Y'shaarj, which was more of a plot device than a fleshed out story. Similarly, there were references to the Titans like Lei Shen stealing Titan power from Ra-den or the appearance of Norushen, but nothing really substantial.

When I speak of a continuation of Old God lore I mean something along the lines of confronting them more or less head on. The way I see it, the Old Gods and the Legion are the two main villains of the entire WC universe. They drove most of the major events of the series and caused most of the wars. I think that instead of exploring tangential things like pandas, who were a very small part of the lore, or the history of Draenor, which is already fleshed out, we should be hitting the meat and potatoes.
11/11/2013 07:17 AMPosted by Angelatore
filler


There's that word again.

Tsk tsk


Wait...we're actually getting Draenei Lore? I thought that didn't exist?


Getting some? We're going to their HOME. We get to get up close and intimate with who they are, what they're about, their lore, their, struggles, their triumphs, their defeats. We get to find out so much more about them (plus no one crashes a space ship.) Are you sure you're ready for it?


Neth.... bit puzzled.... We're going to Draenor prior to the "asplosion".... but the Draenei are "from" Argus - not Draenor. Or so I thought.... I'm not really a lore person, I just enjoy hell out of this game and have since just before BC landed....

[And I'd really like to say thanks for doing this instead of sending me to Undermine for 10 levels.... *shudder*]




Getting some? We're going to their HOME. We get to get up close and intimate with who they are, what they're about, their lore, their, struggles, their triumphs, their defeats. We get to find out so much more about them (plus no one crashes a space ship.) Are you sure you're ready for it?


Neth.... bit puzzled.... We're going to Draenor prior to the "asplosion".... but the Draenei are "from" Argus - not Draenor. Or so I thought.... I'm not really a lore person, I just enjoy hell out of this game and have since just before BC landed....


They -are- from Argus, but I think a few good portions of it were lost when the Orcs got drunk off of demon blood and started killing them all.


Maybe I'm forgetting something, but the only Old God lore shown was the heart of Y'shaarj, which was more of a plot device than a fleshed out story. Similarly, there were references to the Titans like Lei Shen stealing Titan power from Ra-den or the appearance of Norushen, but nothing really substantial.

When I speak of a continuation of Old God lore I mean something along the lines of confronting them more or less head on. The way I see it, the Old Gods and the Legion are the two main villains of the entire WC universe. They drove most of the major events of the series and caused most of the wars. I think that instead of exploring tangential things like pandas, who were a very small part of the lore, or the history of Draenor, which is already fleshed out, we should be hitting the meat and potatoes.


All of the Sha were created by Y'Shaarj (note Y'*SHA*arj). Every conflict in Pandaria was because of the Old God buried underneath it. The Mogu were created by the Titans to terraform Pandaria and possibly to guard against the Old Gods (and obviously to watch over Y'Shaarj). They only became what they are now when affected by the Curse of Flesh.

As for the pandas, they don't have TOO much connection; they were friends with the nelfs before the Well of Eternity, then drew away after that whole incident. Chen Stormstout did help Thrall found Orgrimmar, though.

Basically, if you actually read the lore (the scrolls scattered across pandaland) the whole continent was created by the Titans to house the Heart and to become a separate area to grow new life. Hence the amount of species not found anywhere else. That sounds pretty connected to the Titans to me.
That's all well and good, but I'd prefer the Titans and Old Gods to take more of the foreground. The mogu are sort of remnants of the Titans that went into their own schemes that had to stop. When are we going to encounter the Titans proper? Learning Y'Shaaraj's backstory from the Klaaxi was something I enjoyed, but when are we going to take the fight to them and finally go deep on them? They're a main antagonist that we need a resolution with, and WoD eschews that to explore things that have already been explored.
The one thing I want more than anything else is for Magni to be released from his curse. If it's possible, I don't know. I want the king back.


This, I'd like some closure on this.


Why did you scrap the Burning Legion despite all of the chatter about their return?



Who said the Burning Legion won't be present in this Xpac? Did you notice in the WoD poster that Gul'dan is green? He's drunk the coolaid. He is in communication with the BL during this Xpac. How involved will the BL be in this expansion? We'll just have to wait and see.
Players have been asking for player housing for friends to visit to show off their "trophies", to have some visible way of displaying things they've collected over the years. The Garrison is not player housing, it is a city building game. There is no way to show off trophies. All you get do is go "Oh, you went with that building. I decided I'd rather have this one." And since it sounds like you're tying it into character progression (though I could be wrong on that), it pretty much makes it mandatory for players whether they want to be playing a city building game or not.

I have yet to meet one person who has been asking for player housing think that the Garrison is what they want.

Heroic raiding has been destroyed for more than half the heroic raiders out there. Talk about Connected Realms all you want but it's still not here for most of us and we have no one to make plans with for raiding assuming we even want to move to 20man, which most of us impacted don't. But that's ok, you've renamed the normal content that we faceroll through in a few weeks to now be heroic so we can continue to call ourselves heroic raiders! Do you honestly think a name bait and switch is going to satisfy us? WTF are we supposed to do with the remaining 6-7 months between new patch content?

MoP and Wrathion's quest line was a set up for the Burning Legion and now you aren't delivering. Sorry, if you're going to create a set up for future content then it needs to be content you're going to deliver next expansion not 3 expansions from now. That is why players feel that Warlords of Draenor is just filler. It's not what they were led to believe they were going to be getting. Instead of it's just recycled characters and planet from a old game. Time travel and co-existing alternate timelines are bad plot devices used by writers who are out of ideas.

And Blizzard has yet to deliver on making the player feel like the player is the real hero. We're always just some tool of the major lore characters.

Thrall and the Aspects for Cata - who delivered the deathblow to Deathwing? Wasn't us. Wrathion, Vol'jin, Varian and Taran Zhu now for MoP - who delivered the deathblow to Garrosh? Not only was it not us, it's no one at all! And then they screw up and let him escape.

Sorry, no love for the new expansion or even WoW anymore from this gnome. Especially not with the toxic player community your game master staff coddles.


just saying, having the very next expansion be about the story that was built up for all of 1 or 2 patches in the previous expansion would be poor build-up and bad writing. Progressing a storyline over several expansions while having other short-term subplots is real and proper storytelling


They -are- from Argus, but I think a few good portions of it were lost when the Orcs got drunk off of demon blood and started killing them all.


Thanks - and on a second read-through of this thread, I did see her answer to another person regarding the same question, which I managed to somehow miss the first time.

I'm happy enough with most of the stuff apparently happening in this xpac, but I seriously have no use for "player housing" and certainly not for a "garrison building mini-game". I got over that sort of thing back in Might and Magic 6 or whichever one it was. No worries though - I'll just ignore that part of it.


In all technicality, you're heading to a place they just happened to land on while running from the legion. Not really a home, just a location they're hiding until it's time to flee again.

Sooooo..


The Draenei considered it home. You don't have to live in a place your whole life for it to be your home and put down roots. ;)


What's two hundred years to a race that can live 25,000 though? I love the draenei but always felt they should have been written to land on Draenor a couple thousand years ago at least in order to really build a culture and home there.
i farm in outland so when i reach 90 will i be able to go back to outland instead of going to draenor?
So... Draka... Will we get to see some awesome from her? Thrall himself describes her as a strong female orc. :)

Draka was confirmed to appear at Blizzcon.

Garona, Yrel (Draenei compared to Joan of Arc), and Zaela are also showing up.

i farm in outland so when i reach 90 will i be able to go back to outland instead of going to draenor?

Yes. They said they haven't figured out how yet, but probably through the Caverns of Time. But you will be able to that much is promised.
i farm in outland so when i reach 90 will i be able to go back to outland instead of going to draenor?


Outland's not going away. I'm not sure - seems like I read something about the portal going to move to CoT, but other than that, it's going to stay there for leveling from 58-68 like it's always been. You'll be able to farm there.
So...

Where did Wrathion go?

Why did you scrap the Burning Legion despite all of the chatter about their return?

Why did BlizzCon offer so little about actual content and instead focus mainly on Garrisons?

I gotta say, I am not really all that thrilled about another filler expansion that is more or less just a huge patch with new features.


Nailed it.

Prob is the new Devs don't know the difference between content and filler. Literally got to that third sentence and was like -- because they think filler is content -- and then your 4th sentence simply nails it.

Getting some? We're going to their HOME. We get to get up close and intimate with who they are, what they're about, their lore, their, struggles, their triumphs, their defeats. We get to find out so much more about them (plus no one crashes a space ship.) Are you sure you're ready for it?


That's the bit of disconnect for me. Its not our draenei's home we're going to, it's the other timeline's. Their world is completely different now... then, so why would their people be the same as from ours?

It would be like a current day person going back in a time where the South won the U.S. Civil War. It might be the same country, but it would hardly be the same.
I truthfully dislike this expansion so much that words cannot even begin to describe.. I understand that an item squish is necessary, but going back to 50 strength? are you serious? How are you gonna squish every mob from the past? Level 80 characters leveling up will have better gear than level 100's. I don't understand... How will we kill bosses from let's say BWL? And does anyone wanna go back to only hitting 2k-3k's in battlegrounds? Cmon.. blizzard.. The 72% resilience was bad enough now imagine that and the item squish together.. You wont be hitting more than 1k in PvP which is absolutely horrendous if you ask me.. I would really like if a blue could tell me how all of that will work.. As well as the concerns above, I read that you guys are making leveling less of a grind and more fun? How is that going to work?

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