Change to t15 Ret 4p thoughts?

Paladin
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The Retribution 4pc set bonus has changed. It now has a chance for Hammer of the Righteous or Crusader Strike to cause your next Divine Storm to cause extra damage to your target. The idea being that you might swap from TV to DS when you get the proc, so that the RNG is something you can actually do something with rather than it just being RNG for extra damage.

Used to be CS had chance to cause TV to deal ALL holy damage.

"might swap from TV to DS" -- Single target, TV, two or more targets DS, what is their idea of the ideal time to swap when you get proc?
Also, how much is extra damage? Enough to swap to DS in single target when you get the proc?
Really poor wording so just assuming that they're swapping out Templar's Verdict for Divine Storm and adding Hammer of the Righteousness. So something like

Your Crusader Strike or Hammer of the Righteous has a 40% chance to make your next T̶e̶m̶p̶l̶a̶r̶'̶s̶ ̶V̶e̶r̶d̶i̶c̶t̶ Divine Storm deal all Holy damage.


Seems awful for a 4P Bonus, unless there's more to it, but "might swap from TV to DS" doesn't sound very promising. I agree that Retribution can use an AE buff, but it's not worth it at the price of single-target damage.

What I'd personally like to see is

Your Crusader Strike or Hammer of the Righteous has a 40% chance to make your next Divine Storm or Templar's Verdict deal all Holy damage.
First off, Divine Storm deals all Holy Damage anyway.

Provided the 4p provides a DPS increase when using DS over TV on a single target, the bonus is pretty good then. I mean, it's both an AoE and single target increase then, instead of a single target one.
why not just use the tier 10 bonus again, and make divine storm no longer cost holy power?

now thats a 4pc bonus i'd like.


Then all we would do is spam DS?
I'm really curious how they plan on handling the ui to alert the ret to the proc.

The TV modification seemed far more interesting.
I'm going to make my 1st post in a long time. 1st off i'm REALLY unhappy with this change to where i might be forced to bench my pally in favor of my DK if something is not done about the GARBAGE 4 piece Set bouns.

WHY in gods name would a pally ever use Divine Storm Single Target EVEN if it does all holy damage.

Instead of using TV which does 300% damage. Simple you would'nt only a idoit would use DS over TV unless you mis-clicked.

If this Set bouns does not change not only will i have to bench my pally from rading since i've started playing WoW 4 years ago but, I might also consider un-subbing from WoW as well.

Also on another note T15 is the worst looking tier set in the history of paladins thank god I can transmog to not look like a overgrown fish.
01/15/2013 11:02 AMPosted by Mikeangel
WHY in gods name would a pally ever use Divine Storm Single Target EVEN if it does all holy damage.

Because you got a proc from your set bonus which causes it to deal significant extra damage to the target. The change isn't just swapping TV for DS; DS already does all holy damage. It adds actual extra damage to DS (with a lightning strike graphic, supposedly).

That said, I'm not terribly excited about this set bonus. Seems pretty clunky, and contrary to existing design principles.
WHY in gods name would a pally ever use Divine Storm Single Target EVEN if it does all holy damage.

Instead of using TV which does 300% damage. Simple you would'nt only a idoit would use DS over TV unless you mis-clicked.


Divine Storm already does holy damage, and until we get specifics (proc rate, damage increase, does it do increased damage to all enemies or only your target, etc. etc.) we won't be able to say whether or not it's a terrible bonus. It could be a very good set bonus that spices up our rotation a little bit.
It sounds like an extremely clumsy way of shoehorning some cleave into our ability priorities.
According to GC:

New Ret 4pc reads in totality (i.e. there is no mention of Templar's Verdict): "Your Crusader Strike and Hammer of the Righteous have a X% chance to cause your next Divine Storm to also strike its primary target with a Lightning Bolt for Y Nature damage." Y is about a Templar's Verdict.

So it sounds like the set bonus proc does the same damage as TV would, which means it gives you Divine Storm+TV at the same time, basically. It sounds pretty cool.
Still, I dont like having to target an aoe ability, and bonus Nature damage doesnt mesh well.
Just posted a few minutes ago:
Paladin
- New Ret 4pc reads in totality (i.e. there is no mention of Templar's Verdict): "Your Crusader Strike and Hammer of the Righteous have a X% chance to cause your next Divine Storm to also strike its primary target with a Lightning Bolt for Y Nature damage." Y is about a Templar's Verdict.

edit: oh, I got scooped :)
01/15/2013 11:14 AMPosted by Paladinchaz
Still, I dont like having to target an aoe ability, and bonus Nature damage doesnt mesh well.

Using Divine Storm is no different than using TV, though. One just happens to be an AoE. As long as you have both keybound (and you should), it's just a matter of training yourself to hit DS's button instead of TV's when the bonus procs.
Using Divine Storm is no different than using TV, though. One just happens to be an AoE. As long as you have both keybound (and you should), it's just a matter of training yourself to hit DS's button instead of TV's when the bonus procs.


Thats not the point though, targeted aoe is as bad as HOTR is currently. Also what if you're not in a cleave fight? Wasted bonus if the DS proc doesnt hit harder than TV, I'll just TV, and when I get the proc I'm not just going to blindly spam aoe if there is CC and whatnot about

It enforces a play style they've been trying to dissuade since they took Divine Storm and made it a finisher
Time to rename my pally to thor, thoret, or even better wtfiswrongwiththisgay4tiersetblizz?
01/15/2013 11:23 AMPosted by Paladinchaz
Thats not the point though, targeted aoe is as bad as HOTR is currently. Also what if you're not in a cleave fight? Wasted bonus if the DS proc doesnt hit harder than TV, I'll just TV, and when I get the proc I'm not just going to blindly spam aoe if there is CC and whatnot about

Divine Storm isn't targeted like HotR, though. I assume it just casts the Lightning Strike on your current target.

And if the DS proc hits as hard as TV as GC suggests, the Divine Storm is basically free damage.
The proc alone supposedly hits about as hard as TV, so for single-target, the proc is worth as much damage as a DS (TV vs DS+TV). Which is... not terribly exciting, unless the proc rate is REALLY high, in which case we'd be back to spamming DS all the time.

*sigh*
Divine Storm isn't targeted like HotR, though. I assume it just casts the Lightning Strike on your current target.


With this proc it will, in essence, be targeted like HoTR, and what if you're using DS while not targeting something for some reason?

I dont like having to use an AOE ability to get optimal single target DPS. It was terrible in Wrath.
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