Low lvls

Battlegrounds
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i get crushed alot in pvp, but i don't take it to seriously. you can't really que for pvp without expectin to die a little. yes, its unfair that some people get oneshotted, but alot factors into it, ie class, gear, spec etc. if you know that you have crap for health, expect to die alot lol. i'm not the greatest at pvp, but i still have fun tryin even if i die 100 times in a bg. some days i smash alot of face, most days i get my face smashed lol. even the best players get creamed once in awhile : )
Balanced - http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/830/wowscrnshot080411234658.jpg/
In low lvl battlegrounds, I've played just about every class. I'm no expert on any of them, but I do learn what stat priorities to enchant, the different cc abilities and spell priorities. Have I one shot people in battlegrounds? Yes I have and when it has happened I've pulled up the combat log and seen that they didn't have much of a fighting chance to begin with. If your getting one shot in low level battlegrounds its your own fault. It's understandable if your new. I've also been in battlegrounds when I get my a** handed to me over and over by the same player not a particular class. All that is, is someone who knows how to play that class and man handle people with it. Same thing can be said for end game pvp as well.
Just remove low level pvp. Don't give the option for pvp until about level 60.

Perks:
1. Gets rid of the whiners that complain about BoA
2. Removes the unbalanced abilities at low levels

Either that or get rid of experience in battlegrounds so people stop feeling 'entitled' to join and faceroll people without putting any thought into their gear.
I can handle hunters, rogues, whatever. I'd rather get players in the BGs that actually bother to get decent gear and go for objectives.

Losing 3 WSG in a row because of people with under 1K health in the 25-29 bracket and spending all their time dying midfield rather than going after EFC is a way bigger problem than hunters.

Find a way to keep the crappy PvPers ("I'm bad, because I have a life", "PvP only matters at 85") out of the BGs. I like the idea of minimum ilevel requirements to enter BGs. Force the little dorks to run a dungeon or two before they can get in.
I can handle hunters, rogues, whatever. I'd rather get players in the BGs that actually bother to get decent gear and go for objectives.

Losing 3 WSG in a row because of people with under 1K health in the 25-29 bracket and spending all their time dying midfield rather than going after EFC is a way bigger problem than hunters.

Find a way to keep the crappy PvPers ("I'm bad, because I have a life", "PvP only matters at 85") out of the BGs. I like the idea of minimum ilevel requirements to enter BGs. Force the little dorks to run a dungeon or two before they can get in.



Im thinking more like an attitude test.

Spoiler: You'd fail.
08/04/2011 10:19 PMPosted by Osobaboso
xp is a reward from pvp, not the reason for it.


This... so much this.

Adding experience to BG's just encouraged lazy players to queue up. Those same lazy players are the ones that also complain about:

1. Class imbalance
2. BoA

Honestly..at this point I would just remove them or remove the experience.
Its obvious that Blizzard has absolutely no intention of attempting to fix this. Or even acknowledging it.

Simply: if they saw an issue, they would have done something by now. Actions speak for themselves, and so does inaction.

My advice to two my friends who considered playing wow: Leave the PvP'ing portion of the game until at least level 60. But even then, make sure you do some yoga/meditation before you start. Then when you get to 85, expect to die a lot before you get the gear. Oh, and only roll a Frost Mage. If you cant beat em, join em.

Incidentally, they both gave up on their trials after 3 days (level 14)... because they tried WSG. Ha ha.
08/04/2011 09:01 PMPosted by Jodiefoster
Balanced - http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/830/wowscrnshot080411234658.jpg/


Clicking mage going 38-2, sounds like 85 caliber balance to me.
Look in the mirror and examine your own skill before jumping to the conclusion it's about class imbalance and BOA gear. You got less then 1k health at level 30? Yea ... it's not the class imbalance or BOA problem.


Exactly, I keep telling everyone that it's perfectly balanced that I gib clothies in ~ 3 globals.
Problem with low levels?:

1.Abilities for some classes are gained to early whereas others gain them to late.

Example: Hunters Diengage, Scatter shot gained before level 19.
Warrior Hamstring gained at 26 unable to combat charge until level 27 (if protection)

Solution: Change the level at which abilities are gained to higher levels.

2. Useful utilities are limited to certain Specs and can not be unlocked until level 71 (when you are able to spec into other branches.)

Solution: Lower some of the Spec tiers to lower levels so the spec cna be useful for PvP (innately) good for PvE as well.
3. To much burst. Scale abilities to their level so they do not do so much damage.

IE: Warrior i got 800 crit on me before from Blood thrist. That should not happen to any one. I also got crit for 1k often on different characters from Aimed shot.

Solution: Scale down damage to appropriate level. a 19 should not crit 1k (back in the day (TBC) a rogue was able to get a 1k crit every one was amazed but now 1k crits are not so awesome... they should be)

More Comprehensive list is on twink info this is just a simple list that i have thought of and sort of cover all the problems of low level PvP.
Completely agree with OP. Twinks who pvp at low levels try to enjoy the game in a manner very similar to those seriously pvping at max level. Blizz consistently alters class balance at max level, which is understandable considering the majority of players are there.

However, there is also a signifcant portion of the player base who enjoys lower level pvp, twinking or otherwise. It is not beyond the scope of blizzard to take some simple steps in order to better balance low level pvp. The OP and twink community is simply asking for some attention in this manner.

In the recent past and in my opinion, in general, Blizzard tends to make changes first and only later, often out of necessity, contemplate any insane low level pvp issues it may have raised. The most recent examples of this include the damage explosion when the new Cata talents rolled out, where 19 rogues were ambushing for 1k+ easily as one example.

Another example of this came when they made the major city fishing daily quests possibly reward the Weather Beaten Fishing Hat and the various high level fishing poles. These items resulted in characters as low as level one having a hat that provided 400 hp or a fishing pole that had 170 dps. Once again, these changes were made with no consideration to how they would affect low level characters. Only patches long after the mistake corrected these problems.

The point is, there is evidence to suggest that Blizzard often overlooks obvious low level balance problems with the apparent assumption that these issues don't matter much. The community is simply speaking out on these issues.
The imbalance is between the minimal gear required in order to level and the best available gear in the bracket, or even the best easily available gear in the bracket.

It is possible to level entirely with green quests. This gets you a gear level that will indeed get you one shot in the battlegrounds, no matter what class you face.
It's very rude for the higher levels to come into this Forum and tell us to level up. Also love how the hunters think everything is fine.

-Trilium
"If you want to compete at all in PvP while leveling up, you have to level up to 85 and grind dungeons/BGs first, then create another character first. I had to be steamrolled when I started, so it's balanced."

I fought against a level 10 mage in enchanted heirlooms (approx. 620 HP) on my level 11 warlock in quest greens (403 HP with Blood Pact) on a new server. This is out the fight fleshed out:

I managed to multi-dot while he cast frostbolt/pet frost nova. Trinket out, break line of sight. My imp is fireballing him freely. The dots drop his HP to 550. I pop out and shadowbolt while he tries to get back in LoS. I manage three shadowbolts off while weaving in and out of LoS and he fails to frostbolt; one crits for 65.

His pet moves into a position where I can't line-of-sight anymore before the mage does. He gets in range to use his own frost nova and I know I can't trinket from it anymore. I use my healthstone, which brings me to full. I cast Immolate on him again and his Frostbolt crits me for 456. He walks away with 350 HP left after I've cast 6 spells + pet bolts. I died from one spell.
Low level pvp is optional and you can level just fine doing quest. Why not take the time to get gear like the people who are facerolling you do. If you don't want to do that why continue to complain?
08/07/2011 09:05 AMPosted by Luugarin
Low level pvp is optional and you can level just fine doing quest. Why not take the time to get gear like the people who are facerolling you do. If you don't want to do that why continue to complain?


Translation: "If you want to compete at all in PvP while leveling up, you have to level up to 85 and grind dungeons/BGs first, then create another character first. I had to be steamrolled when I started, so it's balanced."

I'm sure people that just started playing WoW, but have previous MMO experience, understand this already (They don't). May as well lock all BG queues until you have a level-85 character instead.

I have heirlooms on three servers; one of which has every honor/justice heirloom available. This is server four. Paying $25 extra to have a huge advantage is exactly what Blizzard was claiming to denounce, yet here we are.
With regards to gear in lower lvl brackets 1-59...

First, go back and get rid of the WSG, AB, and AV vendors (heck even get rid of the reps since they arent worth anything but achievements now).

All that gear they used to sell? Retool them and have them itemized for PvP (i mean they do cost honor, yet are itemized for PvE and pretty substandard comparatively speaking)

Have that gear split evenly between the x0-x4 and the x5-x9 brackets.

So that all players, new or old, twinked or casual have an equal shot at getting *some* pvp gear and will bring down a little of the gear wall that exists today.

Yes, toons with BoAs will still have a higher gear advantage, but not as big overall as they do now.

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