Let me spend my honor Blizzard

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We want people to have to farm a lot at level 85 so they pay more for subscription time


Why is it that nobody else really understands this?

EDIT: Had to fix the quote
07/19/2011 01:09 PMPosted by Zarhym
My definition of a solid reason is one that makes sense. Is there any player that considers this to be a valid idea?

What Aarschott explained to you does make sense. Level-85 PvP gear is intended to be earned and awarded to level-85 players. There is too much potential to "game" the system and stockpile really powerful gear so that you're fully equipped when you hit 85, if we were to allow you to buy level-85 gear with Honor you earned below the level cap.

The same applies for PvE gear. If you want powerful endgame items, you need to earn them via playing through endgame content.


I think the question is why this is the case, not questioning whether or not it IS the case. Does anyone enjoy slogging through endless matches in horrible gear, getting one shot by anyone who looks at you, and taking 6-10 games (not counting TB) to get a single piece of honor gear? Does it invalidate that people still 'worked' for it if they grinded it below the max level cap? Sure, pvp is kind of imba at low levels, but it's hardly balanced at max when you have a greened out 316 ilvl hero going up against people in raid and/or pvp gear.

As for the other thing people were saying, it makes no sense that it's because they want people to 'pay more for subscription time.' Would it not take MORE time to grind it below the level cap, since you get less honor? Even if my knowledge there is outdated, it would at best take roughly the same amount of time. I doubt this particular decision has anything to do with that.
07/19/2011 01:30 PMPosted by Senbon
Why is it that nobody else really understands this?


Probably because everyone isn't both jaded and ignoring the possibility of more indirect profit gains.
07/19/2011 01:09 PMPosted by Zarhym
My definition of a solid reason is one that makes sense. Is there any player that considers this to be a valid idea?

What Aarschott explained to you does make sense. Level-85 PvP gear is intended to be earned and awarded to level-85 players. There is too much potential to "game" the system and stockpile really powerful gear so that you're fully equipped when you hit 85, if we were to allow you to buy level-85 gear with Honor you earned below the level cap.

The same applies for PvE gear. If you want powerful endgame items, you need to earn them via playing through endgame content.


Because the current system of AFK botters in t9 or 325 PvE blues honor farming at 85 is obviously a much superior system compared to someone getting the gear by leveling via PvP.
07/19/2011 01:09 PMPosted by Zarhym
My definition of a solid reason is one that makes sense. Is there any player that considers this to be a valid idea?

What Aarschott explained to you does make sense. Level-85 PvP gear is intended to be earned and awarded to level-85 players. There is too much potential to "game" the system and stockpile really powerful gear so that you're fully equipped when you hit 85, if we were to allow you to buy level-85 gear with Honor you earned below the level cap.

The same applies for PvE gear. If you want powerful endgame items, you need to earn them via playing through endgame content.


OK, then why do we start earning Justice Points at 70? We can stockpile them till we have 4K; so if this really is your reasoning, why don't we get our JP/Honor wiped when we ding 85? I mean we didn't earn them doing endgame content, why should we be able to buy a few pieces of gear with them?

Just like removing VP from T11, this is another example of the complete lack of thought put into these details...

If you ask me, this is what a lack of any real competition does to a company. Just like Microsoft did in the early 2000's; you guys know there is no real alternative so the quality, polish, and attention to detail slips more and more with each passing month. Even tho I have no interest in playing it, SW:TOR can't come out soon enough.
So there is zero incentive for doing anything that generates honor points before you hit 85. Leveling goes so fast there's no point in getting honor gear for anything lower than 85. Slash the prices by 75% and maybe, but right now, it's just for 85s. And for 85s, this is crap gear. So what again is the point of this whole system?


Some people prefer to level through PvP instead of PvE.

That's sufficient incentive for them to play BGs while leveling.

They can even earn a full cup of honor points while doing so. Not everything is designed to give us the easiest time possible.
07/19/2011 01:09 PMPosted by Zarhym
The same applies for PvE gear. If you want powerful endgame items, you need to earn them via playing through endgame content.


crafting skills and BoEs beg to differ.

Not saying that PvP should be buyable (in fact I kinda enjoy earning my way up, personally). If you want something to buy, get the level 70 pvp gear. Awesome stuff and makes 70-74 bracket really fun.
My definition of a solid reason is one that makes sense. Is there any player that considers this to be a valid idea?

What Aarschott explained to you does make sense. Level-85 PvP gear is intended to be earned and awarded to level-85 players. There is too much potential to "game" the system and stockpile really powerful gear so that you're fully equipped when you hit 85, if we were to allow you to buy level-85 gear with Honor you earned below the level cap.

The same applies for PvE gear. If you want powerful endgame items, you need to earn them via playing through endgame content.


Sure. Except you're drawing a parallel between two non-synonymous things. When I hit 85 on this character, I was already geared enough for heroics. When a PvPer hits 85 on their character, they have to go buy a bunch of craftables from the AH for ~2k total, and then start entering BG's in PvE gear.

Here's how I suggest you solve this issue without letting us gear our characters before hitting 85:

People complain about not being able to purchase honor gear before 85 because before 85, there's nothing worthwhile to spend your honor on. Why not introduce a set comprised of rares and uncommons (blues and greens) that is on par with cata quest reward items from levels 80-84, but has resilience on it? It could be purchased for honor so that people leveling with BG's could feel like they actually ahd something WORTH spending their honor on, rather than just capping out at 4k and then spending it on trade goods for some easy money until 85 ?

When I was leveling my priest in BG's to prepare for arenas and RBGs at 85, I realized that level 80 honor gear was far lower ilvl than cata gear, but figured resilience is resilience. I then noticed that the only way to buy ilvl 251 honor gear is with justice points. This resulted in me capping out my honor, trading honor points for justice points at a rate of 350 for 250 at a time, and then purchasing the previous expansion's PvP gear. Can you honestly say that you think this is a good way to approach PvP players? I admit that maybe we shouldn't be able to buy level 85 gear before 85, but can you meet us half way and create a "leveling" PvP set to make up for it?
yeah.........I mean really...it is obvious that they want us all to invest more subscribed time into the game and therefore, there is a throttle on stockpiling honor points and using them to buy gear along the way so that it will take a lot more playing time ot become fully pvp geared AFTER you hit 85. Those are the terms of the game you DECIDE to play. IF you dont like it...play something else. Of course....all the games out there have the same throttle so......not much of an alternative really.
as to Trangoul, wasn't there level 60 and 70 pvp gear ingame? did they remove it?
07/19/2011 01:34 PMPosted by Rougebytch
It's not necessarily good entertainment to go and get your butt kicked repeatedly in BGs for 150 sessions before you can begin to compete.


maybe not for you but for the other players that have the gear it is

LOLOLOLOL


LAWL!!!! ^^^QFT
What Aarschott explained to you does make sense. Level-85 PvP gear is intended to be earned and awarded to level-85 players. There is too much potential to "game" the system and stockpile really powerful gear so that you're fully equipped when you hit 85, if we were to allow you to buy level-85 gear with Honor you earned below the level cap.

The same applies for PvE gear. If you want powerful endgame items, you need to earn them via playing through endgame content.


I know, right. Why have something in the bank you are looking forward to putting on?
07/19/2011 01:34 PMPosted by Rougebytch
It's not necessarily good entertainment to go and get your butt kicked repeatedly in BGs for 150 sessions before you can begin to compete.


maybe not for you but for the other players that have the gear it is

LOLOLOLOL


Except when you go up against a 3s team with only two on your side and proceed to destroy them while forgetting to put on your PvP set. :) (best arena ever)
07/19/2011 01:18 PMPosted by Gristlejack
What Aarschott explained to you does make sense. Level-85 PvP gear is intended to be earned and awarded to level-85 players. There is too much potential to "game" the system and stockpile really powerful gear so that you're fully equipped when you hit 85, if we were to allow you to buy level-85 gear with Honor you earned below the level cap.


That sounds suspiciously like "Working as intended." I think what he's asking is why it's intended to work that way?

Why don't you want a player having honor gear the second he/she hits 85?

It's not necessarily good entertainment to go and get your butt kicked repeatedly in BGs for 150 sessions before you can begin to compete.

There are crafted items available to level-85 players which will help them substantially when first setting foot into Battlegrounds or Tol Barad. Getting a hold of this gear isn't too difficult.

The fact is that endgame progression is its own experience. Leveling is a very direct and obvious act of progression, but that changes when players hit the cap. Progression then trends much more toward itemization -- you have to participate in the endgame experience to get more powerful gear. But as I said, there is underrated entry-level crafting gear which can be very useful for helping to ease PvP-oriented players into level-85 Battlegrounds.
07/19/2011 01:37 PMPosted by Percarlo
as to Trangoul, wasn't there level 60 and 70 pvp gear ingame? did they remove it?


I edited my post above to explain what I'm talking about. Yes, there is level 60, 70, and 80 PvP gear in game. However, the item levels increase drastically from one expansion to the next, rendering anyone wearing level-60 gear basically obsolete in late BC, level 70 obsolete in late WOTLK, and 80 obsolete in late cata. You're gimping yourself by equipping the previous expansion's PvP gear a full expansion's worth of levels later.
My definition of a solid reason is one that makes sense. Is there any player that considers this to be a valid idea?

What Aarschott explained to you does make sense. Level-85 PvP gear is intended to be earned and awarded to level-85 players. There is too much potential to "game" the system and stockpile really powerful gear so that you're fully equipped when you hit 85, if we were to allow you to buy level-85 gear with Honor you earned below the level cap.

The same applies for PvE gear. If you want powerful endgame items, you need to earn them via playing through endgame content.

If PvP is most balanced with resilience why not allow stockpiling?
I love the idea of working towards my endgame PvP set while I level. That way I dont get farmed by people who have been 85 longer.

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