Disc Priests Definitely Need Survivability

Priest
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It's not complicated and I am surprised Blizzard couldn't see the design problem.

Focused Will was a mandatory passive ability for the disc priest given we had no mobility. In MOP, we are given additional mobility and no Focused Will. The problem is that the mobility options are on a cooldown. We die to just about all melee (except for rogues this season...lol) when our escape abilities are on cooldown without Focused Will. The class is currently broken in PvP.

In summary:

Dear Blizzard,

Focused Will was passive and up 100% of the time. Our escape abilities are on a cooldown. Therefore we die like butter melting on a hot frying pan. One more thing, you couldn't figure that out without player feedback ?


By additional mobility you mean...Phantasm? Shield freedom was infinitely better for mobility than Phantasm is. And Phantasm is needed for CC and damage avoidance, using it on mobility sucks. We had much, much more mobility with shield freedom than we do now. If we really have any now to begin with. =/


Actually having that 4 piece back as a personal bonus baked in for Discipline would go like, 80% the way to fixing our mobility issues. It isn't too bad now considering Weakened Soul only has 2s sliced off it with a hard-cast heal so you can't exactly spam freedoms. But really, I have DK's, Warriors, Monks (and to a lesser extent) Rogues with near 100% uptime on me. I can't get away. Oh and wtf seriously can Warriors Charge me whilst faded?

Spectral Guise is awesome but also pretty buggy; I literally get maybe two-three seconds at the absolute most of invisibility even though I always go invis after popping Fade and then Cleanse. I seemingly get pulled out for no reason - and what is with this doppleganger !@#$? Can you just remove that easily tab-targeted, 3 shottable (by DoTs as well, btw thanks for making SG really %^-* against DK's with the glyph that makes diseases undispellable but reduces their damage by 30%) mannequin garbage. Can I just have 6 seconds of Faded stealth. Please? I mean against what it matters most, DK's and Warriors - both with slows that I can only fade once every 30 seconds (but then have immediately reapplied via AoE ala Howling Blast and Piercing Howl) so they have near 100% uptime I don't have a mechanism to reliably run away if I need to. Ever.
http://hydramist.tv/mists-of-pandaria/priests-mists-of-pandaria-and-you-a-comprehensive-analysis-of-disc-priests-today/
10/04/2012 10:19 AMPosted by Anurakis
http://hydramist.tv/mists-of-pandaria/priests-mists-of-pandaria-and-you-a-comprehensive-analysis-of-disc-priests-today/


Pretty much the best summary I've read of what's wrong. I particularly like his point that we're the only class with 2 major glyph slots.
It's unfortunate that to remain highly competitive many priests will chose to abandon the discipline spec, but it can't be helped in its current state, and a good many other 1800+ (I know that's not amazing compared to some of the rating's i've seen here) priests that I know as friends as competitors feel forced to go shadow.

There are many issues, but the one I fail to understand is mana. There is no excuse that can be made about pvp being difficult to balance via playtesting that explains the horrendous state of discipline priest mana. Was there not enough pve going on where this would've been reflected comparatively againist other healers in the logs? I feel that there would have to be some sort of discrepancy here, that would've translated to more balance on this issue. There was a bit of tuning with it I know, but it's still a very very long way off.

What I find most annoying though are the priest lvl 90 talent tree. They are almost non-relevant in pvp, and that's pretty ridiculous. I fail to understand why this tier could not have been used at least semiproductively in pvp, but its not, it's just a complete mess. The directionality of divine star makes it completely useless, and the entire tree breaks CC non-discrimanantly. I have to say I am VERY dissappointed in this regard.

I love the discipline spec because it's an active, offensive and damage prevention healer with little downtime, there's always an offensive dispel, and a time to burst with your teammates that makes this spec fun as heck to play. I hope it can come back to this base, but right now our damage and survivability are so low, you can't play this way because you're simply too busy fending off the wolves, or OOM.

Zelyx, I really appreciate the post as you are a good ambassador of discipline pvp.
However, I fear that this thread may not get much visability of the priest forums, perhaps it could be moved, or reworded in more a list of greivance type of style, where it may get some attention from blues.
I noticed something else in arena last night that's changed for priests. Having aoe fear and mind control on a healer used to be pretty unique and something that made priests desirable. That's no longer the case, the other healers have all gotten more CC. Holy paladins have HoJ, Repentance, an AoE blind, and an interrupt. Shamans have Hex, an AoE stun, and a ranged interrupt. And druids still have clone and bash.

Holy pallies in particular can pull off quite a CC chain with HoJ, Repent and their blind effect all being on different DRs.
I was in my PvE gear and had to gather wood for the Tillers Quest to get another 4 plots.

Those crabs respawn faster than I could kill them. A few times I came close to dying and had to resurface and run.

Crabs. With 100K health. Minions. Not even like, real mobs.

I'm not even talking PvP.
Im too lazy to level my druid to 90...
signed.

playing shadow and disc atm.. one kick, interrupt = dead pretty much
signed.

playing shadow and disc atm.. one faked kick, gag order = dead pretty much


fixed that for you
I think I'll just take a break from PvP until its been improved. Honestly, some of the changes in MoP are completely counter-intuitive and needless. Did warriors really need another cooldown to add to their swifty-one-shot macros? No. In fact, that's the last thing they needed. It's the last thing the game needed, too.

Why does every class have 3+ cooldowns they can just pop and do insane damage/healing until its over and they're mortal again? That devalues every form of skill in PvP. CC, and thus CC avoidance, positioning, decision-making, everything. Every patch, every expansion, more and more this power creep grows. At this point they need to just start taking things out, one by one, removing abilities until the cooldown-popping madness settles down.

Hopefully the next major patch will set some of this straight. Maybe I'll try out pet battles while I wait.
When I posted this thread, it was pre-MoP at lvl 85, so I didn't completely know what I was to expect at 90. I think it's safe to say I can no longer compete competitively in the arena as a disc priest this season, unless major changes happen for discipline priests.

A lot of what you guys said is true, Disc priests are absolutely terrible, and I hear it's no different for PvE. There is so much wrong with them, and it pains me to watch us be forced to play something else again (Like shadow which I have no intention of playing). I personally am not too upset since I no longer have anything more to achieve in this game, but I feel terrible for my fellow priests that were starting to do great and learned a lot from me last season (I make instructional videos).

You take away our damage, mobility, utility, survivability, and now even our healing, and as a result, you take away the fun in disc priests. If I was a class developer I would ask: What are some of the special features of this class?

For example, Druids are known for mobility, HoTs, CC, and now even damage and also better at damage mitigation than disc priests (Ironbark 30 second CD)
Disc Priests WERE known for damage mitigation, burst damage that actually mattered to the team, better dispels than others, good penance ticks, mana burn, fears, CC prevention (sw:D not glyphed) etc.
Most of the above have been removed. Good job.

Anyway for those interested, here is my latest priest video (pre-MoP 5.0): I did say at the time that priests didn't look too bad in this video lol, boy was I wrong. My next video will probably be druid perspective....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hZIfq-DI1RU
Seriously fix this cr*p priests are not even viable anymore! I am so sick of getting downed in seconds and getting critted on with 50% damage reduction from resil and gettign hit for 150k-200k in one hit! is this some kind of joke blizzard?!
Playing disc atm makes me want to kill myself :(

Mana regen/rapture and survivability is dismal.

Buff Disc!

Ps: Nerf Warriors and hunters
I regret buying MoP. Thats how bad it is...
Bringing my post over from my topic.

It's still early in the expansion and people are still gaining stronger gear so this is subject to change. Though there are some extremely noticeable issues with both Disc and Shadow which make us extremely underpowered and I don't see us being extremely strong anywhere outside of Shadow in RBGs.

Discipline
- Mana Regeneration
- Throughput
- Sustainability
- Survivability
- Utility
- Offensive Pressure

The strength in the past with Discipline was the fact we had the worst mana regeneration but we had Mana Burn to evenup the fights. We could take another healers mana to keep them on par with us. In the current state we out of mana ourselves much faster than other healers. We lack anyway to put offensive pressure on the enemy team. With the combination of Dispels/Mana Burn and SW:D being castable at anytime we've lost the ability have an aggressive playstyle. This allows other healers to purposely drag out matches to the point we can't compete. Our Defensive Cooldowns are Lackluster most times we're still able to be killed with them on us. All in all we're very weak and unless you're an exceptional player with exceptional teammates getting high rated is going to be a huge struggle for any Disc especially as damage continues to climb from people getting PvP Weapons and Malevolent PvP Gear.

Shadow
- Damage Output(Arena)
- Offensive Pressure

Shadow is in a much better position than Disc. In RBGs we perform wonderfully and can excel at keeping pressure out for other DPS and our team. Our Damage on the larger battlefield allows for more of our DoT's to stay up as enemy healers are under more pressure. Our issue is in Arena. Even with Dispel on an 8 Second Cooldown we lack the ability to put out substantial damage alone. The fact we went from being a controlled bursr type to a RNG burst type is literally atrocious in small scale PvP. There are many times where you can just have poor luck and never get the chance to burst. On top of the fact in 2v2 Shadow/Healer is nearly impossible to win with because self healing is through the roof on most DPS classes. It's almost like Facing Rogues with the old recuprerate 1v1 again. Healers can dispel our DoT's with little to no penalty. Even with Sin and Punishment they can complete shut out our ability to get any Burst oppurtunities. Warriors have near 100% uptime on us. The changes made to Shadow have all but removed our synergy we had with other classes. While hoping and waiting to generate Procs to burst we're handicapped into being reliant on RNG and inconsistent Burst.

Without a change to either of the playstyles that brings back Disciplines Survival,Utility and Pressure or Shadows controlled and reliable burst play we're going to fall short in Arena as gear climbs higher and our damage stagnates. Hopefully this isn't the case in full PvP gear. This is just what I've noticed myself.
10/09/2012 08:00 AMPosted by Kardona
The strength in the past with Discipline was the fact we had the worst mana regeneration but we had Mana Burn to evenup the fights


I don't really agree - our strength in the past was our CC, dispels, and ability to pressure in general with damage or mana burn. The loss of mana burn was not alone what broke us. The problem was we also lost our damage, our CC advantage, and our dispel advantage (and our healing throughput, mana, survivability, etc).
10/06/2012 03:06 PMPosted by Sodiumx
Im too lazy to level my druid to 90...
I agree 100% with Zylex. What Blizzard did to Disc Priest is disgusting. I don't enjoy playing my Disc priest anymore and I feel forced to play Shadow even though i really don't want to, but I do, just in order to be "viable" for PVP. Can't believe I wasted my time leveling a Priest.

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