Forcing players to AFK until they are geared

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11/09/2012 01:29 PMPosted by Daxxarri
Edit: Somewhat off-topic, I'm already regretting glibly using the term 'speed bump'. It's much more than that - getting in the face of the enemy, playing smart, using interrupts, and generally being a nuisance can actually have a significant effect on a battle, even if the player falls in the process.

Any distraction of the other team from their goal is good. I'm sure that's what you meant by "speed bump," at least that's how I interpreted it.
11/09/2012 12:34 PMPosted by Daxxarri
Getting beat down in a few hits is never fun in PVP. Dont let me hear "But I try anyways" because that is just crap. What's fun about trying when you die in a few hits anyways? REMOVE HONOR CAP BEFORE WE REACH MAX LEVEL ALREADY!


There is crafted PvP gear that can help players get off on the right foot. Actually participating in a Battleground increases your team's likelihood of winning (even under-geared players can CC, heal, or even just act as speed bumps - if you genuinely believe that you can't help in other ways, damage you are taking is still damage a team mate isn't taking). By participating, a player can accrue honorable kills, which nets more Honor. Under-geared players can also make a point of sticking with larger groups - there is safety in numbers, and getting lost in the crowd can help you stay alive long enough to make a difference.

There's a handy little guide on things you can do to give yourself an edge over on [url="http://www.arenajunkies.com/news/539-mists-of-pandaria-level-90-pvp-preparation/"]Arena Junkies[/url].

Facing the challenges involved with PvPing versus more well geared players is something that nearly all players face in Battlegrounds. There is never call to violate the terms of service and put your account (and any gear you've acquired by exploiting) at risk by AFKing in Battlegrounds.


Again, the problem you're not addressing is how long people have to spend in BGs/Arena NOT having fun, before they can start to enjoy things. Being at a significant advantage to other players is fun for all of 5 minutes, then you find yourself logging off to go do something that's actually fun.

You guys jumped the shark with so many changes this expansion, it's not even fun to play end game pvp anymore.
People have mentioned that you can still help while undergeared. Some BGs are much friendlier to undergeared players than others. It's hard to make a significant contribution in Warsong or Temple, but in Strands and Isle you have vehicles and cannons you can use, Isle has obscure nodes that you can often cap without combat, AV is full of ability-dependent things to do (e.g., if you can AOE fear, guard a tower; if you can stealth, try recapping towers/GYs), in Eye try to hide behind buildings or pillars at bases and call incomings - your mere presence, as with Tol Barad or Wintergrasp in past expansions, helps to cap the node.


You can pretend that it is skill all you like, but my mage was doing 10K damage with a pyroblast in battlegrounds.

It is just pointless me being in there.

If you feel that way, that's fine there's the door. Otherwise I'd love to have your extra polymorph and CC.

Yes, SKILL is very important, but sadly is something you're not capable of understanding.


Sorry, but Im not interested in padding your obviously over-inflated ego.

I'll take the door thanks, but don't bother complaining when Blizzard scraps PvP altogether because nobody wants it.
11/09/2012 04:35 PMPosted by Baeloro


There is crafted PvP gear that can help players get off on the right foot. Actually participating in a Battleground increases your team's likelihood of winning (even under-geared players can CC, heal, or even just act as speed bumps - if you genuinely believe that you can't help in other ways, damage you are taking is still damage a team mate isn't taking). By participating, a player can accrue honorable kills, which nets more Honor. Under-geared players can also make a point of sticking with larger groups - there is safety in numbers, and getting lost in the crowd can help you stay alive long enough to make a difference.

There's a handy little guide on things you can do to give yourself an edge over on [url="http://www.arenajunkies.com/news/539-mists-of-pandaria-level-90-pvp-preparation/"]Arena Junkies[/url].

Facing the challenges involved with PvPing versus more well geared players is something that nearly all players face in Battlegrounds. There is never call to violate the terms of service and put your account (and any gear you've acquired by exploiting) at risk by AFKing in Battlegrounds.


Again, the problem you're not addressing is how long people have to spend in BGs/Arena NOT having fun, before they can start to enjoy things. Being at a significant advantage to other players is fun for all of 5 minutes, then you find yourself logging off to go do something that's actually fun.

You guys jumped the shark with so many changes this expansion, it's not even fun to play end game pvp anymore.


This x100. Honestly, I could not be more in agreement!
11/09/2012 11:41 AMPosted by Chunlî
Getting beat down in a few hits is never fun in PVP. Dont let me hear "But I try anyways" because that is just crap. What's fun about trying when you die in a few hits anyways? REMOVE HONOR CAP BEFORE WE REACH MAX LEVEL ALREADY!

Crafted pvp gear can help. Go buy that. If you don't want to buy it, farm it. Ghost iron is so easy to get.
Question about reporting the bots: is it better to report as afk, or report the player for cheating?

It's much faster to report afk, but when I can take the time I report them for cheating with the reason "bg botting." Is there any difference in how seriously blizzard takes either report?
11/09/2012 03:29 PMPosted by Gunny
It is a great help to us when players use the reporting tools that we've included in the game, though. It seems that use of the AFK reporting feature has dropped off considerably, which is unfortunate, because it really does play a direct and active role in our investigations. Ultimately, cynicism doesn't help us catch the offenders. And yes, I realize that bots will clear the AFK flag by getting into combat. Rest assured that the reports can still help.


When you can queue into a 10 man BG and find that 6 players are bots it's no surprise that the number of reports has gone down. They obviously aren't going to report themselves. Factor in player frustration over an apparent lack of effort on Blizzard's part to curb botting, the lack of any apparent impact from reporting, and not a hint of anything coming down the pipe to resolve the issue and it's no surprise people have given up.

It feels like the only alternative is to post in the forums, or simply live with it. We all know that random BGs aren't your focus because let's face it, they don't generate any publicity, but it is still where most people get their PvP on.

How about putting some resources to work on solving the issue? Implement any of the suggestions players have put forth over the years. Something besides putting the onus on players to clean up your mess.


Blizzards stance of not letting people know when the system they are using like AFK reporting IS working its a catch 22. You people designed this flaw and expect us to put up with it? Less reporting could be i dunno...less people playing BG's because there's NO point.

You can't rambo a BG and carrying a bunch of bots is impossible. So what do people do? They quit because you guys refuse to show us that this IS working.
11/09/2012 01:29 PMPosted by Daxxarri
Please tell me you're joking.


Not, I'm not joking, nor were the other players who suggested it as one of several options. It exists, and it can help plug gaps in gear while earning points for better gear. If the concern is walking into PvP and getting steamrolled until you can earn Honor or Conquest gear, it's still a step in the right direction.

Edit: Somewhat off-topic, I'm already regretting glibly using the term 'speed bump'. It's much more than that - getting in the face of the enemy, playing smart, using interrupts, and generally being a nuisance can actually have a significant effect on a battle, even if the player falls in the process.


Afking in a battle ground is not against ToS. What if I have to pee? What f something needs my attention for 30 seconds?
11/09/2012 05:15 PMPosted by Cellnine
You can't rambo a BG and carrying a bunch of bots is impossible. So what do people do? They quit because you guys refuse to show us that this IS working.


Whatever Blizz is doing (if anything) is NOT working. Botting has gotten worse. Much worse.

The other day I was in a BG with 6 bots. They were all horde and I honestly felt bad for the real players on that team.

We are constantly working to ensure that PvP is fair and fun, and it this is an important issue to us.

It is a great help to us when players use the reporting tools that we've included in the game, though. It seems that use of the AFK reporting feature has dropped off considerably, which is unfortunate, because it really does play a direct and active role in our investigations. Ultimately, cynicism doesn't help us catch the offenders. And yes, I realize that bots will clear the AFK flag by getting into combat. Rest assured that the reports can still help.


That is because the community has created the notion that reporting people AFK in a BG is a bad thing to do and actually ostrosize (sp?) and flame those who do so.
Afking in a battle ground is not against ToS. What if I have to pee? What f something needs my attention for 30 seconds?
Yes, it is. Blizzard made this a rule a few years ago after the community complained about it loud enough. They even announced it's implementation at BlizzCon. "We have plans for these people" were the exact words.
11/09/2012 12:34 PMPosted by Daxxarri
There is crafted PvP gear that can help players get off on the right foot. Actually participating in a Battleground increases your team's likelihood of winning (even under-geared players can CC, heal, or even just act as speed bumps - if you genuinely believe that you can't help in other ways, damage you are taking is still damage a team mate isn't taking). By participating, a player can accrue honorable kills, which nets more Honor. Under-geared players can also make a point of sticking with larger groups - there is safety in numbers, and getting lost in the crowd can help you stay alive long enough to make a difference.


I can also mention that crafted PvP gear is, in general, easier to make than in past expansions.
11/09/2012 12:34 PMPosted by Daxxarri
act as speed bumps

It's honestly more fun to /afk and watch grass grow than be a speed bump.
11/09/2012 06:48 PMPosted by Dethh
Afking in a battle ground is not against ToS. What if I have to pee? What f something needs my attention for 30 seconds?


Perhaps you are confusing a player who is actually playing with the guy who runs his bot for 23 hours a day.

The human player is technically AFK when he goes AFK. Whereas the bot is against EUA.
When it comes to non-RBGs, I'm all for standardizing iLvl for all players when they enter. Take gear discrepancy right off the table. Put fun first. It's a GAME after all.

Anyone with skill shouldn't complain about this.

Then what's the point of honor you say? You still need gear outside of the BG. Nothing changes there. And you'll need that gear for RBGs too. But hopping into a pug BG should be about fun first and foremost. Not about suffering through or "doing the best you can with what you got".

As for the argument that even the most shabbily geared person can have an impact on a BG with their CCs, I agree. Under-geared players definitely impact my game by increasing how much honor and HKs I get when I see them on the battlefield.
This is my second week since dinging 90 and I almost have full honor gear (down 1 trinket but I am inordinately attached to my dragonling) plus one conquest piece. While leveling and doing bgs I did think it was too bad I couldn't start off at 90 with more honor built up, but it wasn't really that much of a set back. I am pretty surprised actually how quickly I was able to get gear. I purchased 2 crafted pieces originally and in random bgs I tried to stay in the side lines, stay grouped with other players, hide (I think most people say LOS). Yes I got smashed a few times but that is part of the game. Do wish there were honor weapons though. But, meh, I will cope.
Large part of the problem is that gear scaling continues to increase every expansion, meaning there's a larger gap between blue and epic now than there was in Cataclysm, and there was a larger gap in Cata than in WotLK and so on. This really needs to be chilled out. Gear should provide a benefit, but the benefit is too extreme.

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