"Roll on a PvE server"

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I love everything about PvP realms. I love ganking, camping, out numbering the other faction.. I also love being camped, getting ganked while questing, and being totally outnumbered to the point where one faction basically owns a zone for a short while.

For me, it adds so much excitement to the game. I know most of you get extremely bored while questing, then you get ganked and suddenly you get a rush. Could be anger filling your body or excitement knowing you parked your main in the area just in case and you can go gank back.

I guess it just reminds me of classic wow and all of the excitement around blackrock mountain or silithus all of the time.

The world PvP has been gone for so long, I'm so happy to have it back.
I could try to reword a previous post by Daxx, but I'll just link it here: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/7320822467?page=5#85

The only thing I'd add to that is something I said over and over during BC when the big complaint was about Halaa: world PvP is not fair. We're not limiting who can do it, or in what amounts, and inherently some people will want to gank lower level players. Of course we later added areas like Wintergrasp and Tol Barad which attempted to balance the sides, but outside of those, world PvP is inherently unfair. Whether factions are imbalanced, or it's just a coward looking to trounce lowbies and run at the sight of an even-leveled player, world PvP is not fair. We've got battlegrounds and arenas if you want matched fights, and you can level almost exclusively in battlegrounds all the way to 90 if you want to, or dungeons for that matter.

The big issue here as I see it is that, and again Daxxarri's post above says it well, PvP realms weren't really proper PvP realms for many years, and now that they are again it's catching people off-guard. That doesn't change that they're working again as PvP realms. In most cases there's a solution to being ganked, whether it's calling on guildies or people from your faction, or escaping and hitting a different zone, BG, or dungeon for a while. We do have policies for very extreme cases when it crosses into [url="https://us.battle.net/support/en/article/player-vs-player-server-policy"]ongoing harassment[/url], but even being camped for hours is something everyone should be prepared for.

As it's been a fact of how PvP servers have worked since launch, it's not too surprising that others will respond with recommendations against being on that type of server if you don't want to accept everything that comes with it.

I like me some BGs, but leveling on PvP servers is just too frustrating. I've tried it, I hate it, and that's ok. It's not going to be for everyone.


Awesome. There you go. Thank you for sticking to the PVP server rules from all these years despite all the complaints. The sense of danger you get leveling on these servers is a wonderful change from PVE servers. It's unforgivable, it's unfair, and it's totally uncaring that you just got your face smashed in by someone 20 levels above you (more, or less). You never have that sense of danger on PVE, having to keep checking behind your back like you do with PVP leveling.
12/12/2012 07:27 PMPosted by Stochastic
As it's been a fact of how PvP servers have worked since launch, it's not too surprising that others will respond with recommendations against being on that type of server if you don't want to accept everything that comes with it.


The thing is, it really *isn't* how PvP servers have worked in practice since launch. For the past 6+ years we have been rolling characters on PvP servers based on the PvP server experience - but with the institution of CRZ, that experience changed dramatically. There is *no way* I'd have created 11 alts on a PvP server if I had known the post-CRZ griefing spree was coming, but alas, they were created when PvP servers were fun and balanced and the griefing was at a moderate level.

Its fine that PvP servers are what they are now for those who desire this newfangled hyper-hardcore environment, but transfers are expensive for a whole server full of alts, and the types of blue responses we are getting make it kinda feel like a cash grab (i.e., working as intended, pay us $200+ to transfer if you don't like the new PvP padagrim). I feel like this would be a whole lot less of an issue if we were offered once off free PvP->PvE transfers for all characters and also guilds as a result of the change; that way only the people who want to be on the new PvP servers will be there and there will be no reason for people to complain about ganking/griefing.


No. You chose the PvP server, you deal with it. Rerolling on a new realm is free of charge. And you carry all your achievements and mounts with you, so it's not like you're losing a whole lot.

The thing is, it really *isn't* how PvP servers have worked in practice since launch


It DOES NOT MATTER. The realms were intended to have fierce (and unfair in many cases) combat. Be on your toes at all times, or be camped. It's the way it should be. Just because it wasn't before, it doesn't mean that it was intended for PvP realms to be the same as PvE realms.

If a certain class was capable of one-shotting people with one spell for 3 years, and suddenly it was balanced with everything else, would you complain and say "please bring back the imbalanced class"? Of course not. The intended design is all that matters. Now PvP realms finally work as intended, and people are finding it doesn't suit them.

That's fine. If that's your case, simply reroll on a PvE realm, transfer, or learn to deal with it.
12/12/2012 07:27 PMPosted by Stochastic
As it's been a fact of how PvP servers have worked since launch, it's not too surprising that others will respond with recommendations against being on that type of server if you don't want to accept everything that comes with it.

The thing is, it really *isn't* how PvP servers have worked in practice since launch. For the past 6+ years we have been rolling characters on PvP servers based on the PvP server experience - but with the institution of CRZ, that experience changed dramatically. There is *no way* I'd have created 11 alts on a PvP server if I had known the post-CRZ griefing spree was coming, but alas, they were created when PvP servers were fun and balanced and the griefing was at a moderate level.

Its fine that PvP servers are what they are now for those who desire this newfangled hyper-hardcore environment, but transfers are expensive for a whole server full of alts, and the types of blue responses we are getting make it kinda feel like a cash grab (i.e., working as intended, pay us $200+ to transfer if you don't like the new PvP padagrim). I feel like this would be a whole lot less of an issue if we were offered once off free PvP->PvE transfers for all characters and also guilds as a result of the change; that way only the people who want to be on the new PvP servers will be there and there will be no reason for people to complain about ganking/griefing.


World PvP has only been dead for a couple of years. Just because you were able to treat a PvP server like a PvE server, doesn't mean that it was intended... just like any other bug or glitch, you took advantage of something that was never intended.

You don't have to spend a dime to reroll.

You don't have to move everyone of your characters.

You have choices, using the "Blizzard is greedy" makes me wish they would call you what you are... and I'm not going to say it either...

>.>
12/12/2012 07:27 PMPosted by Stochastic
As it's been a fact of how PvP servers have worked since launch, it's not too surprising that others will respond with recommendations against being on that type of server if you don't want to accept everything that comes with it.


The thing is, it really *isn't* how PvP servers have worked in practice since launch. For the past 6+ years we have been rolling characters on PvP servers based on the PvP server experience - but with the institution of CRZ, that experience changed dramatically. There is *no way* I'd have created 11 alts on a PvP server if I had known the post-CRZ griefing spree was coming, but alas, they were created when PvP servers were fun and balanced and the griefing was at a moderate level.

Its fine that PvP servers are what they are now for those who desire this newfangled hyper-hardcore environment, but transfers are expensive for a whole server full of alts, and the types of blue responses we are getting make it kinda feel like a cash grab (i.e., working as intended, pay us $200+ to transfer if you don't like the new PvP padagrim). I feel like this would be a whole lot less of an issue if we were offered once off free PvP->PvE transfers for all characters and also guilds as a result of the change; that way only the people who want to be on the new PvP servers will be there and there will be no reason for people to complain about ganking/griefing.


Agree as much as humanly possible.

The issue isn't what they are it's what they've been. Bashiok I'm glad that you're happy with how things are now it's good that the game is what your team envisions it should have been all along. The problem we have is we'd love to switch, but I'm another person with 11 char slots all filled. What a lot of us don't need to hear is you're happy we need to hear you understand us when we say we feel like the playstyle was changed and we're told pay $200+ to be able to play the way we were again. I know it's not extortion (I'm not unreasonable enough to make wild claims like that), but from our position it sure feels close to it.
I could try to reword a previous post by Daxx, but I'll just link it here: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/7320822467?page=5#85

The only thing I'd add to that is something I said over and over during BC when the big complaint was about Halaa: world PvP is not fair. We're not limiting who can do it, or in what amounts, and inherently some people will want to gank lower level players. Of course we later added areas like Wintergrasp and Tol Barad which attempted to balance the sides, but outside of those, world PvP is inherently unfair. Whether factions are imbalanced, or it's just a coward looking to trounce lowbies and run at the sight of an even-leveled player, world PvP is not fair. We've got battlegrounds and arenas if you want matched fights, and you can level almost exclusively in battlegrounds all the way to 90 if you want to, or dungeons for that matter.

The big issue here as I see it is that, and again Daxxarri's post above says it well, PvP realms weren't really proper PvP realms for many years, and now that they are again it's catching people off-guard. That doesn't change that they're working again as PvP realms. In most cases there's a solution to being ganked, whether it's calling on guildies or people from your faction, or escaping and hitting a different zone, BG, or dungeon for a while. We do have policies for very extreme cases when it crosses into [url="https://us.battle.net/support/en/article/player-vs-player-server-policy"]ongoing harassment[/url], but even being camped for hours is something everyone should be prepared for.

As it's been a fact of how PvP servers have worked since launch, it's not too surprising that others will respond with recommendations against being on that type of server if you don't want to accept everything that comes with it.

I like me some BGs, but leveling on PvP servers is just too frustrating. I've tried it, I hate it, and that's ok. It's not going to be for everyone.


So because even though pvp servers are the way they are you unbalanced them with CRZ without offering any compensation for the player base to get off a server...... why is this
It isn't griefing and cross realm zones have nothing to do with this. Give it a rest already. If you played since launch then you would know this is how pvp realms used to be but I have the feeling you are full of it and have no idea what pvp realms used to be like.


It might not technically be griefing, but it sure is in practice. It is certainly possible that I just have rose-coloured glasses on, or that my server's demographic has changed significantly over the years (well, it certainly is alliance heavy now and was horde heavy previously, but I don't feel that it is so unbalanced that it'd make such a huge different). Hell, maybe I'm just getting old. Sure, I didn't play since launch exactly - perhaps the first year of release was different, but if you like I could log in on my characters from vanilla wow.

There was always ganking, it has been part of the game and it was fine - but it has never been this bad, and it really does feel like it is down to CRZ, and that CRZ zones are inhabited not infrequently by people who are only there to ruin the experience of others - griefing.
I play most of my characters on PVE servers. I don't understand why so many people have an aversion to them. They don't make you less of a player. There is nothing wrong with wanting to PVP on your own terms.

But I also have a few characters on PvP servers and I level them just fine. I did a few levels in in Un'Goro on my warlock without getting ganked once. Other days I don't get as lucky. I might find myself getting camped which sucks but can be solved with playing a different character or logging off and coming back in half an hour.
Wasn't Wow only going to allow PVP when you're within 5 levels of your opponent at one time? I want to say it was even in my game manual from the CE.


I recall someone saying that Dishonorable Kills had been in the manual, but then that they scrubbed it in the early stages because it was horrible.


I remember when DKs were actually dishonorable kills rather than the class. I can't remember much about them, but I believe you received a dk from killing non guard faction npcs. They were a pretty heavy penalty... I think? Also don't remember exactly when it was removed from the game.

I did alot of pvp back then, but it's pretty hazy :/ .

Still would be an interesting way to discourage npc camping. Though the impact it would have on city raids and pvp in general... yeah not such a great idea these days.
Anyone else remember the death march that was running to Scarlet Monastery as alliance?

No mount, into hostile territory, running right in front of Undercity....
Oh, and when that Halloween event launched for the first time?

I couldn't even get anywhere near the entrance.
I am so sick of hearing this. There are, what seems like, hundreds of threads these past few weeks complaining about ganking being out of control. These posters make valid points, the response they get 90% of the time? "Roll on a PvE server, baddie."

I really want these morons to understand that a lot of the people complaining about the ganking situation do in fact like PvP, myself included. I like world PvP, BG's, and Arena, however, to me, world PvP is not about one-shotting players 50+ levels lower than yourself. To me, PvP is taking on someone in your level bracket and facing a real challenge.

Being level 20 and being camped by a level 90 is not what a PvP server is for, so telling someone to roll on a PvE server is the stupidest comment one can come up with. Only an inconsiderate, self-loathing moron would think that a PvP server is meant for such a purpose.

Here's an idea. Put up or shut up. If you really need to camp the Dark Portal, or camp low level quest givers to get your jolly's, maybe it is YOU that needs to get off the PvP server because you clearly have ZERO concept of what PvP is supposed to be. If you are so bloody wonderful, get into an Arena team and own!

If you comment saying "Shouldn't be on a PvP server" after reading this, consider your point invalid as I have completely made it clear that saying such a thing warrants no kind of validity and it is nothing more than a moronic comment made by moronic people whose lives are so pathetic that they spend their time attempting to justify their inexcusable, despicable behavior.


I will gladly pay for your transfer to a PVE server and then back to a PVP server when you've maxed out on level and the current season arena PVP gear if Blizzard spends time actually fixing real PVP issues and not worrying about some guy who's shocked that there are internet bullies running around on PVP servers ganking lowbies.

Yes people will run around ganking lowbies thinking they are awesome.. This is basically why they're on PVP servers in the first place. Yes world PVP is never fair.
12/12/2012 05:55 PMPosted by Aedah
There are, what seems like, hundreds of threads these past few weeks complaining about ganking being out of control.


how much control do you need? the one distinguishing characteristic of a pvp server vs a pve server is the presence of ganking. Nothing else is really any different.

As opposed to vanilla or burning crusade, you don't actually need to run to dungeons to run them, or BGs for that matter. It's not like you're being steamrolled while you try to get in scarlet monastery or deadmines. And you don't need to actually travel to the BG master to queue up.

There are more controls than ever before to allow you to avoid being ganked. So you certainly don't need to roll PVE, just stop going outside.

I personally haven't understood the appeal of pvp servers since vanilla. Like... before battlegrounds existed.
Can't new players read? Is that such an unreasonable expectation nowadays?


Last I checked on the realm there is no actual warning or wall of text telling you so now I'll admit that's from memory so when I see it I'll rescind it. Still let's not resort to insults unlike Xanzul here.
12/12/2012 07:23 PMPosted by Xanzül
I'm not the one complaining about pvp on pvp realms.


Neither am I.

Dude, this is a genuine sentiment, no BS; you are actively seeking out conflict and creating tension where constructive discourse is needed. Attacking people with intellect is still attacking people.

The hostility you're engendering doesn't promote change.
12/12/2012 07:33 PMPosted by Stormheals


The thing is, it really *isn't* how PvP servers have worked in practice since launch. For the past 6+ years we have been rolling characters on PvP servers based on the PvP server experience - but with the institution of CRZ, that experience changed dramatically. There is *no way* I'd have created 11 alts on a PvP server if I had known the post-CRZ griefing spree was coming, but alas, they were created when PvP servers were fun and balanced and the griefing was at a moderate level.

Its fine that PvP servers are what they are now for those who desire this newfangled hyper-hardcore environment, but transfers are expensive for a whole server full of alts, and the types of blue responses we are getting make it kinda feel like a cash grab (i.e., working as intended, pay us $200+ to transfer if you don't like the new PvP padagrim). I feel like this would be a whole lot less of an issue if we were offered once off free PvP->PvE transfers for all characters and also guilds as a result of the change; that way only the people who want to be on the new PvP servers will be there and there will be no reason for people to complain about ganking/griefing.


Agree as much as humanly possible.

The issue isn't what they are it's what they've been. Bashiok I'm glad that you're happy with how things are now it's good that the game is what your team envisions it should have been all along. The problem we have is we'd love to switch, but I'm another person with 11 char slots all filled. What a lot of us don't need to hear is you're happy we need to hear you understand us when we say we feel like the playstyle was changed and we're told pay $200+ to be able to play the way we were again. I know it's not extortion (I'm not unreasonable enough to make wild claims like that), but from our position it sure feels close to it.


Just because the population has been too low for you to see it, doesn't change the fact that this is how pvp servers have always been.
Ok you guys dont understand and that is fine. The point that is trying to be made here is as such;

Players are getting ganked by 90s and that's fine. You fly over see a lower level, you kill them and you fly off to go about your business. You may see them again and kill them again, once or twice more.

Although the issue is that people are not leaving it at this level, what is happening is. a level 90 sees a guy who is 50ish levels lower than him. Then this level 90 proceeds to kills him, over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again 20, 30 times. This is excessive and does nothing but completely ruin the leveling experience for people.

The only true way to get to 90 in a reasonable amount of time is to grind dungeons, or roll PvE. The issue comes down to I want to experience leveling and PvP. I have nothing wrong with world PvP, I was a vanilla player and I remember the old days. Ganking happened in vanilla too, but not to the extent is is happening now.

The only reason I'm writing this post now is because I have seen a 2minute respawn timer myself for the past 20 minutes because some 90 mage with no gear is sitting on my corpse. lol, kill me once, twice, three, hell even four times but move on. I give you nothing, all you do is put me off playing the game for nothing.

TL;DR I thoroughly enjoy world PvP but Camping someones corpse that is 50 level lower than you for 2 hours is excessive. Kill them 3-5 times if you must and move on.
From someone who doesn't play on a pvp server, it sounds like them making your rage quit the server is them winning.

That's the point, to kill the opposing force.

How do people still not understand what a pvp server is about?
12/12/2012 05:55 PMPosted by Aedah
I am so sick of hearing this


So why post another thread on the same topic...its like beating a dead horse.

PVP -> Player versus Player

The human mind loves revenge and success. If you cant place your own vendetta on the person who just killed you and your cop-out is to complain on the forums because you got PKed on a PVP server then all I see all complaints deemed irrelevant.

Dont have a character of the same lvl? then look for people in the area or go to town to get other players to kill the other faction. Quest in groups so others have witness. If you truly enjoy world pvp then you wouldnt have made this thread.
I could try to reword a previous post by Daxx, but I'll just link it here: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/7320822467?page=5#85

The only thing I'd add to that is something I said over and over during BC when the big complaint was about Halaa: world PvP is not fair. We're not limiting who can do it, or in what amounts, and inherently some people will want to gank lower level players. Of course we later added areas like Wintergrasp and Tol Barad which attempted to balance the sides, but outside of those, world PvP is inherently unfair. Whether factions are imbalanced, or it's just a coward looking to trounce lowbies and run at the sight of an even-leveled player, world PvP is not fair. We've got battlegrounds and arenas if you want matched fights, and you can level almost exclusively in battlegrounds all the way to 90 if you want to, or dungeons for that matter.

The big issue here as I see it is that, and again Daxxarri's post above says it well, PvP realms weren't really proper PvP realms for many years, and now that they are again it's catching people off-guard. That doesn't change that they're working again as PvP realms. In most cases there's a solution to being ganked, whether it's calling on guildies or people from your faction, or escaping and hitting a different zone, BG, or dungeon for a while. We do have policies for very extreme cases when it crosses into [url="https://us.battle.net/support/en/article/player-vs-player-server-policy"]ongoing harassment[/url], but even being camped for hours is something everyone should be prepared for.

As it's been a fact of how PvP servers have worked since launch, it's not too surprising that others will respond with recommendations against being on that type of server if you don't want to accept everything that comes with it.

I like me some BGs, but leveling on PvP servers is just too frustrating. I've tried it, I hate it, and that's ok. It's not going to be for everyone.

+1. Thank you.

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