5.0.4 and Beyond – A Protection Warrior Guide

To answer your question Clutche no I have not tanked on beta yet at 90, I was basing this off what I've read and just my experiences so far in game after patch.

09/02/2012 12:06 PMPosted by Kangarooster
So where's your source saying Mastery is flat-out better than Parry for rage generation? Additionally, I personally tested if Shield Block still makes excess block chance overflow into Critical block as it used to prepatch - currently it doesn't seem to be the case. That alone makes Mastery lose a lot of value, since a LOT of the portion giving actual block chance does nothing while Shield Block is up

I never said mastery was better than parry I said I believe they are of equal value.
Currently on live, no shield block doesnt push our extra block chance over to critical block.

Since the avoidance roll comes first outside of shied block parry is greater than mastery both from a mitigation and dps perspective.

Completely naked at 85 mastery is 17.6% and block is 17.07% of that 17.07% 4% is gained from mastery and crit block chance is 17%

at 19% mastery block chance is 17% crit block chance 19%

at 22% mastery block chance is 18% crit block chance is 23%

at 25% mastery block chance is 18% crit block chance is 25%

at 31% mastery block chance is 20% crit block chance is 31%

at 40% mastery block chance is 22% and crit block chance is 40%

Depending on shield block up time though mastery becomes more and more important the more we have shield block active

Mastery increases our crit block chance much more than our block chance.

So did the diminishing returns they instituted with the patch only apply to the block portion of mastery and not the critical block portion?

Besides the disparity between parry and mastery importance what else in the post is wrong?
Two cents, keeping in mind I haz no beta invite, so no beta testing possible for me.

In my experience, shield block is superior to barrier in just about every case. It makes your incoming damage much less spikey, and it's a godsend against fast hitting bosses or against multiple mobs.

Barrier is extremely useful in certain senarios (eg, eating imaples on madness, where a nice juicy barrier can mitigate an enormous amount of damage), but otherwise, shield block blows barrier entirely out of the water.
If anything the feed back loop effect of mastery and shield block would put mastery > parry.

More mastery = more crit blocks = more rage = more shield blocks

There's only a 9 sec cooldown on shield block so it's entirely possible for almost 100% uptime between it and shield barrier.

If anything that just makes me conclude that parry > mastery outside of shidl block obviously due to the avoidance roll occuring first, but as we gain more and more mastery the uptime on shield block and shield barrier increases towards 100%.

So maybe its better to say at low gear levels parry > mastery at higher gear levels it will be the reverse.
I find that keeping a good mix of parry and mastery helps me with softening up the damage, with parry slightly ahead of block %

You will gain 10 rage from critical blocks but its much easier to just have revenge's cooldown refreshed from a parry.
It should also be pointed out that in the current vengeance system, our health pool ( ie: Stamina ) has absolutely zero impact, it's determined entirely by the incoming damage with no health pool based cap.

That's not to say stamina isn't nice, but you'd want to sit down and do the math for lvl90 to determine the best way to achieve maximum EH from gems given the large amount of secondary stats they now provide.

It may well turn out that using pure red and yellow gems is the superior option.

edit: Sparkle, your mog makes my eyes hurt.....so.......shiny.....
you honestly can tank with your guide howevrer it is not optimal, sparkle carries more weight with their name than anyone here, and has contradicted many things you said.

parry avoids an entire attack where block stops some dmg, more if it crits.

you have 50% + chance to not avoid an attack, and even more not to block an attack but should you land a roll in that oh say 30% chance to block, its even less chance to crit block. last time ill touch mastery being inferior to parry as revenge is more reliable to get rage.

you discuss things that help dps, but the main focus of us as a tank is survival/aggro. simply stating "helps with threat" is all you need. exclude any "dps increase" as it will take forum readers on a journey to max out tank dps which matters only once their at certain content which means they know the class well enough to not need a guide anymore. you hinder them with these sayings.

given you yourself stating stamina>all i fail to understand why you would post in here to go for socket colors when stamina is the best? especially when its a dodge bonus...i mean thats just bad blanketed info thats something to be removed.

many things you wrote have the phrases, "in my opinion", or " i personally". this is a great guide and those phrases work when a guildy asks you " hey bud help me tank brah"

but a guide for the whole community needs to be more thorough and have a much better layout. and not be so personal experience, and more statistical fact. opinions are some times right, but fact is always true and until you have those please refrain from spreading this aids equivalant of information.

thanks for the effort put into the guide but if i see too many sticky request ill have to get ahold of some buddies and have them also report this thread to prevent its sticky.
Iwiperaids. I like you. And not just because of the first line, or your transmog. .. Okay, maybe the transmog has something to do with it. :3
The thing about going mastery over parry is that the dmg you take will be less spiky. If you go for hit/exp you will use shield block a lot and with mastery you will have a good chance that most of those block are critical blocks. You see critical block doesn't have DR so it help mastery edge out parry.


While I admit I don't agree 100% with either guide, they're both pretty straight on and more or less opposite to this one in regards to what stats to stack- and I agree with that part of it.

In order to gain the most rage possible and therefore soak damage effectively, it would probably be mastery>expertise>hit>parry. I don't even list dodge only for now because with T13 gear it's pretty abysmal. My Windwalk added 2%, so I switched my tank enchant to Landslide because at least that helps barrier. Mastery obviously is higher for critical blocking, however if one wanted or needed to gear for a specific magic-heavy fight, you might put expertise parry cap and hit cap as the priority over mastery. That's situational at best and entirely hypothetical.
09/02/2012 07:51 AMPosted by Galodred
I have one question though. If Dodge isn't suffering as greatly from diminishing returns why can I have more of it than parry on my gear, but see less Dodge % chance on my stat sheet? Is it a matter of even though I stacked more Dodge during Cataclysm, the smaller diminishing returns still lowered it to beneath usefulness?

Dodge does suffer more from diminishing returns thats why. I even stated that.

Parry sources from rating on gear and from str suffers a shared diminishing return, however the diminishing returns from dodge are much more harsh making dodge less desirable.

You're a jerk. I asked for clarification for a question raised by your loopy guide-writing and you have the nerve to condescend to me? Get off these forums. Nobody is going to want you here.
Well i gotta say.. excellent arguments between the both... Helped me alot to get a solid base on gemming/reforging my warrior which was my main concern Thanks Galodred for the vast information and Sparkle for additional information.. I'm currently testing different stats to see which would be better.. good luck and have fun.. :)
First let me say that I'm new to warriors and tanking. So I'm really trying to read up on what to do. I just dinged 85 and I'm horribly under geared. Which may just be a good chunk of my issues I'm having. Basically my main issue I'm seeing is holding any sort of aggro. Dosen't seem to matter what I do as soon as anyone else hits the mob I loose them. Usually I run with the guild and they are all 395+ ilvl. Not sure if that has anything to do with it. (currently I'm at 350 and working on it) but it happens with I pug a group too just not as bad.

But I'll either charge or heroic leap in, Sheild slam,thunder clap, devistate, to start it off. usually keep spaming devistate, toss out a revenge, And then basically spam any proc's that come up.

And yes I'm in defensive stance. But I can never keep the mob/boss on me. I'm in a learning curve and very noobish to this (almost exclusivly run my hunter so this is a whole new world) But I've had fun leveling this toon and want to get profecient with it. I'm going to try the "Guide" here and see if that helps. But I'm definatly up for any suggestions. I haven't really enchanted or gemmed much as I'm just switching out gear all the time still.
without trying to be a total douche...your gear sucks. you are a fresh 85 and nobody had great gear at 85. so your issues is a lot to do with the guys youre running with.

however to answer this question now rather than have you come back later geared...your hit and exp are what we in the tank world call threat stats. the more oyu have the more likely you are to hit things in the face ( who likes getting hit in the face?) bringing these stats up will not only increase threat but also rage regen. since youre a shunned belf in this forum, ya know hiding the fact you lack a beard with that helmet and all, you will need 769 exp rating and hit rating. these equal 7.5% each

do not simply "toss out a revenege" you spam that button! it should never be off cd for more than 1 gcd, and thats only because youre too busy shield slamming.

with this thread, ( i refuse the word guide here) read the entire thing as there are a lot of minds throwing their 2 cents making a dollars worth of info in here. read it, take from it what you will. but threat issues are explained by 1 thing in your case. hit/exp :D
I actually would not gem for parry at all. STR and Parry both give the exact same parry stat rating. I've tested this by swapping parry gems for str gems and my parry rating didn't move. Why only gain one benefit? Might as well get the STR so you can get parry and AP.
Don't think that as a douche comment at all. Trust me I know the gear sucks. I haven't had much luck with drops in the instances yet. But working on it. Should I try to reforge the crap I have to get more Hit/Exp? the guild keeps telling me for now to just dump everything I have into mastery and not worry about anything else until I get the right gear. Or maybe just gem for mastery. Don't think I've actually reforged anything yet on this toon.

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