Justice and Honor Gear Changes

General Discussion
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10/02/2012 07:55 PMPosted by Hädés
I noticed the quartermasters are missing from the hall of legends at orgrimmar. Does anyone know when they will be back and whether they will have the same gear when they do come back or not?


They've been moved to Hellscream's Fist on the Serpent's Spine between Townlong Steppes and Kun-Lai Summit.
The pvp gear now has equivalent pve stats to the same ilvl, the pvp stats aren't counted at all in the ilvl thats what they did instead of lowering the ilvl, they made pvp gear viable in pve... sans set bonuses.
All this does is combat the scumbags who try and do PvE content with PvP gear.

Sympathy level = Zero.
All this does is combat the scumbags who try and do PvE content with PvP gear.

Sympathy level = Zero.


Yes, I can tell you're that type.
10/02/2012 08:25 PMPosted by Illyrià
All this does is combat the scumbags who try and do PvE content with PvP gear.

When the PvP gear is pre-raid BIS (e.g. the chest for healing priests) or completely equivalent to PvP options (most pieces for healers and hybrid DPS, many for pure DPS), you're hardly a 'scumbag' for using it.
Ok Ok, I get it now why this change had to be made but my main question is............

Why wasn't this done when the game was in beta? And by the looks of the beta testers said something months ago, so why did the 464 pvp gear make it to live?

Please answer me.
As of now the ilvl is the same. There are raiding guilds killing bosses with the un-nerfed pvp gear. What is going to be done about the unfair advantage in progression.
Have they changed the pvp armor yet? At work and armory still shows 464....or did they just reduce the stats but keep the ilvl? I hope its dropped also, not to bone anyone but having a person decked out in jp gear will only have an ilvl of 450 while someone with all pvp gear will have an ilvl of 464 and the same stats......

Seems silly lol bumping jp gear would have been easier

Plus, pvp gear is better anyway cause then you don't have to change it out!
I would like to know what is going to be done about the progression guilds using the un-nerfed pvp gear for raiding today. As of now the ilvl is the same. There are also raiding guilds killing bosses with this gear. How is this fair for other guilds that raid later in the week? We will have the nerfed gear.


Normal Mogu'shan is Normal. We won't even have the final instance open for awhile, plenty of time to get caught up using the actual raid drops and the extra farm time for recipes and reputations and the like.

Sheesh...
One other thing with honor pvp gear being 458 and conquest being 483 I think it is.

Won't make for a pretty big gab between too?
Won't that kinda of hurt new pvp players in the long run?
That grind out the honor for that gear only to be stomped by somebody in full conquest.

Maybe I'm just over thinking that.

Seeing that cata honor pvp gear was 339 and conquest was 365

I guess I am. I'm not sure on this numbers I didn't play much early cata.
doesn't only screw over the pve players who already bought the gear but it screws over the pvpers by making a bigger gap between the honor and conquest gear.
No Blizzard. You do this tomorrow, I will quit.
What a mess
Looks like the boosted justice gear but didnt nerf honor gear, Im guessing messing with all honor gear after everyone bought it would have led to a wave of problems they didnt want to deal with.

I think they will have to boost JP gear to 463, but time will tell.
Awesome! Thanks Blizzard! i should not have to pvp for my pve gear so many thanks!
One other thing with honor pvp gear being 458 and conquest being 483 I think it is.

Won't make for a pretty big gab between too?
Won't that kinda of hurt new pvp players in the long run?
That grind out the honor for that gear only to be stomped by somebody in full conquest.

Maybe I'm just over thinking that.

Seeing that cata honor pvp gear was 339 and conquest was 365

I guess I am. I'm not sure on this numbers I didn't play much early cata.

The added pvp power and resilience will help close that gap a bit. But it will still be a slightly larger gap than normal.
10/02/2012 09:16 PMPosted by Rolypolyoly
doesn't only screw over the pve players who already bought the gear but it screws over the pvpers by making a bigger gap between the honor and conquest gear.


This.

Please just buff the JP gear. I'm so, so, so tired of PvP being borked over constantly because of PvE. It's bad enough we're constantly needing to PvE to remain competitive in PvP (something entirely contradicted by the Blizzard statement that they don't want us to be forced to do one or the other - yet no honor weapons), but having our gear nerfed now because of PvErs using it?

Seriously?

This is reminding me of S9s keeping T2 weapons away from PvPers because not enough PvErs had cleared their own content. What a horrible note to start off the PvP season with...again.
So... are we going to be able to get the gear we replaced with honor gear now that it's being blanket nerfed? I vendored a bunch of 463 items when I bought my 464 ones and now they will be much worse.... that's not really okay since I can't get my stuff back now.
Thank you. This is a step in right direction. I still think pvp power/def needs to consume some item budget though. it's a huge flaw that two gear peices of same ilvl work the way they do.

ie
pve gear, crap in pvp
pvp gear, good in pvp and pve compared to equal ilvl

the design is very flawed in the effect that one gear can do all and other cannot. it also still makes pvping ideal for pve gearing despite the ilvl change in apsense of good drops. if you cannot land that 463 piece you may still opt for easiest route of pve gear, and lets phase it, pvp gear is also pve gear (which is the problem).


This. A thousand times this. When MoP design changes were first being announced, one change I was happiest to see is that players could no longer "cheat" their way into Heroic instances by getting PvP gear that, on the same tier as it's PvE equivalent, was at least 10 ilvls higher. I enjoy both PvE and PvP, and if you want to make the switch from exclusively doing one or the other, you can. It might take awhile to earn honor to buy JP and the gear associated with it so you can actually be of use in PvE, but it can be done. I did it during Cat on this toon from PvE to PvP and on another toon from PvP to PvE. Honestly, the 'while' is like two weeks, not even that long to miss out on a ton of progression, etc.

PvP gear should be treated as essentially ilvl 1 for the purposes of queueing for a random. Heirlooms essentially count as that - anyone on the line between 79-81 w/ heirloom pieces can tell you how much they have to replace to start queueing again (this may have been changed, but in 4.3.4 I had to replace several pieces of heirloom gear to get into the first two Cataclysm five man dungeons - not Heroics.) I think there's a serious problem with the system that doesn't award gear that's the best for PvE gear directly from PvE reward points and PvP gear from PvP reward points. As I stated above, with the Jp/HP ratio, it allowed players to switch from one focus to another, albeit with a slight penalty for adjusting their currency. Also, let's not even talk about how difficult it is to earn JP in MoP. I've gotten equal Valor from doing just dailies to the Justice I was awarded for running over 10 MoP Normals.

On the same topic, it bothers me that Normals (and, by extension, Justice Points) have just essentially been skipped over in this expansion. Players complained about the lack of Normal modes for the HoT dungeons, but at the end of an expansion, expect that kind of thing. No big issue there. But, to make the vast, vast majority of 90 5-mans *only* available on Heroic seems foolish. It would be more prudent, I believe, to keep the old system of a normal version of each Heroic. I've seen players ask others "Please, go slow. I haven't done this on Heroic yet." Most of time, those requests have fallen on deaf ears, my own included. This is only worse when dungeons AT THE BEGINNING OF THE EXPANSION are only available on Heroic, thus not even giving players a chance to see the basic mechanics of the instance in a Normal version first.

And, then, take a look at "Heroic" Stormstout Brewery. Enemies get a HP buff. That's it. That's it? For a HEROIC MODE? What happened to the threat of instant death if you pulled aggro or too many mobs in a Heroic? I can understand Heroics essentially being a joke near the end of a Tier set, as they were pretty much from the beginning in 4.3. But even then, if you hadn't run them once or twice, you had to watch your step and learning the Mannoroth/Varo'then encounter I did see as a good challenge and a way to test potential tanks.

I THOUGHT we'd have a balanced PvP/PvE gear system this time that wouldn't allow wrongly-geared people into Heroics.

I THOUGHT we'd have to see EVERY instance on Normal before we could do them on Heroic.

I THOUGHT real raid, instance, and grind progression was coming back.

I, apparently, THOUGHT wrong.

EDIT: Sorry, I got a little off-topic. I needed to get that out.
we dont know

They changed the justice gear but not the honor gear.

If its not changed by tommorow rolling restart your safe.

They might have changed their mind about nerfing gear after its bought.

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