Vanguards Retribution Paladin PvP Guide 7.0.3

Paladin
Prev 1 19 20 21 28 Next
how u guys fight monks? they OP against us?
how u guys fight monks? they OP against us?


Monks are extremely OP against us.

Vs Mistweaver
- blind them and burn someone else as part of a coordinated cc on them and burn on another target.
- It is even 'OK' to stun a Mistweaver this way, as long as you're not trying to burn them during a stun.
- Then when you have them out numbered, burn them down.

Vs Windwalkers
- Harshwords/range'n them is particularly effective. If you get in close and try and go blow for blow against an equally geared and skilled WW, you're probably going to lose. It's about as pointless as ranging a hunter.
- If they roll away to heal, that's your queue to do the same. Don't try and catch up and get them as they self-heal, you're just setting yourself up for a stun or some other cc - which they have more of then us.
- Use Hand of Protection when they use their channel 'fists of fury' stun thingie, or a glyphed Divine Protection. I forget the name but you'll never mistake the visual of their skill. This is like when Frost Mage's Deep Freeze you, they are popping the works to burn you down, so go immune to it. Then simply remember they are still 'amped up' to do dmg, and cc em up or kite em.
- The key to beating a WW is making them make mistakes and forget to look at their health.
- In 5.4 with our new fear, we'll be able to range/fear bomb them like a classic warlock-like style. Its stupid. Everyone will hate you for it cuz you'll be able to do it on others too, and it will no doubt get nerfed or removed.

General Tips vs Monks:
- Turn to prevent auto-attacks and run out of Ring of Peace if possible. Use range once outside.
- If they use Ring of Peace as a def cd when at low health, give it about 2 secs and then pop Dev aura and continue cast pressure on them, or pop Divine Shield which makes you immune to Ring of Peace and continue to pressure them (this tends to throw them off a lot).
- They can Ring of Peace A LOT MORE OFTEN than we can Dev Aura or Divine Shield, so only use those abilities when the monk is at sub 30%-ish and you have your cc's available and dmg buffs going, otherwise it will be a complete waste 9/10 times.
- Don't bother chasing a monk by yourself unless at max health, even with Nitro's your chance of catching one is exceedingly slim, and when you do they'll usually just stun/cc you anyways.
- But generally speaking since snares do not work on roll, if they wanna run, let em run. You're better off chasing a resto druid (seriously). They often combine their roll with their version of sprint, which just makes the ground a monk can cover frigging ridiculous. Even Warriors are pressed to catch a monk, and they have to have double charge and intervene to make it happen with a glyphed heroic leap. In the span of one 5 sec stun they can go from one base to another in WSG. So yeah, don't even bother.
which will give more damage for me?check my gear and stats..will kings or might give me more damage?
I disagree that monks are OP against monks. I have yet to lose to a WW in a duel or 2's arenas. They are easily cc able, and if you fist of justice them right as they Karma, it negates the effect, maybe a glitch. But you can kite them during karma with long arm of the law and seal of justice. Selfless healer talent is very useful against them so you can instaheal while going head to head with them. Also clemency for root and snare effects.
Hey

Just got the Heroic Twins trinket... I am in doubt about if I should use it or continue using the Normal Jikun one.

Keep in mind that with the heroic trinket from twins I´ll be with a passive 1.6k strenght with a critical strike proc.
With the normal Jikun trinket I may have 586 passive haste, with a proc that gives me 1.3k strenght every 2 seconds for 20 seconds...

Knowing that haste is the best secondary stat for a retribution and critical is the worse, which one I should choose??

Thanks ^^
5.4 Personal Notes
- This feedback is based on the last 2-3 days of doing an excessive amount of random BG's on live, as the PTR testing lacked a lot to be desired previously, and a healthy amount of World PvP (Korgath is awesome for it as Horde). Unfortunately Ret is still avoided by others organizing RBG's <-which is why I'm attempting to organize my own team - and so as of yet haven't had the pleasure of. Unlike Van, I'm not a big arena player so haven't bounced in one there yet either. So take the below with all this into consideration.

Gemming - How we gem hasn't changed from 5.3
Red: Bold Primordial Ruby
Yellow: Str/Haste or Str/Mastery or Str/Crit
Blue: Tense Imperial Amethyst

Stat Priorities - Still the same, altho you might notice Mastery a bit more effective now than Crit with the Battle Fatigue increase.

Interesting New Things:
- Glyph of Burden of Guilt is still effective in catching people trying to flee that are not using speed boost abilities. When paired with Long Arm of the Law, it'll usually take you about 2 Judgements before you catch them. The old version was so OP because it basically allowed you to catch anyone but Monks even when they speed boosted. That is no longer the case.

- Unbreakable Spirit is incredibly handy, as it gives you a major bubble on a 2.5 min cd, which is amazing since it's effectively a trinket with a 30 sec longer cooldown (sans Cyclone), and Lay on Hands a 5 min cd <- which helps a lot since now it doesn't heal you for 100% when under pressure because of Battle Fatigue. Use LoH earlier than previously if under pressure, you can afford to now and kind of need to. One of the best things about US is what many forget about, and that is how Divine Protection now has a flat 30 second cooldown, allowing us to reduce magical damage spikes by 40% every 30 seconds - no small thing indeed (or 20%physical+20%magical if glyphed)

- Glyph of Devotion Aura works very well with Evil is a Point of View, as we have like a 1.28 or 1.3 cast time with Turn Evil, so when under pressure or silenced, you can pop Dev and then fear a target without being interrupted. The reduction from a 3 to a 2 min comes at your teammates cost, so wouldn't recommend if you're working with a team, it's more of a solo/randoms kinda gig, but the reduction to 2 mins is damn nice since it lines up with our dmg cds as well. I'm not suggesting to use Dev Aura just to cast fear, but rather when under pressure you can do this. 8/10 of my fears were cast flat out normally. I also cast it when under a major bubble as well, which again, just makes US so nom nom nummy.

- Evil is a Point of View is just downright evil. It has given Ret something they had not had, a reliable CC. The 15 sec cd that has no DR with any of our other abilities or even itself since the cd is the same length as DR is. The 20 yard range is some what limiting and it is prone to interrupts, but is very effective for throwing people off their game, and if you can get a target to trinket out of it, you have them now with your stun/spike. Healers smart enough to not trinket out of fear, are pretty much as before. Classes that dominated you with silences and CC, you can now hold your own against if not dominate entirely.
- Welcome to the CC-Game, Retribution.

Overall Opinion
I've noticed we've become a lot more effective vs ranged (despite the loss of OP Burden of Guilt skill to a pale version of its former self), but more susceptible to melee primarily because of the Battle Fatigue increase, and the various buffs to many melee. We got buffed too in our dmg, but we got nailed with self healing. But you can still be good against melee as well if you glyph TV and DP and remember to hammer to keep them debuffed, all those reductions add up nicely.

Summary
IMHO Ret is the best it's ever been without having a bugged out Divine Storm. Very enjoyable, many options, you can be great against Ranged or Melee, or decent against both at the same time while continuing to be a strong support player.
Updated to 5.4!

For people looking for my updated armory:
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/tichondrius/Vanguards/simple

I will play the Ret I'm posting on in the future as well, at the moment there's less point than before to have two Rets to play on as there are no more teams.
Great thread there Vanguards. Love your videos keep... Keep up the good work. Congrats on rank one enhance shaman and rank one ret paladin in the beginning of this season.
Thanks for the awesome guide.

Quick question,

Is it true that Ret Pallies are generally seen as undesirable for high level RBG's? I currently PVP as ret with fairly decent results in low MMR RBG's (routinely get first to third place in damage done and killing blows), but I don't want to waste my time grinding my rating just to be snubbed once I get to 1700+ or so. If that's my inevitable fate, then I might as well reroll a Frost DK or Arms Warrior now and save myself the time.
Thanks so much for this thread. It's incredibly helpful. I'm just getting into PvP, The Lion Roars *cough*, and have been steadily realizing I don't mind it as much as I previously did. The ques are super fast, I can normally do 20 randoms in the time it would take me to get off a single raid que and LFR wing, still can't win a Sivershard to save my sanity, but I'm sure as I keep racking up points, and now that I know gems and strats, I will get there eventually. So thanks for the info, and maybe by the time I'm done with that quest I'll like PvP even more. I may have missed it, but any tips for good enchants?
10/06/2013 11:15 AMPosted by Agert
Is it true that Ret Pallies are generally seen as undesirable for high level RBG's?


Sadly that is true, we just aren't as viable as other melee classes. We just don't have very many useful defensive cds in a large group setting; however, if you can play your class well, you should have no trouble pushing rating, all classes are viable as Heros or Glad, it's the player that decides that.
So you say haste is a main stat but then you say. You don't usually go for haste in PvP. I'm sitting at almost 20% haste. My first time on these forms. I've never played anything but ret as a paladin for 8 yrs. I've been through every change an the bull that's posted here is absolutely unreal. If your unable to do damage outside your wings with inqusition an your trinket constantly on proc and your enchant....I find something horribly wrong... Excuse my disgusting grammar and spelling. Posted irritated the hell out of me.
And as a ret if your having a rogue problem. Then you need more practice. The only class that is a problem for me 1v1 is a darn monk. If I'm facing 2 melee classes if you do your heals an stuns correctly you should survive both
This is however a great post I did find relief in the gemming part. Was a little sketchy on it.
Has anyone tried the http://us.battle.net/wow/en/item/95346#tab=vendors (legendary meta gem) for pvp? If so does the proc still work because i remember hearing that the cloak proc wouldn't work against players. If it does work is it better than the 216 strength and 3% crit meta?
So you say haste is a main stat but then you say. You don't usually go for haste in PvP. I'm sitting at almost 20% haste. My first time on these forms. I've never played anything but ret as a paladin for 8 yrs. I've been through every change an the bull that's posted here is absolutely unreal. If your unable to do damage outside your wings with inqusition an your trinket constantly on proc and your enchant....I find something horribly wrong... Excuse my disgusting grammar and spelling. Posted irritated the hell out of me.


Early season i gemmed/forged str/crit as my build and it did have a good rng feel, but decided to priority haste/str/crit about a month ago ( boots are still left over from previous build). If haste becomes a desirable stat after certain ilevel in raid gear stands to say that its also true in pvp gear. Im having a blast with the haste build stay alive longer do decent sustained.
Has anyone tried the http://us.battle.net/wow/en/item/95346#tab=vendors (legendary meta gem) for pvp? If so does the proc still work because i remember hearing that the cloak proc wouldn't work against players. If it does work is it better than the 216 strength and 3% crit meta?


Legendary metas do not proc in BG's or Arenas. Tested and Confirmed.
a bugged out Divine Storm


what's that? when did that happen?
12/10/2013 12:17 PMPosted by Edge
a bugged out Divine Storm


what's that? when did that happen?


Happened twice actually.

During Firelands was the most recent, and at the end of tBC with the 3.0 WotLK Pre-patch.
Edited a few things to update for 5.4.7, but to be honest not much changed!

I may revise things once I can do more arenas in 5.4.7.

Join the Conversation

Return to Forum