I'm uhnappy w/ the current representatives II

General Discussion
Prev 1 5 6 7 Next
Should think? NO even that is a complete fallacy.
11/06/2012 04:27 PMPosted by Arkimus
I work for customer service. If someone has a legitimate complaint i do what i was hired to do. Deal with it in a way that satisfies the customer and makes everyone happy. On the other hand, if a customer is being a belligerant !@#$%^ then i have full rights to deal with them appropriately up to and including sending them out of the store. I don't get paid enough to put up with rude people who believe they are "royalty" and i won't. Neither should the people of blizzard. They are here to promote good customer service and a fun game environment. Not wait on people hand and foot.


Their failure has been to allow belligerent customers to troll and denigrate these forums for so long it's the norm. They either need to hold people to higher standards or accept what they get. Trolling customers is not the way to do it.
11/06/2012 04:29 PMPosted by Karamok
I work for customer service. If someone has a legitimate complaint i do what i was hired to do. Deal with it in a way that satisfies the customer and makes everyone happy. On the other hand, if a customer is being a belligerant !@#$%^ then i have full rights to deal with them appropriately up to and including sending them out of the store. I don't get paid enough to put up with rude people who believe they are "royalty" and i won't. Neither should the people of blizzard. They are here to promote good customer service and a fun game environment. Not wait on people hand and foot.


Their failure has been to allow belligerent customers to troll and denigrate these forums for so long it's the norm. They either need to hold people to higher standards or accept what they get. Trolling customers is not the way to do it.


Obviously but have you seen the D3 forums? It's worse then here.
Their failure has been to allow belligerent customers to troll and denigrate these forums for so long it's the norm. They either need to hold people to higher standards or accept what they get. Trolling customers is not the way to do it.


They are able to ban people, so clearly the don't have to accept what they get.
11/06/2012 04:29 PMPosted by Lorthuron
Should think? NO even that is a complete fallacy.


There are three ways of looking at it - an "ascension" really

1. "I'm the customer so I'm always right" <- the purely selfish motivation

2. "We the customers are always right" <- the collective motivation

3. "What's best for the game is always right" <- the higher motivation

The first one is where people say they don't like something so Blizzard should nerf it. The second is where people try to say a lot of players don't like something and collectively the playerbase's wishes should matter more than dev decision. The final is where you realize that even majority opinion may not be what is best for the game... that if the majority always got its way - we'd all pay a penny a year, get free stuff all the time, and all our alts are handed epics.

So the business should be *thinking* of satisfying the customer, ABSOLUTELY. However they should also be thinking of how to protect the customers from each other.

The PVP forums never see any kind of interaction with the Blues beyond a few stickies. Yes opinions on PVP can be quite volatile at times but PVP is as much a part of this game as any other portion, yet PVPers see no contact with the community managers.


I'm not sure it would do any overall good to. I love a good debate, but even I know to avoid pvp threads and class-balance threads. They tend to be extremely heated and contested threads that almost inevitably devolve into personal attacks. The canonical example being: "Well if you can't beat a <x> then ur bad"

There can be benefit to listening to the arguments made in such threads, but posting to them is unwise.


but the result is that PVPers get nothing.
no insights on where PVP is going
no comments about what they can expect in the future
no indication on how problems are going to be addressed.

That entire portion of the community is cut off from any kind of interaction on topics they care about. Is it any wonder that a large portion of the PVP community feels like the people behind the game don't give a damn about them or their part in the game.

If people want to know what is going on in PVP they have to look at the patch notes or dig through 3rd party sites for hints.

Dealing with the PVP community has become that Quest nobody wants to do.
The Fatty Goat steak daily where people just say "F' That"

I pity that poor quest giver. Standing there with a pile Ironpaw tokens and Valor Points and nobody want to help him. Watching as adventurers take the long way around the market to avoid him and go help Gina collect money from deadbeats.
Then Drakmar you should try to at least try and report posts that go against the forum CoC. Blizzard won't change their tune if people like us don't take a stand.
Contrary to popular belief, customer service isn't always about making the customer happy. In my experience (and I've worked in a customer service setting for almost 7 years now) customer service is just as much about simply not telling the customer what you really want to say as it is about trying to make them happy. There are some customers that will simply never be happy no matter what the customer service provider tries, and in those cases customer service can often be a simple matter of finding a polite way to tell the person to simply drop the issue since it's clear they're not going to be satisfied no matter what.

I personally applaude the blue's on their ability to not lash out against this community that clearly has no appreciation for the amount of hard work that goes into this game. Perhaps if people had an ounce of patience and understanding then they might find that the things they want done in the game would probably get done better and faster.

but the result is that PVPers get nothing.
no insights on where PVP is going
no comments about what they can expect in the future
no indication on how problems are going to be addressed.

That entire portion of the community is cut off from any kind of interaction on topics they care about. Is it any wonder that a large portion of the PVP community feels like the people behind the game don't give a damn about them or their part in the game.


Well they do release information, but I am not particularly sympathetic when hostile portions of the playerbase complaint that they should be able to be hostile but expect a lot of CM involvement. I saw the same thing happen with the role forums, where players went crazy over GC until I think eventually he just decided it wasn't productive to try to continue the 1-on-1 dialogue with those forums anymore.

Really blue posts to threads are extras - if they are carrying info from the playerbase to the devs (which only requires reading) and bringing info back (as blue threads to general or patch notes do), then they are meeting their job requirement.

If a group like PvP or the role forums want more dialogue and communication, then it is important to remember that communication must go both ways. You can't just be blatantly openly hostile and rude towards them and then go "oh but you HAVE to engage with us".... because no, they don't.
I would like to see some more Blue interaction with players outside the GD forum, but honestly, from what I've seen on bluetrackers and stuff, I'm pretty happy with how the Blues behave.
I consider most CM blue posters [...] and the MVP green posters to have a "customer service/relations" type of role here on the forums.

MVP's have no relation to Blizzard. They're community members who frequently contribute to the forums in meaningful ways. Ie. helpfully point out actual forum policies or constructive feedback.

They're not Blizzard employees as so many people like to treat them. I don't see what's so hard to understand about that. I chalk it up to status envy. People see shiny green text and think they're opinion is somehow more important than their own and so when these community members discuss opinions contrary to one's own, they somehow nerd rage into feeling Blizzard is belittling them.

The same, of course, which happens with Blues all the time as well. Except MVP's are just normal players who were recognized with a "award" for being strong forum contributors.

An a new note, I frequently love reading Blizzard CM's politely, professionally and directly point out peoples baseless, unreasonable and irrational arguments. And the common ensuing nerd rage from hurt feelings that ensures because everyone knows those kinds of people who can't accept their POV not being shared by all.
11/06/2012 03:31 PMPosted by Ajulynn
You don't have to agree with it but if you don't do exactly what you don't agree with you will lose millions of dollars in subs. You have people hooked on your product so you think you can treat them with disdain like a drug dealer to an addict. People will run to the best next thing just to not deal with your arrogance. Have fun losing money over that high horse attitude you all seem to have.


When was a Blue poster outright rude, to you personally? Because you're making it sound like they treat us all badly, and I gotta tell you, I don't see or feel it.


This

http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/5847924838?page=2#28

And his track record is the mindset of "if you don't agree with what I'm saying I put my fingers in my ears for a few responses and ignore any valid point you have and when I want to take my fingers out I lash out at you".

That guy has been trolling and abusive for months.

http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/5847924838?page=2#28



I think, if you are going to use that thread (and I do find it interesting you had to go to the eu forums) - that people should start with the first post here: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/5847924838?page=1#7 - and then see how the conversation progressed.


When was a Blue poster outright rude, to you personally? Because you're making it sound like they treat us all badly, and I gotta tell you, I don't see or feel it.


This

http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/5847924838?page=2#28

And his track record is the mindset of "if you don't agree with what I'm saying I put my fingers in my ears for a few responses and ignore any valid point you have and when I want to take my fingers out I lash out at you".

That guy has been trolling and abusive for months.


Disagreeing with the OP is NOT trolling.

I'm not too sure how much more clear anyone; players, CMs, and MVPs can be on this.

Draztal is trying to get an objective conversation moving. Read some of the posts in those threads, he's handling those topics like a pro. It's very difficult to try to reason with the unreasonable.
11/06/2012 03:44 PMPosted by Zarhym
You'd be better off comparing what we do to a town hall debate, but I'm not running for anything. ;)


I think this would be more akin to a smaller version of Blizzcon and such really.

It all comes down to about 3 things:

1) Somehow people took to thinking these forums are a place to demand answers.

2) The people who really have the answers are busy correcting these things

3) Regardless of where you work in Blizzard as long as your name holds that nice icon along with it, you are speaking from the company in the public's eyes. Just like any corporation, organization, etc you may be speaking as a person, but the public views you as Blizzard.

It's just like how you're subject to UCMJ punishment if you attend a political rally in uniform as a service member. People view that as whichever branch you're in is supporting that candidate. You could be the lowest ranking peon in the military but as long as people see that uniform there they think you represent the military.

but the result is that PVPers get nothing.
no insights on where PVP is going
no comments about what they can expect in the future
no indication on how problems are going to be addressed.

That entire portion of the community is cut off from any kind of interaction on topics they care about. Is it any wonder that a large portion of the PVP community feels like the people behind the game don't give a damn about them or their part in the game.


Well they do release information, but I am not particularly sympathetic when hostile portions of the playerbase complaint that they should be able to be hostile but expect a lot of CM involvement. I saw the same thing happen with the role forums, where players went crazy over GC until I think eventually he just decided it wasn't productive to try to continue the 1-on-1 dialogue with those forums anymore.

Really blue posts to threads are extras - if they are carrying info from the playerbase to the devs (which only requires reading) and bringing info back (as blue threads to general or patch notes do), then they are meeting their job requirement.

If a group like PvP or the role forums want more dialogue and communication, then it is important to remember that communication must go both ways. You can't just be blatantly openly hostile and rude towards them and then go "oh but you HAVE to engage with us".... because no, they don't.


Stop is with this "HAVE to do this and DON'T HAVE to do that" business.

The official means of communication, chosen by Acti-Blizz, to the players is through the forums. Go to any board here and you will find dozens of pages of threads containing constructive feedback going unnoticed or unanswered. Players are becoming hostile towards Blues because they feel they aren't being heard. Apparently, one Sha of Happiness is more important than hundreds of other gameplay-related threads.

Any interaction between a business and the entity they are doing business with contains elements of customer service. There are several reoccurring breakdowns in WoW's customer service:

1. Blues- inconsistent, ambiguous, indifferent
2. MVPs- many have evident "fanboy" responses to other players
3. Email- many emails sent to CS fall into an abyss or receive copy-and-paste responses
4. Phone- calls take too long to go through
5. In-game ticket- players wait several days for a copy-and-paste response

Each individual experience I have had with their customer service has been decent but the sum of the stated issues is cause for frustration.
This

http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/5847924838?page=2#28

And his track record is the mindset of "if you don't agree with what I'm saying I put my fingers in my ears for a few responses and ignore any valid point you have and when I want to take my fingers out I lash out at you".

That guy has been trolling and abusive for months.


So, the first example you think of is from the EU forums, when I was speaking of the forums we are actually having this discussion on.

http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/5847924838?page=2#28


I think, if you are going to use that thread (and I do find it interesting you had to go to the eu forums) - that people should start with the first post here: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/5847924838?page=1#7 - and then see how the conversation progressed.


It doesn't matter how it progressed. He didn't "disagree". He got pissy, he attacked a poster, and this is not the first time.

So if a poster CONSISTENTLY attacks posters I'm allowed to attack them? There's plenty of people over in the damage dealing forums that are constantly launching personal attacks on players which is strictly against forum rules. You know what I do now? I politely inform them that it is against forum rules to attack the poster rather than the discussion.

This blue basically breaks the forums own rules when it suits him. The thread I linked was him getting sarcastic, pissy and attacking, not trolling. He has trolled on plenty of occassions and done this same thing before. Basically he acts like he's above the law now.

Join the Conversation

Return to Forum