hmm?

General Discussion
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11/05/2012 10:16 PMPosted by Onionrings
But it isn't optional. You have to do dailies to get rep. there is no other way. There is no "option".


You can do fine with just dungeon and lfr gear
11/05/2012 10:14 PMPosted by Maigraith
I want options for myself. That doesn't affect you in any way.


I'll agree with that statement, if you'll agree that I should get the same rewards that hardcore raiders get, in some fashion that doesn't require me to put much effort into it... I won't be taking anything from a hardcore raider.... I just want options on how I earn it.
11/05/2012 10:18 PMPosted by Rosenivy
You can do fine with just dungeon and lfr gear


...to a point.
11/05/2012 10:18 PMPosted by Rosenivy
But it isn't optional. You have to do dailies to get rep. there is no other way. There is no "option".


You can do fine with just dungeon and lfr gear


And I'll do better with valor gear. Allowing me to get that valor gear through something other than dailies doesn't hurt anyone. And would actually make this "game", something that is supposed to provide entertainment, actually entertaining.
Well my point was really that those epics will rarely make or break your raid success, and even in those rare cases, however, a solo player can derive non-cosmetic benefits from the Rep gear without ever stepping in a raid. So I DO see the epics as relevant to raids. I just also think the raider complaints about Rep gear are pretty overstated.

Again, I agreed with you overall except for that minor semantic difference.


I suppose a daily hero could get their overall daily time down to 20 mins a day with a full valor set.

OOH! Challenge mode dailes! Bring it Blizz!


Brawler's Guild! Maybe? I dunno. Training Grounds one day? I haven't really read that much about it.

Anyway, it depends on if we're talking about normal or hard mode raiding. I can't attest to knowing much of what awaits in terms of gear checks in the T14 H raids, but where having to rotate undergeared players is concerned badge/valor gear has always been able to make a huge difference in a reasonable time span. Charms are a nice RNG buffer but there's no guarantee you won't get 10 bags of gold, duplicates, or so on... Valor is/was something you can count on.


I do believe elsewhere Blizzard CMs have noted that if a raid (or a player) is in that kind of Heroic raiding situation as you described, they have already gone out of the "price range" for Valor/LFR/etc, so to speak.

I totally agree that using Valor/LFR to supplement bad luck RNG was a reliable system that bolstered a lot of raids. I think Blizzard thought it was a little TOO reliable, maybe? At least compared to the quality of the gear. Assuming the 5.1 upgrade system is NOT tied to rep, it'll be reliable again. It just won't be as "good," and I think that's kind of the point.
11/05/2012 10:15 PMPosted by Baby
I can and will however argue that letting me play the way I want to is something to consider.


I want to pop out of stealth and yell "Boo!" and the mob fall down dead (even if it's a raid boss).... they won't let me play the way I want to either.

=(


...LOL

You got a +1 from me

11/05/2012 10:16 PMPosted by Onionrings
But it isn't optional. You have to do dailies to get rep. there is no other way. There is no "option".


As others have said, you don't NEED the rep. Does it help? Yes. Especially for crafting.

But it's NOT needed. You don't NEED the recipes, gold reward, or gear. Hell, if you raid, you'll get better pieces of gear pretty damn soon.

If you don't (like me), then the gear from rep is optional to get. I went around in Cata in heroic dungeon gear until HoT was released.

Then I did dailies (for rep with factions like teh guardians of Hyjal at molten front), etc. to raise my Ilvl

You can also wait until the next content patch for better gear.

Really, there ARE options
11/05/2012 09:54 PMPosted by Maigraith
Maybe you should take your own advice...not everyone wants the same things in this game as you...maybe you should try grasping THAT idea. It's easy, M'kay?


Here's the difference: if I get my way, if rep is decoupled from valor, nothing changes for anyone else. I don't want the dailies removed. I don't want fewer options. I want everyone to be able to play how they want to. Honestly, I don't care at all what anyone else does. I just want to be able to keep playing WoW as I have for the last three years, and that doesn't hurt anyone.


If you decouple rep and valor then there are no rewards for people who mostly like questing and don't run other content.

Why does only your playstyle deserve nice rewards?
The only thing I have to complain about those Lesser Charms is the amount that keeps getting stuck in my backpack and accumulating even more.

While they are going to make it a currency, I don't see the point of all these Lesser Charms going waste in my Currency Tab, since there's nothing else to consume but a weekly.

I think they should make them Bind on Account. I certainly don't want to farm dailies on my alts, but still, I want to do dailies in my main. Why can't I use it if I'm getting so many of them anyways?
If you decouple rep and valor then there are no rewards for people who mostly like questing and don't run other content.

Why does only your playstyle deserve nice rewards?


But those people who like dailies can still do them? Daily questers will still get their valor and rep how they want to get it. They still get the exact same thing they get now. Providing true options allows more people to play how they want to play, making it a better experience for everyone.

11/05/2012 10:24 PMPosted by Juststabd
Really, there ARE options


Yeah, I guess you're right. Keep paying for a game that I don't enjoy, or finally call it quits.
Here's the difference: if I get my way, if rep is decoupled from valor, nothing changes for anyone else. I don't want the dailies removed. I don't want fewer options. I want everyone to be able to play how they want to. Honestly, I don't care at all what anyone else does. I just want to be able to keep playing WoW as I have for the last three years, and that doesn't hurt anyone.


If you decouple rep and valor then there are no rewards for people who mostly like questing and don't run other content.

Why does only your playstyle deserve nice rewards?


You'd still get valor from dailies, which could still be used for rewards exactly as you do now.

So I guess the question is why does only your playstyle deserve nice rewards?
Not sure if its been said yet but grinding out dailies to get rep and the coins is ok for one toon but for multiples.....not happening. Why, since the faction tabards arent availible until one toon is exalted cant that tabard be a BoA that allows rep from dungeons so you can get rep on alts faster?
They are trying in the next patch to increase rep gained for alts once one has reached reverd with a faction, but whats the only method to gain rep?.... more dailies, way to much of a time sink. Why cant there be acount bound rep or BoA tabard (unlocked at exalted)?
Really, there ARE options

Yeah, I guess you're right. Keep paying for a game that I don't enjoy, or finally call it quits.


This is what I don't get.

Why do people like you keep playing if they hate the game?

Drop it if you don't like it. I still like it, so I still play.

If you don't enjoy, then why complain, and not just drop it?

Gamer logic.
Well, I should be moving on. It's clear that I'm getting nowhere by posting here. I will never understand why people -- be they players or developers -- are so against the notion of giving people multiple viable options of progression. It can only lead to more players having more fun, and that's good news for everyone.

I'm sure the game will be enjoyable again after a few patches have gone by, and that's when I'll resub. The nice thing about WoW is that they always fix their worst mistakes.

The agonizing thing about WoW is that they keep making really big mistakes every expansion. ><

Edit: I know it doesn't seem that way, but I wouldn't post about this so much if there wasn't a lot about WoW I really love. I love the lore, the art, the music, the voice-overs, the characters. I just want this one stupid annoyance gone so I can appreciate all the great work Blizzard has done.

11/05/2012 10:20 PMPosted by Baby
I'll agree with that statement, if you'll agree that I should get the same rewards that hardcore raiders get, in some fashion that doesn't require me to put much effort into it... I won't be taking anything from a hardcore raider.... I just want options on how I earn it.


I really hate using this term, because it gets brutally over-used in these parts, but your responses to me are pretty much the definition of a strawman argument. You're taking what I say to its furthest, most ridiculous extreme in an attempt to discredit my views.

If you decouple rep and valor then there are no rewards for people who mostly like questing and don't run other content.

Why does only your playstyle deserve nice rewards?


By decouple rep and valor, I mean the ability to spend it. Dailies can still award valor; that's a great feature that I openly praise.

I want everyone to be able to get and spend valor through any combination of raids, dungeons, scenarios, and/or dailies. That's the choice that was advertised for MoP, but not what was delivered.
11/05/2012 10:30 PMPosted by Analt


If you decouple rep and valor then there are no rewards for people who mostly like questing and don't run other content.

Why does only your playstyle deserve nice rewards?


You'd still get valor from dailies, which could still be used for rewards exactly as you do now.

So I guess the question is why does only your playstyle deserve nice rewards?


Because that playstyle is basically want the Dev want to see from us in general?

Because we're following their suggested path of progression and getting out into the world and doing stuff?

Because we're logging in every day and doing a little of this and a little of that as opposed to sitting in the cities and ignoring the wider game world?
The content really is optional, and if you aren't enjoying yourself, you could always take a break and not play for a while. No one is forcing your hand in this.

I just find it hilarious that the majority of you complain about the game being way too dumbed down and easy, and yet when given something that is very similar to classic WoW standards, you freak out. Back then there weren't any dailies! People did just fine you know! Gold was very hard to come by and you just grinded! You didnt have to, you could make alts... No one is twisting your hands to stay!
If this post didn't warrant a blue response then perhaps you should not have responded. I don't post on this forums often, very much at all honestly. When i do it's usually because I'm completely taken aback by the types of responses made by blizzard representatives and the general direction this company is moving. You folks will soon find you're not untouchable, it might not be tomorrow, it might not be a week from now but you will find that sitting on your high horse will only continue to degrade what little respect people have for you as both game developers, customer relations and good people in general.
I wouldn't prefer copy and paste answers to a real persons heartfelt and grounded response. However as with everything the street goes both ways. We are the paying customer, we are the majority and we keep you employed. The posts and lame announcemts once every year from blizzard thanking it's customers for their support is inadequate as the general feeling I get (a have seen from multiple posts from others) that we don't feel that way.

You can't please everyone, but you folks need to realize that perhaps your method is not always going to work and that it isn't always the best. I have to say that I've enjoyed indie game companies and their communities most recently than I have ever with blizzard. My fond memories of diablo and vanilla wow have been shattered by Disappointing patches, changes, expansions, games and community relations. Heck my last GM ticket was rife with insinuations from the GM and was anything but respectful. The tone changed when I conveyed my disgust.

Just like some forum goers, perhaps a blue should sit back and think harder next time if they too should bother posting and if it is in the best interest for both their customer, community and game.

-an increasingly disappointed customer
This is what I don't get.

Why do people like you keep playing if they hate the game?

Drop it if you don't like it. I still like it, so I still play.

If you don't enjoy, then why complain, and not just drop it?

Gamer logic.


Because there was a time when I loved this game. And I sorely miss those times, and (apparently foolishly) hope that those days return, and I have the game I loved back.
fun fact

Zarhym's avatar match's..up perfectly with the song move your body


Odd I'm listening to rammstein and he fits for that too

Skulls are fluent in other languages apparently

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