Warlock PvE dps very low?

Warlock
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Wha? How can you possibly mess up the rotation of a warlock? Tbh ever since 5.0.4, all the rotations of warlock has been dumbed down significantly (except maybe for demo). That's one of the reasons why I got bored with my lock despite how strong they are now especially affliction.

Soulburn > Soul Swap > Haunt > Malefic Grasp > Refresh dots / haunt if you have soul shard

You want to use Demon Soul first before applying your dots and refresh it before it expires.

I'm pulling 25-30k consistently on the training dummy with my level 85 lock in 397 ilvl gear. Much much higher dps on twilight heroics like 50k on bosses and that's only at level 85.

EDIT: With pandemic at level 90, I'd imagine that you would have more flexibility in terms of refreshing dots. Back then, you maximize your dps by only refreshing dots during the last second or so. But with this ability, the rotation just got even easier...
Why soulburn soul swap instead of saving the shard for a haunt? Dots go on faster in one GCD, but is about 3.5 more seconds not worth another haunt? It's 25% more damage. I'm working with 3 targets also, not one. I get 21 ticks off of UA and 27 off of corruption with pandemic. Even with pandemic, if I apply each dot twice in a row on my targets, by the time I get around to my first target out of three again, my dots are falling off almost just as fast as if I wouldn't have applied them twice. I might as well just apply them once and save the GCDs for MG filler. I tested this on the dummies. My haste is ridiculously low with the new gear and level 90 scaling. I was doing more DPS when I was 85 for sure, between 28 and 34k. It dropped because of the scaling. I'm at 8.65% haste. I was at double that much at 85 with my old gear.

Edit: And wouldn't you apply haunt before the swap in your rotation so that the first ticks would benefit from it? For me, haunt's a 1.34 second cast.
10/11/2012 01:31 AMPosted by Convallaria
Why soulburn soul swap instead of saving the shard for a haunt? Dots go on faster in one GCD, but is about 3.5 more seconds not worth another haunt? It's 25% more damage.


I haven't really done that math on that and I don't feel like it. But I just figured that applying those dots quickly would be better while you're under the effects of demon soul. Although I'd assume that the difference should be minimal though in your overall dps.


Edit: And wouldn't you apply haunt before the swap in your rotation so that the first ticks would benefit from it? For me, haunt's a 1.34 second cast.


Once again, very little effect in terms of your overall dps. However, I think it's better to apply those dots first before haunt. Think of it this way, while you're casting haunt, there are no dots ticking on the target. At least when you cast those dots first, they will cause damage even if it doesn't benefit from haunt.

I'm not hardcore so I don't really feel like taking the time to do the math on these things especially since lock is not my main anymore. But that's just my observation, take it with a grain of salt.
Affliction damage sucks in heroics TBH, except on bosses, where you can blow everything out of the water except Ele shammies and demo locks.

As demo, I pull around 80-100k DPS on trash pulls, and burst out to 150-175k on the boss using the DF I generated during trash.

So, for heroics, you may want to go demo instead of affliction.
09/30/2012 08:38 AMPosted by Crunxe
holding about 40-60k dps as afflic at 90 in heroics, though my group kills stuff quite fast, aoe is just abysmal as afflic right now since everything dies so fast, so gl with that aspect ;p


this is why in the end i never run dungeons with affl. Things just die to fast essentially all you can really do is fight the boss the rest of the time we are being carried. This is most noticeable when people start getting geared. The potential is there for great dps but the time isn't
I thought i'd chime in with what i've been seeing.

iLvL 433 equipped
reforged everything to hit, haste, what askmrrobot suggested even

I do the normal rotation: CoE - DS - SB:SS - haunt - MG and refresh dots with around 6 sec left. (Agony i'll refresh at 10 sec left)

I get about 25-26k avg (32k burst with DS haunt and doomguard) over a 5 min rotation on the 85 dummy.

I feel like I should be doing more, but there's just no way.

I have bought the full pvp set, it's in my bags. I was just going to use it for ilvl bump to get into heroics, but do you guys think it would be worth it to equip the whole set then replace with herioc gear, or just get in there and do what I can with the gear i currently have.

I guess i'm ultimately afraid of not pulling my weight in heroics and getting screamed at lol.

I can pull 26k pretty easy in destro, just seams afflic is VERY gear dependant and not a very good measure of dps right when you hit 90.
You're not going to do that much damage in iLevel 433. It isn't until you hit ilevel 460 or so that you do more DPS than you could do in full heroic gear at 85 because of the way stat scaling works.

In addition, if you're going with the affliction hit cap based build, at 433 you're going to have to reforge everything to hit/expertise and use hit gems to get there, which is going to cripple secondary stats. That's why your DPS is an exponential increase despite linear increases in primary stats on higher ilevel items; you can remain at the hit cap far more easily and double or triple your secondary stats when int has only increased by 20% etc.
I would be cautious when i'm comparing my stats to others in a number of varying situations. I did the stone guard fight in MV and I was middle of the road and i outgeared most of he raiders so i had initial concerns but then I went to "world of logs" and found that the top 25 or so were all melee for that fight. Then I looked at the feng fight and found a warlock in the running of highest dps so a snapshot of the best in class tells me that depending on the mechanics of the fight and the players ability and attention to detail of spec/talent/gem/glyph/reforge/spell usage/cooldown timing, we can be on top for dps when the situation allows. You just have to put more effort into everything you do.

So best advice if you're not a numbers geek (I'm not unfortunately), would be to look at how the best of the best are setting up their spec and gear and talk to them about their rotations. It'll do more that running around in circles trying everything that they have already proven effective.
Clearly you can only compare yourself to the top logs in your specific spec. Nothing you can do about imbalance between the specs. I'm happy to answer any demonology questions anybody might have but I'm sure there's someone else better situated to answer the affliction questions.
10/11/2012 08:09 AMPosted by Gremory
Clearly you can only compare yourself to the top logs in your specific spec. Nothing you can do about imbalance between the specs. I'm happy to answer any demonology questions anybody might have but I'm sure there's someone else better situated to answer the affliction questions.


Yes actually I do have a demo Q: once youve ramped up to 1000. whats the best rotation to burn down with? I've been doing: (CE already up) CDs, Doom, IS, SF(if quick cast) otherwise TC till I get SB procs. Please let me know what your optimal meta rotation for single target(no adds) rotation is.
1) You shouldn't ever get quite to 1000 demonic fury. If you have over 750 then you should be good to burn throughout the entirety of dark soul.

2) Considering you should already have curse of elements up from the pull (likely 30ish seconds before your first burn) then don't bother casting it.

3) Since you are casting Doom at the pull by briefly going into meta while building demonic fury, it will likely have 40ish seconds left on it when you start your burn. You should wait until the 30 second remaining tick just happens and then refresh Doom (while still in dark soul). This will ensure no time is wasted, and you get a full 1.5 duration Doom because of pandemic at buffed stats.

4) Do not use Imp swarm (it's a DPS loss on any fight over 90 seconds). See: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/6794482193

5) Do not use Soul Fire while in Meta unless whatever you're targeting is about to die and you're concerned you won't be able to spend all your demonic fury before it dies. It's better to save your procs until you drop meta to quickly build up demonic fury again.

So overall - the rotation is just to pop dark soul and spam Touch of Chaos, refreshing your first Doom when it has under 30 seconds remaining (while you still have dark soul up).
Greatly appreciated. Thank you!!
Afflock rotation is incredibly simple now, made even more so if you can navigate macros and keybinds well. 85 to 90 I was consistently seeing 30k-40k dps in dungeons. I'm not hit-capped yet, but am doing 50k-60k in heroics now, sometimes more. The Windsong enchant on my weapon is kind of erratic. I'm sure once I'm hit-capped, fully gemmed, replace Windsong with Jade Spirit, and get that damned belt buckle I'll be seeing even higher numbers.
I thought i'd chime in with what i've been seeing.

iLvL 433 equipped
reforged everything to hit, haste, what askmrrobot suggested even

I do the normal rotation: CoE - DS - SB:SS - haunt - MG and refresh dots with around 6 sec left. (Agony i'll refresh at 10 sec left)

I get about 25-26k avg (32k burst with DS haunt and doomguard) over a 5 min rotation on the 85 dummy.

I feel like I should be doing more, but there's just no way.

I have bought the full pvp set, it's in my bags. I was just going to use it for ilvl bump to get into heroics, but do you guys think it would be worth it to equip the whole set then replace with herioc gear, or just get in there and do what I can with the gear i currently have.

I guess i'm ultimately afraid of not pulling my weight in heroics and getting screamed at lol.

I can pull 26k pretty easy in destro, just seams afflic is VERY gear dependant and not a very good measure of dps right when you hit 90.


Really concerning to see forums and sites refer afflocks to reforge into haste. Mastery is proving to be our new god, don't waste it on haste. I recommend reading posts on www.icy-veins.com regarding stat priorities and gemming.

I crafted myself PVP gear to get into heroics and it worked out quite well. You'll need to equip it as I experienced that just having it in your bags no longer counts towards ilvl requirements for instances. Also with your rotation on bosses you'll want to cast Haunt BEFORE you Soulburn: Soul Swap. For 4+ trash pulls I rarely find myself using Haunt. A macro for Soulburn: Soul Swap turns 2 clicks into one.

I was DS raid-geared at 85 and when hitting MoP I was doing far more dps at 85 than at 87 or 88 as I was changing out my gear. It is easy to get discouraged with the huge change, but its all about hit rating. My dps picked back up when my hit rating went back up.

Reading earlier posts about afflocks in dungeons and trash dying too soon....with a one-button macro for Soulburn: Soul Swap you don't have this issue. For a 4-mob trash pull and if you're glyphed for the extra 4th soulshard, you tab target to cycle through all 4 mobs throwing your DoTs on all of them in just 4 clicks. Throw Haunt on one then MG it down....Drain Soul to get all your shards back then you can throw fresh new DoTs on the 3 remaining mobs...rinse and repeat. AoE on 5+ pulls is dismal (some of the trash pulls in Shado-Pan with the monks that turn friendly when their health bars are low, soul shard management is a pain here)...but I find afflock pulls it out in the end on overall damage done in a given instance.

Also what was a lifesaver for me is I used to be stupid enough not to give much thought to FelFlame. In boss fights where you have to move around quite a bit to avoid damaging fight mechanics, its awesome to quickly throw a FelFlame at the boss to refresh all your DoTs instead of having to waste another precious soul shard to renew all your DoTs.
Now i'm working on my affliction and used it for that zandalari boss in LFR. I will say that I did get top deeps at a meager 52k/s, as a matter of fact the top 3 were all warlocks but at i470 I think i should see at least 60k+ on a pure target dummy style fight. Could someone whose an Afflack pro check my gear and just beat me down in anything that could be fixed please.. I've seen the uber pros pull92-94k on some of the Mogu fights.. Even on the fights with all the continuous adds spawning i didn't see any impressive numbers. One thing I wondered is it worth it to have the swap glyph at the price of a 30 second CD? that's what I was using for add fights but i'd like to at least come close to it, I just need to know where to look for what they work at for stats and rotations.
I definitely would swap Grimoire of Supremacy with Grimoire of Sacrifice, also perhaps try Archimonde's Vengeance instead of Kiljaeden's Cunning. Not sure how the math works out but perhaps using a +320 Mastery gem in place of a +Intellect gem might be beneficial. The way I look at it is whatever I can do to make my DoTs more powerful, Grimoire of Sacrifice would definitely help this.
Thanks for the talent/glyph info, ill rerun the same fights and see what i get. I had considered regemming for more mastery but it was my understanding that Int was still king.. If mastery gives more SP for it then i will definately do that.. Im gonna run rawr and see what it says also. Tnaks again Elegua.
As a Ilvl 468 destro spec, I'm pulling an easy 70k dps (single target) in my 10 raid group. I've seen the sim craft saying that aff is the FotM. However, the higher level of gear you get, the difference between DPS specs evens out. Just learn your playstyle and learn it well.
I've been jumping around in specs since hitting 90 and I really feel like there has to be something I'm missing. My good buddy (before he had to swap to tank so we could raid) was running a Mage and just butchering me in DPS even when our gear level is equal. Mostly I stick to Affliction but with the gear I've got it seems like I should be doing more than the ~45k that I'm getting on most fights.

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