DK's Voted Most Unpopular Class Due to Lore

Story Forum
This is what Cdev says about the "purpose" of the DKs:

After their vengeance was won, the death knights found themselves without a cause and without a home. One by one they trickled into the land of the living in search of a new purpose.
10/09/2012 12:15 PMPosted by Vyrin
Neither do the Forsaken.


I can't help but to feel like you're trolling me with this statement. You know as well as me that the Forsaken have purpose.

10/09/2012 12:36 PMPosted by Sternbridge
They don't want to produce more Death Knights. They want their kind to die out because they feel they don't belong in this world.


My point exactly.
10/09/2012 12:15 PMPosted by Vyrin
Neither do the Forsaken.


Yea we do. Our purpose to to exist and survive and have others join us.
10/09/2012 01:27 PMPosted by Deathisfinal
My point exactly.


So the Horde should continue making enemies out of neutral factions?

Well I guess that works, since we know there won't be any repercussions for their actions from these groups anyway.
Lore my crack.

Death Knights pissed everyone off when WoTLK started because of how unbalanced they were at the level cap coming out.

They were also pissed off because anyone(probably to this day, even) who tried doing BGs from 58-69 saw that Death Knights had an unfair advantage, basically starting in full blues tailored towards them, which gave them even more of a reputation of being over powered.

Warriors also felt a lot of jealousy towards the class because here was another plate tank/dps class that thematically was way cooler, newer and "shinier" than they were.

And not to forget all the people levelling Death Knights who didn't know what they were doing and just annoyed the crap out of everyone with Death grip.

The stigma stayed. I think a lot of people felt monks would get the same treatment, but so far it hasn't happened because it's not so ridiculously over-balanced as Death Knights were at launch.

So no, don't attribute this to lore.
I don't think it has a thing to do with the lore.

Bloods last season were nearly unkillable, they're getting to be strong in MOP too, a lot of people remember wrath a little too well, being death gripped is annoying, and everyone has been saddled with that one death knight (you know the one) who doesn't know what they're doing in a dungeon.

As for rogues, people have always hated rogues because we have stealth and stun mechanics (although, in regard to the latter, so does everyone else), regardless of our position in the rankings. This is probably exacerbated though, by last season with legendary/vial rogues and subtlety in general

You won't find anyone except for rogues, for example, beating the drum about the simultaneous damage/mobility/survivability nerf that we took in MOP as nearly all of the other classes were getting significant buffs. We've had long-standing gladiator rogues hang up the class, and there's still a question as to whether a rogue can be viable in an arena or a rated BG. - The response so far though has been "we understand that the nerfs were unfair, but you're a rogue. You deserve it."

So again, I don't see this as being a lore-driven issue.


I agree with your points as to why people don't like DK's and I thought those reasons would have been the only reasons but there seemed to be a lot of people citing lore reasons for picking dk's, not so much rogues.

10/09/2012 12:28 PMPosted by Vegdrasil
Where are you getting "due to lore" from? I see no such clarifier on either poll.


Really?You must have not looked very hard because on wow insider the third comment saya "DKs, although sorta unique, dont really fit into the typical RPG mold and only seemed relevant when the lore revolved around them (Wrath), now they're just kind of an awkward class that just remind me of an expansion rather than a character that meshes well in a usual RPG universe."

I'lldo a quick count:

WoW Insider DK Lore Vote:7

WoW Insider DK Mechanic Vote:6

Total Votes for DK's 4656

I didn't have time to go through all the posts, the mechanic votes were for various reasons. Some said they were OP, some said they shouldn't start at a higher level etc

Don't have time to go on MMO Champion right now, although that OP geared the question more towards Over Powered Classes so I would expect there to me more mechanical posts there but i'm honestly not sure. Back to WoW Insider however, the other classes who were voted against in the comment barley had lore reasons listed. I know rogues didn't have lore reasons listed at all, they are just dam anoying. It just stuck out for me that there were so many lore reasons from other classes towards Death Knights. Perhaps I shouldn't just be content to wait for answers on my classes own story after all.
my fellow death knights i know since wrath ended we are not "cool" anymore but the future looks bright the new lich king is goign to wake up some time and im gessing hes going to want some death knights to protect him and hey if were lucky our eyes might glow a new color but as for the ebon blade i think they will make a fat comeback when bolavar wakes up. SUFFER WELL BROTHERS
Whoever said they should not be removed, this is rather obvious. This was simply a theoretical poll.

Onto the matter at hand, I truly think DKs are the most unpopular class for a couple of reasons:

1) Lore
2) GAMEPLAY MECHANICS
People who main Death Knights will probably tell you that they love being death knights; they love the spells, the dark motif, the constantly renewing resources, or whatever.

But if you were to ask me what the most interesting classes are in terms of lore, I would say classes that aren't even in the game: Spellbreaker, Demon Hunter, and Sentinel Huntress.

My bottom ranks would be warrior, mage, rogue, and priest, not because I hate them, but because they don't come "pre-loaded" with lore and are just the generic fantasy classes. Of these, I find mage, warrior and priest to be the most compelling to PLAY, because of the relative purity of their motif and because they are very flexible in terms of lore.
How can a Death Knight enjoy hanging out with Li Li in the Valley of the Four Winds? How can Li Li enjoy hanging out with a Death Knight in the Valley of the Four Winds? Why would Chen trust a Death Knight to watch his neice?

Being a Death Knight, there just isn't anything to live for.
dont really fit into the typical RPG mold


Wondering how many RPGs these people have played. Death Knights/ Anti-paladins/Whatever you want to call them have been a thing for a long time.
I would say that in general Blizz kinda painted themselves in a corner with the DKs. They tried to make them super angst personified, with this curse thing(that probably is canon but I despise it and it isn't in the game to begin with), and how directed they are for rp. They wrote so much there is not much the player can fill in.

And then on top of that after Wrath they do nothing with the class, other than showing Koltira and Thassarian...both kinda breaking the 'Woe is me, crawling in my skin, I cut myself after my enemies die because it makes me feel' character they established. And then they up and fail to have them appear again, and ignore alot of what is going on in Western Plaguelands.

Something more focused on the DK's as a group rather than two individual would be nice, and I actually would like breaking up the Ebon Blade. Having it still exist, but the members slipping off to become part of the world of the living, Darion trying to keep the organization neutral but members being pulled home, like Thassarian and Koltira were. (Also on DK's being rotting there is a book that says you can control your appearance, those that don't care looking decayed while if you expend effort, probably magical energy, you look more like the living.)
10/09/2012 07:24 AMPosted by Deathisfinal
Why is that? The Ebon Blade was one of the main forces that defeated the Lich King.


1. They don't have a purpose
2. They can't reproduce


This is about DKs, not Forsaken.

10/09/2012 08:28 AMPosted by Cerséi
Also, does Tirion not give a crap about Sylvanas basically becoming the new Lich Queen and raising her own undead?


We've been asking ourselves this question since Cata began.

Thus far, the only answer is "Well, Sylvannas suffered a lot so she can do whatever she wants!"

10/09/2012 12:03 PMPosted by Daralii
I have no idea why he hasn't formally sided with the Alliance at this point apart from gameplay mechanics.


There are no reasons.

That's not really fair to belves. They got Sunreavers and the Reliquary. Draenei need love, though.Also if it helps, I hate Sylvanas.


It should be noted that both the Reliquary and the Sunreavers have been created in order to give the Horde themes who where previously Alliance (The Explorer's League for the Reliquary and the main body of the Kirin Tor for the Sunreavers. You can argue that the Kirin Tor is neutral, but it is a fact that it's an Alliance leaning organization, by it's Lore and themes)
The Ebon Blade was made to stop the horrors of Undeath be visited on others.

I would love a Judge Dredd-esqe Death Knight character for the Alliance.

The shadow does not forgive, The Shadow does not forgive, The shadow does not show mercy.

Death Knights as a foil to Paladins can be just as a equal untiring weapon of justice.
The Ebon Blade was made to stop the horrors of Undeath be visited on others.

I would love a Judge Dredd-esqe Death Knight character for the Alliance.

The shadow does not forgive, The Shadow does not forgive, The shadow does not show mercy.

Death Knights as a foil to Paladins can be just as a equal untiring weapon of justice.
Pretty much how I see DK's being used. If Paladins are Captain America, DK's are The Punisher. Granted I'd also personally see some DK's trying to take up their old lives and whether they succeed or not. WoW certainly could have some Friendly Neighborhood Vampires. Or in this case Death Knights.
There's a point where you kind of have to make up your own story as a DK. Personally I think we are relevant, even if the Ebon Blade isn't the most involved neutral faction in the game.

After wrath, the Ebon Blade as an association tasked itself with watching over what remained of the scourge, the plaguelands, and although not necessarily stated, to a certain extent the Forsaken. And that is essentially what's happened. We have as much lore as any other class, much more than some, but it was all packed into Wrath.

Those of us remaining DKs have gone out into the world and tried to find our place. Though we may be trusted out of necessity, we will never be accepted. Nor are we supposed to be, so you can abandon that idea right now. I don't think the class should be removed just because we haven't had anything happen lately. That can be said for several classes, among them warriors, rogues, hunters, etc.

I also think that DKs could be a big force in a Legion expansion. This seems to be forgotten, but it was the Legion that empowered the Lich King in the first place. We could turn our wrath on them and exact retribution for all they put us and our people through, as well as what their servant did to the world.

And as for the polls, people are just angry because the DK is a strong class. Blood specs are very hard to kill, and still mitigate a lot of damage. However the most op class in the game are priests, they're impossible to take down and their damage in shadow form is considerable. So if you want to complain about a strong class, go for the people that keep entire teams alive and still find time to cut through armor with crazy spells like mind flay.
In my humble opinion the key to setting a fire under the Deathknights butt.
Fel.

Fel Deathknights. Teron style, blizz make it so.
Wasn't Darion suppose to become the Ashbringer one day? Guess Blizzard just forgot about him, no surprise there.
10/12/2012 04:53 AMPosted by Ultixer
Wasn't Darion suppose to become the Ashbringer one day? Guess Blizzard just forgot about him, no surprise there.


He was, just not how he or his father thought.
The Ebon Blade was made to stop the horrors of Undeath be visited on others.

I would love a Judge Dredd-esqe Death Knight character for the Alliance.

The shadow does not forgive, The Shadow does not forgive, The shadow does not show mercy.

Death Knights as a foil to Paladins can be just as a equal untiring weapon of justice.


There's actually a character kind of like that in Judge Dredd canon, Judge Death. He comes from an alternate dimension wherein he realizes only the living commit crimes. He eventually becomes undead and seizes power, destroying all life on "Deadworld" to purify it of the guilty.

Whereas Judge Dredd tirelessly enforces the law through any means necessary to protect the greater good, Death killed indiscriminately because he came to see life itself as a crime.
Death Knights are fine, lore wise. The Ebon Blade are now the Jailors of the Damned as well as a type of "spy" agency monitoring the Forsaken. As far as players are concerned, they are satiating their curse by being commanders of their respective factions. They are die-hard soldiers for the Alliance or the Horde. That seems like solid lore to me. Thassarian and Koltira even cement this fact through the Battle of Andorhal.

No, if anything, people don't like Death Knights because of their mechanics. I'm nigh-unkillable in PvP thanks to being Blood, and I have heard many horror stories of Death Knight tanks. I take my tanking ability seriously in a effort to dispel this notion.

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