Blizz: Only Gameplay, orcs, and humans matter

General Discussion
Post Limit:
Prev 1 5 6 7 26 Next
04/12/2012 04:55 PMPosted by Skytotem
What's your opinion on this? Metzen stated in his interview that only orcs and humans matter, so why do we even have the other races? Aesthetics?

Are you really this much of an idiot.

I mean, you clearly took that completely out of context.
04/12/2012 06:40 PMPosted by Reknarok
What's your opinion on this? Metzen stated in his interview that only orcs and humans matter, so why do we even have the other races? Aesthetics?

Are you really this much of an idiot.

I mean, you clearly took that completely out of context.


With coupled with other things from various interviews and the direction they claim they want. no, he didn't.
04/12/2012 06:40 PMPosted by Reknarok
What's your opinion on this? Metzen stated in his interview that only orcs and humans matter, so why do we even have the other races? Aesthetics?

Are you really this much of an idiot.

I mean, you clearly took that completely out of context.


Oh, clearly.

Despite the game's validation of his interpretation.

Clearly it was out of context. And that equally clearly renders the entire post worthless.

I mean, clearly.
04/12/2012 05:26 PMPosted by Ferlion
Why, exactly would I want to follow a king who is not only thousands of years younger, but who you claim was delibratly written to be an !@#$%^- (and sorry for the language thing here, and I'll have to find the interview, but it was Blizzards words, and not mine).

This, again, can be drawn back to my reason for responding to this thread. You don't have the exact quote, but you're claiming we said Varian was written to be an [expletive deleted]. I don't know what quote you're referring to because, well, neither do you it seems. But I think I know where the general phrase you picked up on came from.

Chris said in interviews during the Mists of Pandaria press tour that Varian was written with several character flaws, and we expected him to have likability issues. The whole point was to create a character who was a little rough around the edges. It makes for a more interesting story when you see a flawed individual rise up to the challenges of being a truly great leader, which is what we have in store for Varian this expansion. So it was important for us to give him a bit of dimension in terms of personality.

Now, sure, I'm paraphrasing what Chris said as well. The difference here though is I sat in with him on multiple interviews where he relayed this sentiment. So my paraphrasing is more accurate than yours. :p

04/12/2012 05:26 PMPosted by Ferlion
If what he was saying has been taken "out of context" then why are you making such efforts to ensure humans and orcs are always the "guys in charge" or superior to everyone else?

We're not going out of our way to ensure they're always the ones in charge. But that's been the natural progression since the Horde were founded more or less under absolute rule by the most powerful chief of the most powerful orc clan.

04/12/2012 05:26 PMPosted by Ferlion
And even the High King idea (which frankly shatters what many feel is the thematic of an Alliance) seems to support this idea.

Similar to what I said about the Horde above, the Alliance formed an allegiance around human kingdoms. If you're suggesting they're thematically better served by a republic or democracy, Azeroth lore says otherwise.
04/12/2012 06:15 PMPosted by Drinzul
The story team feels very out-of-touch with it's customer. Honestly, it feels more like trying to get a senator to see your issues, than a company that has historically been top tier when it comes to fan interaction.


You nailed it, my friend :)
Just compare Ghostcrawler forum activity against Metzen's :( While most of the time GC explains what he does, why he does it (whenever he can, of course), and most people here loves him for doing that, we get to know what happens with Metzen only if someone stalks his twitter or someone finds an interview somewhere. It does feel precisely, like completely out of touch :(

Because, in my opinion, the dev team is doing an awesome job listening to feedback and opinions in MoP :)

04/12/2012 06:45 PMPosted by Zarhym
It makes for a more interesting story when you see a flawed individual rise up to the challenges of being a truly great leader


... nothing personal, my friend, but last i heard, we are de-throning Garrosh in this next expansion :(
04/12/2012 06:35 PMPosted by Velyia
I'm not assuming you're getting a story. Over the years I saw that Blizz has a production schedule that makes them work on games years in advance to their production phase. I'd guess that story writing for every expansion is very early in the pre-production phase of their game and that they base their graphics, quest design and probably other things on that


Negative. Blizzard base their pre-production on what they want the players to experience or what they think the players would like to experience. Once they have the experience and gameplay in mind they then give their ideas to the story writers to try and fit a story in there somewhere.
04/12/2012 05:09 PMPosted by Vilkas
I guess this explains why Worgen Lore ended after the Gilneas starting zone. :l


I forget the name of the CM who joined as a lore community cm and then was gone in a blink of an eye, reassigned. But to me lore only matters if controlled by a small handful of Blizzard employees who have fallen in love with only certain characters and ideas, and it's only a small handful of each.

Worgen lore is important, if you play horde. Horde being one of those certain ideas.
04/12/2012 05:07 PMPosted by Zarhym
You didn't just quote him out of context. You changed the meaning of what he said altogether:


While I don't necessarily agree with the extreme to which Skytotem interpreted the statement, I do want to bring up one point:

"...the pillars of the franchise are orcs and humans; it really is the Alliance and Horde by extension


Metzen himself calls them pillars which, by definition, indicates that they are central to the story and that the Alliance and the Horde are "by extension", which means that the Alliance and the Horde are "affected by something only because they are connected to what you have just mentioned."

Given this, that the Orcs and Humans are central to the story and that the Horde and the Alliance only exist because of their [edit: the Orcs and Humans] presence and importance to the story -- in Metzen's own words -- is it really so much of a misinterpretation as you seem to think?
04/12/2012 06:45 PMPosted by Zarhym
Similar to what I said about the Horde above, the Alliance formed an allegiance around human kingdoms. If you're suggesting they're thematically better served by a republic or democracy, Azeroth lore says otherwise.


An Alliance formed around a human kingdom. Sure, Stormwind might be what all the other nations are gathered around, but not what they want to place on a pedastel. What reason is there for beings like Velen, Tyrande and Malfurion bowing to a human who hasn't lived half a century?
I forget the name of the CM who joined as a lore community cm and then was gone in a blink of an eye, reassigned. But to me lore only matters if controlled by a small handful of Blizzard employees who have fallen in love with only certain characters and ideas, and it's only a small handful of each.

Worgen lore is important, if you play horde. Horde being one of those certain ideas.


Nyolorth, fired or reassigned mid ask-the-lore-team-contest too.
I think it's more of an exaggeration really. The Horde and Alliance had to have its beginnings somewhere, and Orcs and Humans were those beginnings. It's not off base to say then that they were the pillars upon which both factions were built. Because they were. But it's not even close to the same as saying they're the only ones that matter, as the OP seemed to suggest.
04/12/2012 06:51 PMPosted by Tianjan
But it's not even close to the same as saying they're the only ones that matter, as the OP seemed to suggest.


I would like to point out that the quote from Metzen is in the present tense. Not they "were" the pillars of the franchise. They ARE.
So, regardless of whether I am or not, I'm not posting or playing anymore.

I don't enjoy the game, and whether the problem is me or not, it's all done with.

Goodbye and I hope everyone does whatever they think is best.

Okay, thanks for your feedback, Skytotem. You've certainly put a lot of time and effort into sharing it. I'll give you that.
Similar to what I said about the Horde above, the Alliance formed an allegiance around human kingdoms. If you're suggesting they're thematically better served by a republic or democracy, Azeroth lore says otherwise.


Setting aside the fact that during the formation of the Alliance, there were 7 super strong human kingdoms, and then the other races, and setting aside the fact that even then, the High Elves were only ever fringe allies that didn't really give way to the whims of a High King..

The Alliance has historically always been run by a council.

The fate of the Orcs was decided by vote.
The construction of Nethergarde was decided by vote.
The admitiance of new members was decided by vote.
The fate of Alterac was decided by vote.

Now, there were political plays. Lordearon, being the strongest kingdom, had a lot of backing to its votes, and other kingdoms would vote with it to appease them. This is politics.

But even Terenas never held the position of a High King, which is historically speaking more akin to an Emperor. What he says goes. Absolute power.

Now, sure, I'm paraphrasing what Chris said as well. The difference here though is I sat in with him on multiple interviews where he relayed this sentiment. So my paraphrasing is more accurate than yours. :p


Fair enough!

We're not going out of our way to ensure they're always the ones in charge. But that's been the natural progression since the Horde were founded more or less under absolute rule by the most powerful chief of the most powerful orc clan.


Again, when the Horde was first formed, Orcs were pretty much it. Now the Orcs numbers are not only lesser, but the Tauren, Trolls, and other races are also much bigger players than they were in the original horde.

The political landscape has changed. The Orcs are not the power they once were.
Zarhym, for my entire Warcraft experience on these forums you have always been a great CM, you have sympathize with fans, you have given us direct answers when you were able, you have been one of the best.

Why can you not see that a lot of us players feel disconnected from the story, from the intentions of Metzen and the lore team, and from the overall experience, especially compared to the horde story.

Above everything these complaints are met with closed ears, or worse - condescending statements.

A story is good because the listeners enjoy it, not because the teller says it is good.
04/12/2012 06:49 PMPosted by Bullcowsby
"...the pillars of the franchise are orcs and humans; it really is the Alliance and Horde by extension


Metzen himself calls them pillars which, by definition, indicates that they are central to the story and that the Alliance and the Horde are "by extension", which means that the Alliance and the Horde are "affected by something only because they are connected to what you have just mentioned."

Given this, that the Orcs and Humans are central to the story and that the Horde and the Alliance only exist because of their [edit: the Orcs and Humans] presence and importance to the story -- in Metzen's own words -- is it really so much of a misinterpretation as you seem to think?


Yeah the quote is pretty clear. The pillars of the franchise are orcs and humans which is the alliance and horde by extension. I don't know why the blue felt the need to derail the thread, if you actually look at the story presented in the game it is MOSTLY orcs and humans, with a spattering of Night elves and forsaken, the other 8 races are not developed much at all.

It's sad really.
04/12/2012 06:52 PMPosted by Bullcowsby
But it's not even close to the same as saying they're the only ones that matter, as the OP seemed to suggest.


I would like to point out that the quote from Metzen is in the present tense. Not they "were" the pillars of the franchise. They ARE.


Okay, so you build something on stilts. You build up, you expand. Those stilts are still part of the structure.

Not the best analogy, but the best I can come up with this close to bed.

I mean, I get that Skytotem is upset, but I'm sorry, this was a case of purposeful exaggeration of something taken out of context. It's taking this whole 'we're getting screwed over' thing out of the territory where it can be useful and and turning it into something very volatile. Nothing good can come of that.
Please stop with the insults towards Zarth. This is a chance to get a discussion going, and this aint helping.
I hate to point this out, but I'm pretty sure that at this point it's impossible for anyone, especially Blizzard, to actually ignore all this.

Join the Conversation