Nightelves and warlocks.. Friendly?

Wyrmrest Accord
This concept of severity of wars fascinates me. Let's talk about it for a bit.

Ultimately, it can work. The Legion works as an ever-present, ever-lingering threat in the background, perpetually ready to strike at a moment's notice. Velen works as a good way to remind us of it's dangers, certainly.

But the key word there needs to be "background." If the Legion becomes an omnipresent threat, on par and greater than the current battle, then the tension of the current conflict is stripped away.

Think about MoP's war. We're locked in a duel to the death, neither side willing to compromise and each one knowing that it will end in one of their total destruction. It's a fight to the finish and there is no room for survivors.

And then Velen says: "Oh, guys, there's another bigger, badder guy out there."

Suddenly, our conflict doesn't seem so interesting.

This, in fact, is why Draenei don't get a lot of lore. They've been portrayed as mostly half-in on the Alliance (though that's changing), with their main concern being the Legion. That was fine for Burning Crusade, but Blizzard really failed to have the Draenei's concerns change with the times. They've always been concerned with the Legion and when the Legion isn't the immediate threat, all that concern does is make the Draenei less involved and make the immediate threat less threatening.

They're playing it somewhat smart here with Wrathion being suitably ominous, but there's a good reason Velen's sitting out.

Mind you, it could be done better.


Yeah. I do agree.

So far, MoP writing has been much better than what cata was, and with wrathion acting as a double agent toward goals no one else but him knows can really add a new depth.

Is he really trying to protect azeroth? Is he really the last uncorrupted black dragon? Or is he just the emergency plan of deathwing? I just hope that it doesn't turn into a trainwreck that crashed into "LOLCORRUPTION" to explain garrosh as the final raid boss.
11/27/2012 08:08 PMPosted by Ornasse
I'd be dubious of any kaldorei in Stormwind, to begin with.


This.
Well, let's chime in with the warlock. There are certain rules a warlock should follow. (These are Adira's rules in interactions when she is wandering about.)

1) Be careful what you say.
2) Be careful what you do.
3) Be careful what you wear. (I can't stress this part enough.)
4) All power has a corresponding price.

It's the final point that the two Night Elves failed to observe in their interaction. Seriously, a long lived race with that much prejudice changing that fast? I don't see it. Warlocks pay a price for their powers. Mistrust is just the milder cost associated with the group, and a long lived race will always be dubious of such dark magics.

And...the warlock failed the second rule immediately. That demon is a dead giveaway; you may as well just pop full demon form as Demonology and call for the NPC guards to haul you away.

The rules I follow dovetail well with the lore, but they only apply in public. In war, things change. In Tides of War, warlocks are used for a sea battle. Fire at sea is a ship's most dangerous foe, and what is one thing a warlock has plenty of? Fire, if Destro, and imps. It's just a matter of using your people in a manner that most reflects your need at the time. I want to sink ships, so I'll burn them down.

Onto Kaldorei in Stormwind, I would use the phrase "passing through", which is true enough.
Why would you be dubious of Kaldorei in Stormwind?

The storyline's evolved far enough that we're all pretty solid teammates here.
12/01/2012 08:02 PMPosted by Enekie
The storyline's evolved far enough that we're all pretty solid teammates here.


Quite. There are Night Elves in SI:7.
Thanks for all the feed back, wow even Enekie (I feel special). But also I was wondering, why would you be dubious to Nightelves being in Stormwind?

Enekie will post on any thread dealing with Night Elves, the destruction of the Horde/Alliance lore or misogyny.


And where there is Enekie, there is Layam to complain about Enekie.

12/01/2012 06:54 PMPosted by Ladencrel
I'd be dubious of any kaldorei in Stormwind, to begin with.


This.


>> Lordaeron Temple Knights
Quoting Viezra:
12/01/2012 03:15 PMPosted by Viezra
... but what people often forget is that behind that character is another player, and sometimes it is very easy to push the boundaries of insulting/hating a character and hating the player of that character.


and Enekie:
I take everything Metzen says with a grain of salt. He tends to contradict himself regularly.


These are both points I think are highly valid and useful to remember.

There's been this debate for most of the time I've been an RPer over whether or not it's okay to have demons "out" in cities. From a lore/IC standpoint, I agree they shouldn't be. There is one thing I am less a fan of than demons out in cities, though, and that's harassing players who have demons out in cities. Viezra's comment illustrates why: At the bottom of it, that character is being run by a player who is simply trying to enjoy a game. Simple common courtesy: Say something if your character would, of course, but keep in mind that it's very easy to cross the line into harassment and that is not okay to harass someone no matter what your "Character" would do because at the end of the day, we aren't characters. We're people playing characters.

This is kind of what bugs me when this debate comes up and you've always got someone claiming that they would "kill" the warlock on sight. Without even trying to address the obviousness of guards probably hacking you down where you stand for the sudden act of randomass violent murder, you have to consider that it's a video game and everyone gets to have fun playing it without interactions that cross the line into harassment.

I mean, I've walked through Cathedral Square and seen a group of people harassing the crap out of someone with a felpuppy out, to the point where the warlock player is clearly upset OOC and asking people in OOC brackets to leave him alone, and people begin chewing him out in OOC brackets. That's just not cool behavior, at all. It's actually pretty inexcusable. Unfortunately, the server has a lynchmob mentality about warlocks so there's no check on that type of antisocial behavior and there really needs to be a self-check in place about it. Good rule of thumb: When you're RPing your character being aggressive, hostile or confrontational and you are asked OOC to please cool it, it's time to cool it.

As far as Enekie's comments about Metzen, I'm in agreement. Nothing was ever formally said on the subject of demons in cities and then someone asked Metzen at a Blizzcon if wasn't it "illegal" and Metzen's reaction was along the lines of "Sure, yeah, it would be". And people ran with that like it was golden law spilling from the lips of the Gods, and I'm highly doubtful that Metzen's intention was for folks to go forth and make like hell for warlock players who don't play the way they think warlock players should. It actually came across in the original interview (to me anyway) like he thought it was a good debate point and he could see where it was coming from, and he gave some of his own thoughts on it. One thing it absolutely didn't come across as was permission to harass anyone.

(reposted this after accidentally submitting it before I was done typing it!)
This is why jurtiric doesnt have his demons out In any citys, Mabey at times he has his imp out but come on its a imp, not like a felguard. My guy knows how some people are towards warlocks even if they have serverd with the alliance military.
Hmm, I have one question. What about Succubi(And their upgrade) with invisibility?
Honestly why would ANYBODY be okay with a demon walking around Stormwind? To put it into perspective, even warriors keep their swords sheathed when walking around the city. Would you want a dude running around your hometown with a stinger missile on his shoulder? Honestly I'm not even going to touch the fact that demons are universally reviled by all civilized races on Azeroth with the exception of maybe the Forsaken and Goblins, but seriously people. Just because nukes are allowed in wartime doesn't mean you're allowed to carry a backpack full of depleted uranium bombs around.

Honestly though this extends to a lot of things. I'd imagine people would be tremendously uncomfortable seeing a Worgen sprint around on all fours, a Hunter walk around with a core hound, a shaman or mage summoning an elemental, or even a Priest in shadowform. I don't bring it up in game anymore because honestly it's not worth the argument. If I see a warlock walking around IC with a demon like it ain't no thing, I assume they're bad at RPing and don't start RPing with them.
I think most people hate warlocks. It's part of the job. Most are distrusting of us and our seedy little ways. If you RP the class, you accept that.

ETA:
12/03/2012 06:21 AMPosted by Jurtiric
This is why jurtiric doesnt have his demons out In any citys, Mabey at times he has his imp out but come on its a imp, not like a felguard. My guy knows how some people are towards warlocks even if they have serverd with the alliance military.


I still don't trust you gnomes with demons after Jaraxxus.
I remember a while back reading how one warlock RPer walked around with a demon following him most of the time. Whenever anyone brought it up, he acted like he had not noticed the creature following him, and immediately banished it, making himself look not like a warlock, but a magic-user who was being stalked by a demon. That way, he appeared heroic for "Killing a Demon", and probably earned a good reputation because of it.

I always thought that was a pretty good way to handle it anyway.

For this character though, I almost never am seen using a demon. The only time I ever have one near me is when I am killing it to absorb it's power. Besides, I figure the glowing balls of Fel energy swirling around my head make me off-putting enough already.
12/02/2012 07:58 PMPosted by Arielen

Enekie will post on any thread dealing with Night Elves, the destruction of the Horde/Alliance lore or misogyny.


And where there is Enekie, there is Layam to complain about Enekie.


Layam complains about everything.


And where there is Enekie, there is Layam to complain about Enekie.


Layam complains about everything.

GET OFF MY LORE!
Damn youngin's and their RPG books

In my day we had the Similarion and we liked it!

Pen and paper pshaw I say!

-Layam's Smilin' DK
;( So nothing about the possibility of keeping succubi out with invisibility?
Without even trying to address the obviousness of guards probably hacking you down where you stand for the sudden act of randomass violent murder


Guards still hack you down for random murder in Stormwind? How droll.

On topic: I think anyone who would want to play a character that would be forced(or effectively NOT be in character) to kill another player's character is a bit..draining. It's not fun when someone says "Oh no, you can't do that. Or guess what? I'mma kill you cause you must be evil."

Why you would want to restrict your character in such a way that forces confrontation, I'll never know.

Guards still hack you down for random murder in Stormwind? How droll.

On topic: I think anyone who would want to play a character that would be forced(or effectively NOT be in character) to kill another player's character is a bit..draining. It's not fun when someone says "Oh no, you can't do that. Or guess what? I'mma kill you cause you must be evil."

Why you would want to restrict your character in such a way that forces confrontation, I'll never know.

The idea is you shouldn't have to. I don't think people react appropriately to a lot of stuff that PC's do (shadowform, walking around with god-weapons drawn, having a ravenous apex predator at your side, littering). But then again I guess if players make lore, it's been happening so long that maybe the average citizens are desensitized to it at this point.

"Sorry Marlowe, couldn't make it to the well today, there was a cackling warlock along the path. Then when I tried to go to the market I backed the hell off because one o' them ranger types was walkin' around with a rhino on a leash. Just wait till the afternoon rush wears off, by that point it'll only be naked elves on mailboxes and that'll be a treat for me."
That's just it, really. The NPCs don't react to players. The players react to players, and the majority of players have seen it all.

To force a confrontation out of something so little after so long just seems like bad form, especially in the OP's case.

EDIT: By that I mean especially in the way that the offender harassed the OP.

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