Items - New Class Restrictions 12/13/2011

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12/13/2011 01:51 PMPosted by Matuk
Check Atlasloot or even the dungeon journal, this only affects LFR loot.


I know it only affects LFR loot but the point is if I am raiding on my alt Paladin I would like to be able to roll on the best gear i can use. I am not going to be focusing on Normals or Heroics on her while I am still clearing on my main.
OffhandLedger of Revolting Rituals - Druid, Priest


I wish this wasnt non-Shaman.. I know we get the shield, but I would rather have the OH then the shield I think... Most would...
12/13/2011 01:48 PMPosted by Jubba
Would you like some examples?)


would you like to shed more tears over LFR loot? get the 10/25 regmode one instead.

If you're the type of casual player this system was designed for then yes, it is absolutely best in slot.


LFR is to see content, not get the absolute best items you can get.

and if your only doing LFR, then the shield is now BiS because its the best item YOU CAN GET.

this entire argument is rediculous!

1: if LFR is the best raid you can do because of time/etc then dont worry about it! the difference is MARGINAL if all your doing is LFR!

2: if your doing reg/heroic DS then just get the higher up one! again, NO BIG DEAL!

the community for this game willl cry and complain and act as if any tiny change is the complete END OF THE WORLD i swear.

think this way instead:
Str/Agi toons cant ninja anything from you anymore.

isnt that worth it?

Then I have to ask--

Why do you care? Why do you care about stopping paladins and shamans from rolling on your gear, when you can run a real raid with your guild and get something better anyway?
Raidfinder was amusing at first until you realized that people were needing because they could and also so that they could hand items to guild mates they were running with to increase their odds.

Something had to be done. I'm sure there are items in this list people don't agree with. There are a few I don't agree with.

Blizzard, do rogues really need 4 weapons on that list PLUS an epic/legendary dagger chain (plus at least one other agility mace in the raid instance) compared to other classes getting one choice such as Souldrinker which on it's own is controversial because tanks argue it is a tank weapon and DKs want it because it is the only 1H weapon that drops off this boss that they can use? (merely citing one example as I am sure there are a few.)

Some of these weapons may not be bis but may still be legitimate upgrades in the case of no other drops. Itemization and drop coverage is pretty poor overall in Dragonsoul. It is too bad they didn't implement something similar to Sunwell with gear trades. Trade an agility axe for a strength version or something. Just throwing out some ideas, nothing more.

Either way something desperately needed to be done with the looting issues.
12/13/2011 01:55 PMPosted by Øtaku
Would you like some examples?)


would you like to shed more tears over LFR loot? get the 10/25 regmode one instead.

My shaman is enhancement/enhancement, but nice assumption. If all you have is elitism left instead of those excuses you call an argument, have fun with that.
you get the following gains on the shield20 Int8 Spi14 Haste (0.11%)


Wrong.. Assuming you put a Red Int Gem in the OH, you end up netting almost 40 more int...

Shield:
240int
360sta
160spi
160haste
40int enchant
TOTAL
280int
360sta
160Haste

OH:
220int
360sta
152spi
146haste
+50 Int (Red Gem Slot with Epic Gem)
+10 Socket Bonus
+40int Enchant
TOTAL -
320int (310 without epic gem)
360sta
152Spirit
146haste

One of these is clearly better........... (PvE Wise, as Armor doesnt matter much in PvE)
12/13/2011 01:59 PMPosted by Jubba


would you like to shed more tears over LFR loot? get the 10/25 regmode one instead.

My shaman is enhancement/enhancement, but nice assumption. If all you have is elitism left instead of those excuses you call an argument, have fun with that.


then i have to ask:

why do YOU care?

Just here to troll? Enjoy being a Troublemaker?
12/13/2011 02:01 PMPosted by Sukodin
you get the following gains on the shield20 Int8 Spi14 Haste (0.11%)


Wrong.. Assuming you put a Red Int Gem in the OH, you end up netting almost 40 more int...

Shield:
240int
360sta
160spi
160haste
40int enchant
TOTAL
280int
360sta
160Haste

OH:
220int
360sta
152spi
146haste
+50 Int (Red Gem Slot with Epic Gem)
+10 Socket Bonus
+40int Enchant
TOTAL -
320int (310 without epic gem)
360sta
152Spirit
146haste

One of these is clearly better........... (PvE Wise, as Armor doesnt matter much in PvE)


Yup, and one of them isnt Available to your class. move along. the differnce is marginal if you are only doing LFR. if your doing 10/25 or heroic modes, then you can upgrade. Non-issue.

My shaman is enhancement/enhancement, but nice assumption. If all you have is elitism left instead of those excuses you call an argument, have fun with that.


then i have to ask:

why do YOU care?

Just here to troll? Enjoy being a Troublemaker?

I asked first.


then i have to ask:

why do YOU care?

Just here to troll? Enjoy being a Troublemaker?

I asked first.

i diddnt realize i was talking to a six year old.

/ignore
12/13/2011 01:54 PMPosted by Meril
Check Atlasloot or even the dungeon journal, this only affects LFR loot.


I know it only affects LFR loot but the point is if I am raiding on my alt Paladin I would like to be able to roll on the best gear i can use. I am not going to be focusing on Normals or Heroics on her while I am still clearing on my main.

The best gear you can use doesn't come from LFR.

They made this change to specifically address concerns with the Need+ system as it currently stands, with all it's flaws.

Example: Before this change, Prot Pallies would get a +100 roll on the Agi axe from Madness.
Great, thanks for screwing around with my paladin's loot drops. The only thing I won last week was the Ledger of Revolting Rituals and it was much better than my last offhand which was the ilevel 365 offhand (which was also not a shield) from the Fireland dailies. I will not be running DS with my guild in normal mode as I don't have the time.

What you could have done is restrict LFR loot drops to certain classes via using the bonus rolls (eg druids and priests get the loot role bonus) so that if they didn't need the offhand, the paladins and shamans get a go, but noooooo, thats too much work. The complete lack of foresight in dealing with these issues by applying this as a solution now is pathetic. You know how much people value loot drops by the way you make them so hard to get, and this is robbing the playerbase of the loot they won because of QQ.

Lets go and do this to normal and heroic mode loot so we can tell the raiders how to play too. Oh that's right, that's not going to happen because that would restrict their usage of the items in an unfair way. Another black mark against the devs as far as I'm concerned.
As someone that has the option to actually get non-LFR, I still this this is incredibly stupid. How hard would it have been to add simple checks so people couldn't roll on gear they effectively couldn't use? Or better yet, just don't give them a roll bonus.

There's a number of these items that could see legitimate use by players early in gear progression even if they're not optimal, mostly looking at the Spirit items or something like No'kaled for a tank that wants a fun threat toy.

Adding class restrictions just screams lazy. Instead of actually fixing the way bonus rolls are handled, you just added a bunch of class restrictions and bonus rolls still don't work properly. Case in point: I got a bonus roll on a piece of Spirit mail while LFRing as Enhancement earlier. Granted it worked out, my primary spec is Resto and there were literally no Resto or Elemental Shaman in the raid, but the system is still broken.

Not allowing Shaman or Paladins to use the Spirit offhand just shows ignorance.

I really cannot emphasize enough, even as a player that this largely does not affect, how disheartening it is to see this level of laziness from the Blizzard design team.
then i have to ask:

why do YOU care?


Because I care about people other than myself. Fancy that.



I know it only affects LFR loot but the point is if I am raiding on my alt Paladin I would like to be able to roll on the best gear i can use. I am not going to be focusing on Normals or Heroics on her while I am still clearing on my main.

The best gear you can use doesn't come from LFR.

They made this change to specifically address concerns with the Need+ system as it currently stands, with all it's flaws.

Example: Before this change, Prot Pallies would get a +100 roll on the Agi axe from Madness.


I am not saying that the changes weren't needed. What I am saying is that if I can use it and it has the appropriate stats for my role / spec then Blizzard has failed at making a smarter system.
12/13/2011 02:01 PMPosted by Sukodin
you get the following gains on the shield20 Int8 Spi14 Haste (0.11%)


Wrong.. Assuming you put a Red Int Gem in the OH, you end up netting almost 40 more int...

Shield:
240int
360sta
160spi
160haste
40int enchant
TOTAL
280int
360sta
160Haste

OH:
220int
360sta
152spi
146haste
+50 Int (Red Gem Slot with Epic Gem)
+10 Socket Bonus
+40int Enchant
TOTAL -
320int (310 without epic gem)
360sta
152Spirit
146haste

One of these is clearly better........... (PvE Wise, as Armor doesnt matter much in PvE)
what do you mean clearly? how come you conveniently didn't count the spirit on the shield?

I asked first.

i diddnt realize i was talking to a six year old.

/ignore

Is this person serious or a troll? They believe there's never been an oversight in itemization on Blizzard's behalf, yet couldn't care less if there's examples that disprove that. When asked why they're even in this thread, all they can do is ask the very same, and call the other poster immature for not answering...

If anyone should be ignored in this thread, I think I've found who it should be.

Thank you! Thank you! Thank you!

Just one observation...can this ring please have hunter removed from it? It's got expertise! It's not a hunter ring!

Seal of Primordial Shadow - Druid, Hunter, Shaman, Rogue

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