Disc is GUTTED -- This must be fixed NOW.

Priest
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Disc has been extremely strong for the entirety of cataclysm, as a Holy Priest I always had the short end of the stick, especially in firelands.

Since hitting 90 I've noticed that DH is healing for mediocre amounts. What I ask is this. Why should disc have DH also. I wondered this at 4.3. Sure your DH was weaker but I didn't get a weak barrier on an 8m CD. In 4.0-4.2 Holy had no decent raid CD at all. I found it very hard to complete firelands because no one wanted a H Priest.

Disc regen was so powerful in Cata that people were reforging out of spirit in 4.2. I believe some people were rolling disc priests with 1.2k spirit while I was going around with 3k spirit and couldn't reforge any spirit out for thoughtput.

That aside, I could agree that rapture could be buffed slightly atm, now that we have equal mana pools. And I'll be honest with you. Holy regen atm sucks too. Although I am still gearing and only have 5.5k spirit unbuffed.
inb4 they state they made the change because "it's more fun for the players" lolololol

We all know that every change has been made in order to extend the life of content or "gate" it in some way (take away flying, no tabard rep, dailies.... dailies as far as the eye can see) It's purely a cost-saving measure, a business decision.

As an extension of the above, gimping healers is a great way to accomplish this. I think we're just the beta test. No professionally employed dev is this incompetent, there is a reason that we are so weak, and a reason that all customer reps are dead silent on it.
10/06/2012 10:10 PMPosted by Iapetus
As a long time Holy priest I am truly happy to finally see a Disc priest actually complain about his spec, and am eagerly waiting for a boss where every priest and his mother go Holy. Heaven be praised!

It was called "World of Warcraft" and "The Burning Crusade" and "Early Wrath of the Lich King"


You're describing when absorbs started showing up on recount, not the point at which Disc became raid viable. When it showed up on recount is just when people realized Disc had been quite good for a long time.
It won't be fixed in any timely manner.

What you'll get is a buff to rapture soonish, and any mechanical issues won't be touched until after the next large patch.

Just hide and watch.


This.

Disc Priests are ALWAYS gimped after an xpac.... and we are usually the last to be fixed.

They will fix us, eventually, but say goodbye to this season. Hope for 5.1... but, most likely 5.2.


REALLY? As a I recall, at the beginning of Cata, Disc was weak due to very weak shields. Blizz dropped everything they were working on like a !@#$ing hot potato only a matter of weeks after release so they could rush to fix disc. They fixed it to the point that Holy priests were, more or less, not allowed to raid for 2/3 of the expansion. Holy continued to get the shaft in Firelands with ZERO spirit cloth in the loot table and then ONE drop in DS. Holy finally got "fixed" more than a year after Cata launched; it's worth noting that being average post-"fix" depended on stacking in Sanctuary that was bugged to ignore target cap. It wasn't even until 4.3 that the Serenity crit buff even did ANYTHING!

So yeah, I don't want to hear about Disc always being the worst and always being the last to be fixed. It's not only objectively wrong, but you're making yourself look silly.


It was called "World of Warcraft" and "The Burning Crusade" and "Early Wrath of the Lich King"


You're describing when absorbs started showing up on recount, not the point at which Disc became raid viable. When it showed up on recount is just when people realized Disc had been quite good for a long time.


Disc was only changed to raid viable in WotLK....Disc in Vanilla was a filler "put your 14 points here regardless of holy or shadow unless you're that one dude going for divine spirit" spec and the Disc in TBC was "PvP here" spec.

The only fight 'worth' (and even this is debatable) going disc for in TBC was that one fight in BT for ONE Pain suppression cast.

Then on WotLK it turned from 'pvp here' to 'omfgwtfisthisamazing'. Then LK rolled along and it turned into "bring one or suffer".

If you are going to grumble and gloat over a spec, at least know its history better :<

<--- plays both. OK with both.


You're describing when absorbs started showing up on recount, not the point at which Disc became raid viable. When it showed up on recount is just when people realized Disc had been quite good for a long time.


Disc was only changed to raid viable in WotLK....Disc in Vanilla was a filler "put your 14 points here regardless of holy or shadow unless you're that one dude going for divine spirit" spec and the Disc in TBC was "PvP here" spec.

The only fight 'worth' (and even this is debatable) going disc for in TBC was that one fight in BT for ONE Pain suppression cast.

Then on WotLK it turned from 'pvp here' to 'omfgwtfisthisamazing'. Then LK rolled along and it turned into "bring one or suffer".

If you are going to grumble and gloat over a spec, at least know its history better :<

<--- plays both. OK with both.


I know its history extremely well because I lived its history. I raided in BC as Disc (on farm content, to be fair) and through most of Wrath as Disc. At the beginning of Wrath, I still got TONS of !@#$ from people obsessing over meters because absorbs did not show up on recount until about 3.2. Even then, it was "Guessed Absorbs" in its own tab and was not included in the "Healing Done" tab that everyone used to measure success.

There weren't a lot of changes to Disc specifiically throughout Wrath. It wasn't until ICC (mid-ICC maybe) that recount started integrating absorbs accurately into the overall healing. At that point, Disc suddenly became popular because the recount bar for a disc priest was longer than the bars for other healers. During Naxx and Ulduar, Disc was just as capable as it was in ICC, but it was recount that legitimized Disc.

So when I say it was "quite good for a long time," I'm referring mostly to the year between launch in Nov. 2008 and ICC a year later. Prior to that, Disc was not unplayable, but it was under-rated though not great.
Although the OP doesn't do the best job of maintaining an objective perspective or articulating some of his concerns, I don't think he's entirely wrong.

The problem with discipline currently, as most of you said, is that there is really no coherent idea uniting the play style of the spec. Discipline is essentially a hodgepodge of "neat" ideas that somehow all got lumped together. I will say that I haven't played a priest extensively since BC, but since playing one in MoP it's clear that discipline priests are suffering from poor design. This is easily understandable as priests are the only class with two healing specs. Where do we draw the line between discipline and holy? Where should the novelty and usefulness of the discipline priest come from?

I think most people enjoy the idea of healing via dealing damage, unfortunately there are some major design issues with this mechanic currently. Not only is the throughput of atonement nothing to be impressed by, Atonement has nothing to do with absorbs (our mastery) unless we crit with the healing portion (really just a feature of Divine Aegis). Also, the range on atonement only allows the heals only reach melee dps and the tank most of the time. Lastly, Atonement has no way of addressing the disc priest's lack of raid healing abilities.

Despite all this, I've had no problems smite-healing my way through 5man heroics, but I can easily see how our lack of raid healing can contribute to our downfall in raids. Honestly, I'm okay with this feature as long as we are given something to make us desired and/or more fun to play. Something that sets us apart from holy and other healers altogether.

Personally I think blizz should expand the idea of "smite healing" and make it something that makes more sense with the rest of the discipline priest's theme (absorbs and damage prevention). Consider the following ideas:

Increase the base damage of Smite.
Change the bonus healing provided by Grace into an absorption shield instead and allow Atonement to grant Grace. (Reduce to 5% per stack)
Increase the Range on Atonement heals to 40 yds.
Change Archangel to allow Atonement heals to affect 3 people for 15 seconds.
Change Divine Aegis to: When you heal a target affected by one of your absorption effects with Penance, Greater Heal, Heal or Flash heal 50% of the healing is distributed to the 2 lowest health party or raid members within 15 yds.

The above ideas would obviously have to be balanced, but I believe they would provide the Disc Priest with a bit more cohesive skill set and a more defined play style.

Over the years WoW has been continuously dumbed down, made more casual and has had its classes homogenized to the extent of boredom. The potential of the discipline priest excites me. Hopefully Blizzard will do something interesting with it.
Atonement can't be buffed to the point it approaches a real dps, or it becomes a significant balance problem. It could do *less* damage and simply increase the resulting healing to 150% or more. But really, Smite is weak, it always has been and it likely always will be the "I'm bored" heal.

Adding some splash heals would be kinda nice. I'd *love* to see less reliance on maintaining buffs that have terrible synergy. Grace is very important but isn't applied by all spells, AA is very important but must be built by taking calculated losses in healing, SS is very important but so short and mana-intensive that you'd better not screw it up.
disc blows.

Simple
I spent a lot of time leveling and dungeon grinding this toon to realize it will not be a viable raider if we don't get this fixed. As mentioned before it feels like it did at the beginning of Cata, broken.

After they fixed it for Cata, disc was great again. Hearing that holy isn't all that much better doesn't make me feel any better.

I had a hotrod Corvette that suddenly turned into an AMC Pacer. I hit the gas hard and the doors fell off, it backfired and ran out of fuel all at the same time. That's what disc feels like right now a friggin AMC Pacer. They weren't called All Mechanical Casualties for no reason.

I agree we got a hodgepodge of spells that look nice but don't really work too well in the real world (of warcraft).

I want my vette back please.


I had a hotrod Corvette that suddenly turned into an AMC Pacer. I hit the gas hard and the doors fell off, it backfired and ran out of fuel all at the same time. That's what disc feels like right now a friggin AMC Pacer. They weren't called All Mechanical Casualties for no reason.

I agree we got a hodgepodge of spells that look nice but don't really work too well in the real world (of warcraft).

I want my vette back please.


The best selling car in America in the 1970's was...

The Ford Pinto?
Why does it take half my mana bar to put spirit shell to it's optimal use, for only 15 seconds of absorb?
Why is my healing per mana roughly half the other healers?
Why is my mana regen model the worst by far, when our healing per mana is roughly half the other healers?
Why is there zero synergy between my cooldowns, and why am I proccing 9k aegis' on 450k hp tanks?

Why is there zero communication from the dev team about this glaring imbalance?
What were the Q & A folks doing throughout a year long beta?


This, Christ, ALL OF THIS.

Even healing a heroic LFD is unenjoyable as disc.
Increase the base damage of Smite.
Change the bonus healing provided by Grace into an absorption shield instead and allow Atonement to grant Grace. (Reduce to 5% per stack)
Increase the Range on Atonement heals to 40 yds.
Change Archangel to allow Atonement heals to affect 3 people for 15 seconds.
Change Divine Aegis to: When you heal a target affected by one of your absorption effects with Penance, Greater Heal, Heal or Flash heal 50% of the healing is distributed to the 2 lowest health party or raid members within 15 yds.


I don't think they can increase the damage of Smite, but I'm one of those who feels the healing percentage needs to be MUCH larger.

The biggest thing we lack are the passive hots and smart heals that other classes can just fire and forget. Atonement's range is crap and often chooses idiotic targets. Prayer of Mending isn't enough. The only other heals we can do require active attention and re-casting.

I'd be fine without any of those if our absorbs were actually scaled to the task. (I got a devine aegis as high as 8.8k yesterday. Woo.) But given the lack of sustainable absorbs, we need abilities that can keep healing while we're not actively casting.
Your babbling about "game designer" and "I be bestest best healer in da world!!!" put a sarcastic joke feel on everything you posted. Good job with that one. Kill any chance of being taken seriously.

That said, GC did, in fact say they believe priests are in a good place now and won't be changed. However, I doubt that will stay true. Numbers are rolling in from raids now and they do show some issues with priests' standing, compared to other healers. Nothing game-breaking, as some seem to imply, but there is a clear trend rising and one I don't see gear scaling correcting any time soon.

Another week or so of numbers, maybe the next raid opens up, and I expect some hotfixes. Mostly value changes, I bet, and nothing as drastic as returning Hymn to Disc. We are hindered, but we are working. Blizzard is happy with hindered, but working. So, don't expect Cata/Wrath disc back... it's long gone.
we didnt get power infusion. weve had that....
I don't think Disc is extremely strong right now, but I do feel that it's PVE viable despite the fact that it could use some love. Last week I raided 10-man, and this week I've been Disc in 25s. I've always preferred Holy for healing, but Disc's CDs are really exceptional, so I wanted to put some work in on it.

I'm not saying that what I'm doing is great and the way things should be. However, I've adjusted my playstyle significantly over my previous Disc style, and it's worked. I have kept up nicely in healing in both 10 and 25 MSV raids. I do hope they change things up, but here's what I've found works for now:

1) Don't use pws. It's a huge waste of mana. Don't even use it on Rapture's CD.
2) Be very frugal with your PoH usage. Only use it with other CDs for big raid-wide damage portions of the fights.
3) Stick to Holy Fire + Smite healing a lot of the time. They're amazingly efficient at tank/melee heals. I glyph both because they're a huge part of my healing. This is your efficient, non-raid emergency healing. Bread and butter now. It's even better if you keep 3x grace on the tank.
4) When it's time to dump mana for things like epicenter or madness, you have two options: Spirit Shell or Inner Focus + Archangel PoH spams. Archangel does NOT currently buff Spirit Shell, so don't use them at the same time! Rotate the two depending on how often you need raid CDs, and use PI with either. You have some viable CDs that do make PoH spam worth it sometimes. You maintain the mana to use these occasionally by not spamming PoH outside of these two CDs and never using pws.

So, in a typical fight, I'm using Holy Fire on CD and smiting the crap out of the boss. This keeps the tank/melee up and lets others raid heal ranged/healers. When big damage is going to come out, I pop PI and any +int/sp CDs (synapse springs, trinket), and Spirit Shell if I have ~15 seconds to preemptively shield or Archangel if the damage is already going out, and I spam PoH and nothing but PoH. Inner Focus is amazing with PoH for these times, too. Don't macro it into all of your abilities that use it like most Disc priests seemed to do before. Save it for when you're spamming PoH. Once this is over, I go back to Holy Fire and Smite while I regen some mana back via mindbender, HoH, etc. until the next time raid-wide damage is coming out.

Again, I feel that disc could use some love. I don't feel that we should completely neglect our signature ability or the ability we've used for years as our other go-to ability. But I've adapted to the current state, and it's working pretty reasonably.
The actual core issue is this.

The effort playing a priest is not worth the reward when comparing it to all other healers.

The reasons why are varied but the end result is the same. The priest requires a ton more work to do a similar job as other healers.

With a new xpac there will always be a top healer and a bottom healer. We happen to be at the bottom of the barrel right now.

Blizzard has never been known for having the ability to balance things well or responding fast to class issues such as the current priest ones.

A game this old - most of us have other healers. I have been playing this game longer then I care to mention and I'll give it out some advice.

You can complain , cry , whine , scream, yell, post , tweet do whatever else you want to do. It will change nothing in terms of the current issues with the class.

Blizzard will fix the class when "they" feel it needs fixing. Regardless of what the player base feels , thinks or displays in terms of evidence.

Save yourself time and aggravation and simply play a more enjoyable and functioning healer and revisit the priest if and when it get's fixed.
Dunno disc is different now, its a dps spec, i do about 30-35k dps/20-30k hps on a raid boss, disc just need to be played offensively now, 2 healers and a disc priest dpsing looks kinda cool to me, since most of the healing go to melee/tanks. If u take from darkness comes light you can save alot of your raid members even ranged class when needed and still do over 30k dps. So yea Disc is not broken, its just not the same gameplay. The only prob atm is mana regen but, if they give u more mana regen, in a few months when we get higher ilv epic we gonna have infinite mana and its goin to be broken so hmm yea....DEAL WITH IT
This. Pls make Smite healing go away. We don't like.


I love it actually, speak for yourself
Disc is fine, pull 60k hps in LFR today on the second boss. Went OOM around when spear phase started but was able to manage mana and keep a good output. Towards the end I had good amount of mana recovered to push up till the last 20-30s or which I just spammed the tank.

Guardians I pulled 41k ended the fight with mana to spare and I never used hymn of hope for that fight.

It is just going to take time to get use to all the new stuff, I was drinking after every pull when I first start heroics.

yes I got screenshots, who wouldn't =)

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