Let’s Talk About Brawler’s Guild

General Discussion
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11/08/2012 11:51 AMPosted by Fuzztastic
That doesn't mean he can't make a ton of money from it. Once he gets the invite from the BMAH, he has an invite to give out. He can charge for that invite.


One flaw in your logic: he has to achieve Rank 7 in the Brawlers' Guild before he has an invite to give out. According to Daxxari's post, that will be "reasonably challenging for most players." So it presumably will take some time before he can bring someone else into the guild.


That doesn't mean he can't make a ton of money from it. Once he gets the invite from the BMAH, he has an invite to give out. He can charge for that invite.


Except that nobody will buy from him for more than the BMAH prices, and those will only ever go down. It's a nearly guaranteed loss, financially. Maybe they'll recoup some of their ticket price to get in, but that's it.


Not if all the invites fly off the BMAH faster then milk and eggs before a crisis. Knowing how alot of people want their stuff now, it'll be pretty obvious that they will pay whatever price just to get their hands on it.
Before people get too worked up over monopolizing invites, realize that the BMAH tickets are both Unique and BoP. You can't really monopolize those, and the ones you earn within the Brawler's Guild are fairly limited.
11/08/2012 11:54 AMPosted by Wookiara
Except that nobody will buy from him for more than the BMAH prices, and those will only ever go down. It's a nearly guaranteed loss, financially. Maybe they'll recoup some of their ticket price to get in, but that's it.


This. You guys are raising torches over theoretical issues right now. You are also drastically underestimating how difficult it is to reach Rank 7. Go give the feature a try on the PTR before jumping to conclusions.
A few questions..
How much content will this be considered? A weeks worth? Months? The entirety of the xpac?
(Would be nice knowing if people are bidding up to 50k gold or higher is on something that will last a week or 6 months)

Also.. You say youre going this route with the BMAH as to not have tons of people all at once tempting to do this, but in a month or so wouldnt there still be that problem once more are in the brawlers guild if this is intended to be content to span the entire of the xpac?

If this is to be the case its almost like theres a need to take less likened and unwanting routes to acquire gold quickly as to get somewat a head start on the stampede to come when half the server is trying to do this for those who do not have lots of gold. (Not saying that i will do this, more so that the thought im sure is in peoples minds)

Also... is there anything to keep people who have completed the guild in its entirety from doing the spectated events? If not i can see it becoming a way to just annoy people whos trying to still complete it.

These are my wonders.. little insight would be nice.. ty
11/08/2012 11:44 AMPosted by Lufia
But aside from some warlock-only stuff, a new Wrathion quest, and some more lore quests, this IS the patch.


Respectfully, I disagree. The Pandaren Campaign is much more than 'some lore quests', and, in combination with a slew of changes and improvements to everything from classes to Pet Battles, is quite possibly the biggest thing coming in Patch 5.1.

As I stated in the original post, the Brawler's Guild was never intended to be the big patch feature of 5.1, despite the excitement surrounding it. It really is a small feature that we've decided to try out. Since the announcement, it's become something much larger in players' minds since then, which is part of what I'm trying to address now.
More content for the "fraction of players with more then 50,000 gold". Seems like a waste of developer time and resources to create content a "fraction" of the player base will see (right away). Why is Blizzard flip-flopping on this approach to making content?

I was interested in Brawlers Guild. It SEEMS like a great idea. Limiting access to individual wealth though, that's just ridiculous.

I would expect a better effort from Blizzard considering they're stance on making this game more accessible to more people.


That doesn't mean he can't make a ton of money from it. Once he gets the invite from the BMAH, he has an invite to give out. He can charge for that invite.


Except that nobody will buy from him for more than the BMAH prices, and those will only ever go down. It's a nearly guaranteed loss, financially. Maybe they'll recoup some of their ticket price to get in, but that's it.


There is no buyout and only 10 per day (to start). So, when all 10 get snapped up in the first day, I'm sure there are people who will pay whatever they would have paid on the BMAH, or more.

Granted, I shouldn't have said they would have made a ton of gold from it. They have a chance to make gold from it is a better way of putting it. The profit margin depends on how much they end up paying for the ticket and how much the buyer is willing to pay for the second invite.
About Those Invites
Invites to the Guild will (at least initially) only be available for purchase on the Black Market Auction House. We’ve taken this approach both to control queue times, and also because the Brawler’s Guild is meant to be kind of a small, underground thing, and a way for players on a realm to come together. At first, that will happen because invites will go out from one player to another based on who buys those initial Black Market invites. After reaching a certain rank in the Brawler’s Guild, each of the new members can eventually earn one new invitation of their own to pass out to someone else on the same realm, so the Brawler’s Guilds on each realm should get progressively larger and larger over time. We may also investigate alternate methods of acquiring invitations or making them more plentiful.
Personally, you already ruined my interest for the brawler guild just with this.
Wait, I've got it. Free invite to everyone with the Glorious achievement. I'd say those of us who have it have proven to be more than a little interested in solo PvE content. Given the imbalance on some realms such that one faction could buy all of the invitations, this would still keep the initial wave of players quite small while better dispersing invites.
Hey finally a place for people that buy gold from gold farmers and botters to spend all that money. you could have made it equally hard to get into the brawlers guild just by adding a tough guy to kill or something FUN. such a stupid idea for such a cool idea, but that's blizzard lately.
As I stated in the original post, the Brawler's Guild was never intended to be the big patch feature of 5.1, despite the excitement surrounding it. It really is a small feature that we've decided to try out. Since the announcement, it's become something much larger in players' minds since then, which is part of what I'm trying to address now.


Are you really that surprised? People have been asking for more solo-content for YEARS. Like for as long as I can remember. So here you are, finally delivering what purports to be challenging solo-content, and you've decided to limit access to wealth.

And you're wondering why people are both excited for this feature and at the same time frustrated with the design choices you've made?
@ Lasagna I wish I was trolling. I can understand your optimism, but I've seen to much to the contrary to share it. I may look like a pessimist with my views, but I believe myself to be a realist. It just so happens that negativity wins out in these situation more times than not.

Many have said it the powerful guilds will purchase all invites and then sell the personal invites at prices that the lower echelon can't hope to dream to afford. Personally, I have never been able to build wealth in game because there is always something else to spend it on, an alt, something my raid needs, something a friend needs, etc. It sickens me that a good deal of fun things are forever out of my reach because a privileged few have more free time and less scruples than I so that they command the developers to find ways of deflating their pocketbooks. Problem is, all that happens is more things go to them and less to us, it is a fact I have begrudgingly become used to, but I don't have to enjoy it. This is just one more example.
"Gonna stop you right there. The invite becomes BoP as soon as you purchase it from the BMAH."

You apparently have not read how this thing will be implemented. Someone buys their own invite off the BMAH. After which, at some point they will be given the opportunity to invite another person. So, yes, you are correct. Your initial invite is BoP. When you earn another however is how you get to charge stupid amounts of gold for THAT invite.

Next time do your homework before you open your mouth and sound stupid.
Also, does anyone else find it ironic that the people Brawler's Guild is most likely to attract -- soloists -- are the least likely to have the social connections necessary to experience it?

And shouldn't it be Brawlers' Guild, not Brawler's Guild? /grammar police


Verily. Also, and disconnected from the above poster's comments:

GC's "justification" is that you need to "slow down". Ok...slow down on one of the 2-3 content patches we will get before you decide to charge us for another expansion. Not to mention, we pay $15 a month. You've already forced us into cookie-cutter specs and rotations, now you feel the need to decide how many of us can play at once? Absolutely unacceptable.

The only question that really hasn't been answered is whether this is just poor design all the way, or an actual malicious attempt to artificially extend the life of content. So which is it?


I'm exceptionally tired of being told to slow down, and would appreciate it if our lead developer and every Pandaren NPC would stop telling me at what pace I should enjoy a game that I (we all together) pay very good money for. If there exists some internal hangup about hiring new staff to help the team put out new content at a pace which satisfies and entertains an average member, then that needs to be gotten over. Paraphrasing, it has been said in the past by the developer team that members consume content too quickly. As early as WotLK, we see weekly caps for points to gate gear progression, and on through Cata as well. Suddenly we're told to "slow down" all through MoP, and new and innovative ways are added to ensure that the player base must adhere to that very demand. The Brawler's Guild is the newest villainous face in a conglomerate of diabolical gating tactics that prevents me from actually performing in content that I might enjoy (solo PvE) and making me question whether or not paying every month to be bored with dailies, the same dungeons, the same raids, and the same old grindy mechanics that we've always been doing, is a reasonable idea.

Hear this: in just one humble opinion, dungeons , dailies, raids, and anything that becomes repeatable only constitutes "content" until the first time I've successfully completed it. After that, it becomes just an avenue to traverse when leveling other characters - the replay value of dailies, dungeons, scenarios (especially) and even raids is slim these days. I would rather kill 5000 naga and spam run Steamvaults for rep than take part in monotonous dailies once a day (at a pace that I can't even control) every day. It's boring, but at least unlocking things that I want is at my own pace. Similarly, the Brawler's Guild will cease to be "content" once it's been completed, which I'm sure y'all assumed to be the case, and why you estimate that this particular gated approach (an invite after one person has basically completed the Brawler's Guild content) will work for a good long while to keep the queue times down. But I don't particularly want to wait two months or more before I get to start working on this new content. I do want to do it the day of release, because I'm already bored of the content that you've given me. I was bored of it last month when I finished it (achievements also do not constitute content for me, since the vast majority seem to require that I do something 5000+ times or fight a boss in a particularly janky way).

I'm turned off by the fact that the development team is able to imagine that it's okay to inform me at what pace I should (read will) enjoy the product.
The final bidding prices on tickets are going to be going down every day, on average. I imagine smaller servers will benefit more from this, as fewer interested players = faster dropping of final bid price.
It does sort of suck that unless i want to dish out 100k+ I probably wont get to try out Brawlers guild for like 3+ months after it comes out
11/08/2012 11:57 AMPosted by Coletta
Except that nobody will buy from him for more than the BMAH prices, and those will only ever go down. It's a nearly guaranteed loss, financially. Maybe they'll recoup some of their ticket price to get in, but that's it.


This. You guys are raising torches over theoretical issues right now. You are also drastically underestimating how difficult it is to reach Rank 7. Go give the feature a try on the PTR before jumping to conclusions.


You're not taking into account how alot of people can steamroll content. How many guilds finished normal HoF last week? Those people, as individuals, are exceptional. I would be more surprised if someone didn't complete the guild and get their handout invite that same day.

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