4.2 Conquest change

General Discussion
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05/12/2011 08:29 PMPosted by Zarhym
It shows that Rated Battlegrounds are currently sub-par in terms of the rate at which points can be accumulated.

It is not about the "rate" at which points are accumulated in Rated BGs. You could quite literally make 1 Rated BG win give you the full cap worth of Conquest Points and you would still hardly ever see anyone do them. It is about getting a full 10m premade together before you can even get through the door. Seriously, I do not understand how you could talk about "rate" when you already tried this experiment before vis-a-vis 5v5 giving more Arena Points than 2v2 and 3v3. The average player does not like mass organized PvP, let alone BGs.

Back in Wrath, people were excited about the Rated BG concept because they thought it would be just like normal BGs, but with better geared teammates that actually cared about capping flags and not fighting in the road. Trade chat premades getting stomped by PvP guilds with four healers and a dedicated tank flag-runner with Vent running? Not so exciting. Rated BGs are unpopular because of the logistical hurdles, not the rewards. A solo-queue ability would not work under the current system, but why not have a Semi-Rated BG option where people select a role (e.g. healer or DPS), are matched up based on resilience levels, and Personal Rating/Conquest Points are awarded based on the objectives rather than HKs mid-field? Make it so that less Conquest is awarded by camping GYs and more from winning fast.

All these other changes you are doing are simply punishing players for playing your game. I am never going into a Rated BG no matter what you do, if a 10m premade is required (if I had 10 people, I'd be raiding). If you keep making my Arena experience worse, I'll simply stop doing Arena and that will be one less reason to keep playing the game at all.
05/12/2011 08:40 PMPosted by Wirethrone
The people that hate arena are the people who are not good at it.


Or they aren't playing one of the FOTM classes. Unless something has drastically changed since I was last did arenas (first few seasons on a hunter, a couple WotLK seasons on this DK), there will always be classes that ROFL-stomp in arenas compared to those who just either squeak by or have zero chance. I'll let you guess who's in the majority there.

05/12/2011 09:21 PMPosted by Cherrylin
I wonder just how much work the redesigned Azeroth took because it's like the end game and pvp suffered crazily due to a bit of leveling content everyone blows through in a week...


Yeah, I didn't realize how crazy easy it is now to level until I started on a mage alt. At one point in the low thirties I was hitting a level every 20-25 minutes. If I had done any of the new content before i probably could've gotten it down to 15-20 minutes per level.
05/12/2011 09:27 PMPosted by Bandet
What if there was a rated BG bracket that *required* solo queue (HEAR ME OUT) where if you win your team stays together and keeps playing for MORE POINTS and if you lose you go back into the queue. Sorta like a lotto rated BG. 10 wins in a row awards XXXX amount of points etc.


This has been suggested many times and every single time refused.


I have never seen anyone offer the unique solution I have where the team stays together upon winning.

It was rejected because they didn't want players to be able to replace rated BG's with regular BG's... My method would require multiple wins in a row to be awarded any points. 3 wins in a row but you lose the 4th would get you nothing.



05/12/2011 09:28 PMPosted by Cherrylin


I'll call BS right now lol. You are complaining about the rewards... if all you cared about was the PvP itself you would be PvPing right now and not be worried about the changes to rewards.


You *HAVE* to have the rewards to PvP, even if all you care about is a level playing field you don't get a choice. PvP does not have a comfortable gear ladder like PvE.


Thank you Cherrylyn for answering Kelsee exactly how I would have. Kelsee didn't really read my post.

Battles are most fun for us when both sides are equally geared. The thrill is in using your skills and abilities to their fullest and giving it everything you have while the other side is doing the same making the match or battle close and exciting.


05/12/2011 09:24 PMPosted by Magdasearus
we don't PVP to gear; we gear to PVP.


I wasn't complaining about gearing. I was addressing the trend in the changes that are being made with the reasoning of it needing to take longer to gear up in order to have some kind of progression that I think is a PVE perspective. To me the fun of PVP isn't one side steamrolling another simply due to gear (no matter if I'm on the team doing the steamrolling or on the side being steamrolled). I don't enjoy it either way. For me, the fun of PVP is two equally geared teams using their skills, abilities and strategy - giving their all in a close battle or match.
Already canceled my account.

And no you can't has my stuff: I gave it away already


05/12/2011 09:29 PMPosted by Andrèw
This change is disgusting. If it goes into effect, I quit.


Won't be renewing if this change goes live as well.I don't like to be pushed into rated battlegrounds.
You lose 600,000 subscriptions and then you think this is a good idea.........sorry no thanks.

05/12/2011 08:37 PMPosted by Gambles
Just scrap arena, it's not PvP anyway.

hah, ib4theoppositeopinion.
05/12/2011 08:29 PMPosted by Zarhym
So, as many of you are interpreting this change, it is to encourage more participation in Rated Battlegrounds.


If you want to massively increase the participation in rated BGs, implement a LFD-style group finding system.
well i do believe its safe to assume this won't go live or bye bye another 600k
So, as many of you are interpreting this change, it is to encourage more participation in Rated Battlegrounds. We see the fact that participating in Arenas is by far the superior way of obtaining top-notch PvP gear, in terms of time investment, as a problem. If you want to maximize your Conquest Point gains in patch 4.2, you'll need to participate at least a little bit in Rated Battlegrounds.

We know this may not sound very appealing to those of you who have grown accustomed to spending as little as an hour a week getting the top PvP currency in the game... the frank reality is that the total time investment required in season 9 to get all your points has been much, much too low...


Why do you think you need to encourage more participation in rated battlegrounds? Sorry that people don't like them. Maybe you should make them more fun instead of trying to bribe us to do them with a higher point cap?

If you think it's too fast to get conquest points through arena wins, why not change the amount of points per win back to 130 or lower? It blows my mind that you would move that back to 180 or whatever per win and then use "you get points too fast" as a reason to make this change.

And I don't think it's debatable that it takes more skill to do high end 3v3 than it does to get a high BG rating. Yet the equivalent BG rated player will now get gear faster... nice.

I'll be letting my subscription lapse.
05/12/2011 09:41 PMPosted by Kalisti
So, as many of you are interpreting this change, it is to encourage more participation in Rated Battlegrounds.


If you want to massively increase the participation in rated BGs, implement a LFD-style group finding system.


This and let it be cross servers.
So, as many of you are interpreting this change, it is to encourage more participation in Rated Battlegrounds. We see the fact that participating in Arenas is by far the superior way of obtaining top-notch PvP gear, in terms of time investment, as a problem. If you want to maximize your Conquest Point gains in patch 4.2, you'll need to participate at least a little bit in Rated Battlegrounds.

We know this may not sound very appealing to those of you who have grown accustomed to spending as little as an hour a week getting the top PvP currency in the game via Arenas over the last couple of expansions. To put things in perspective though, the total number of items that can be purchased with Conquest Points today is much larger than what you used to be able to buy with Arena Points pre-Deathwing world explosion. And there is no longer a requirement to “grind” unrated BGs for Honor each season, so the real time investment isn't changing as much as some players are perceiving it to be.

On top of that, the frank reality is that the total time investment required in season 9 to get all your points has been much, much too low, as you could do that from a few 2v2 Arena games each week completed in less than an hour’s time. It shows that Rated Battlegrounds are currently sub-par in terms of the rate at which points can be accumulated.

We do feel this change is necessary to keep the time investment vs. high-quality item accumulation in check, even if it doesn't read well on paper. However, as always, your constructive feedback is welcomed. :)



Is there any plans of implamenting a way for RBG groups to get together accrost realms or a way to make it easier to find groups? i dont mind the idea of RBG. over the years ive spent plenty of time with friends in battlegrounds having a blast, but the problem for me atleast is i play off hours and there isnt a lot of people on.

if i had a way to find a group late at night to run them with i wouldnt have any issue and i would spend a lot more time running RBG's.
So your fix for rated BGs not being popular is making them the defacto method of gearing up...


I love the ingenuity guys...
This is an awful change and nobody that I know that pvp's (a lot of people) thinks it's a good idea in any way. RBG's are not popular because a lot of people don't have the time to get 10 people together to sit in que for 15 minutes per match and grind away. I don't find RBG's fun, most people I know don't find them fun and most of us don't have the time or ambition to do them. I enjoy arena, I enjoy bg's and world pvp, but I don't want to be forced to do something that I don't enjoy. If that's going to be the case then I may as well quit. Let us play how we want to play, stop trying to force RBG's down everyone's throats.
So, as many of you are interpreting this change, it is to encourage more participation in Rated Battlegrounds. We see the fact that participating in Arenas is by far the superior way of obtaining top-notch PvP gear, in terms of time investment, as a problem. If you want to maximize your Conquest Point gains in patch 4.2, you'll need to participate at least a little bit in Rated Battlegrounds.

We do feel this change is necessary to keep the time investment vs. high-quality item accumulation in check, even if it doesn't read well on paper. However, as always, your constructive feedback is welcomed. :)


No. This change serves absolutely NO purpose other than to make customers quit. This change comes from the exact same idiotic ideas-pool to force PvPers to PvE in order to obtain competitive weapons in WotLK. I, and many other PvPers, who were forced to PvE either unsubscribed or stopped playing during WotLK, because we were forced to do something we hate.

Blizzard's philosophy of forcing players to do what they don't want is so illogical, that is it completely baffling how such absurd ideas get a consensus.

To force PvPers to participate in the failed implementation of RBG is like forcing people to eat cow dung. Blizzard needs to learn that players might actually be happier if players are not forced-fed cow dung. If Blizzard actually takes the time to remove the cow dung and replace it with a steak, a lot more people would be more inclined to eat it.

If participation is low, it is ALL because the RBG implementation is POOR. Even without the thousands of players that voiced that concerns over its implementation BEFORE Cataclysm, the design was obviously flawed. To put it bluntly, Blizzard's philosophies and iteration created a complete failure of what could have been a good thing. Don't force players to participate if it is poorly implemented.

PvPers tend to be players with very little time to spend in a game. The current Arena implementation works perfectly as it rewards SKILL rather than time-investment.

Players who are skilled should not be required to put in large amount of time-investment. The 4.2 change will decrease the disparity between good players and bad players, as they will gain gear at exactly the same rate. If I am a 2.4k Arena player, why do I gain gear at the same rate as a 1.8k rated RBG player who is much less skilled? It makes absolutely no sense.

Here is a perfect solution: Reduce Conquest Point cap at 1500- Arena Rating to 1000 Points (or less), and allow skilled teams to obtain gear at the same rate as RBG. Why Blizzard has not thought about this simple solution is beyond comprehension.

Here is another suggestion: Instead of forcing players to spend countless hours waiting and mindlessly grinding, why not actually make RBG fun? Stop sticking the the failed Blizzard philosophy of "RBG MUST be fully premade". Let arena team sizes of 3s and 5s queue for RBG, and naturally, the participation will increase.
Rated Battle Grounds are just not as fun as Arena for many reasons.
The biggest of which is that the current form of Rated Battle Grounds forces Lame Group Make ups. Random Classes and Random Players really does let the good players shine in Battle Grounds.

In Random Battle Grounds you have All Specs owning ppl let and right based on skill.
Skill isn't just about damage and healing you are right. Its about everything to do with pvp
Damage/Healing, Good team work and everything in between.

The old system of grinding was far funner then this current system.

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